Joining the Union, IATSE

[SalvatoreDelorean]

So in about a year I'll have enough experience working at a small university theater to get myself onto the entry-level dispatch list for my local IATSE hall. At this point, I think union membership might be a good move, but I still can't quite wrap my head around how these institutions actually work. I've tried to get in touch with my local hall with little success, and I found a few other IA-related posts that didn't quite answer all of my questions, so I was hoping someone with experience might be able to give me a few answers (especially anyone who's worked with Local 15).

How do calls work? Do theaters and production companies really staff their events by calling a union hall and getting a few dozen random stagehands to work on a day-to-day basis? I understand how that works for plumbers and carpenters but I'm not sure how repertory or regional theaters could use that system for anything besides load-ins. What do union theaters do when they need people to work for entire runs of shows, like programmers or board ops or shop carpenters? How does union membership translate into long-term work? If I stick with the IATSE as a career, will I be running out to random calls on short notice and at weird times when I'm 40? How does hiring for tours work?

I'm also curious about the process of actually joining. For my Local, after three years of professional theater work and passing a basic theater skills test, you can qualify for the overhire ("F") list, but they're fairly cagey about actually becoming a member. Is it reasonable to assume that as a person with no connections in the union, after a year or so of good, hard work on the F list, I would be invited to get a card?

And finally, I'm just curious to hear from anyone who's been there what it's like. Is it worth it? What's working on the A list like? Are there any potential drawbacks down the road (especially if looking for non-union employment)? Do you gain a lot of valuable, on-the-job experience working on the lower levels of the union, or is it mostly manual labor until you rise through the ranks?

I know that's a lot of questions, but any information or insight anyone can give me would be extremely appreciated.
Thanks!
-Sal

[mstaylor]

So in about a year I'll have enough experience working at a small university theater to get myself onto the entry-level dispatch list for my local IATSE hall. At this point, I think union membership might be a good move, but I still can't quite wrap my head around how these institutions actually work. I've tried to get in touch with my local hall with little success, and I found a few other IA-related posts that didn't quite answer all of my questions, so I was hoping someone with experience might be able to give me a few answers (especially anyone who's worked with Local 15).

How do calls work? Do theaters and production companies really staff their events by calling a union hall and getting a few dozen random stagehands to work on a day-to-day basis? I understand how that works for plumbers and carpenters but I'm not sure how repertory or regional theaters could use that system for anything besides load-ins. What do union theaters do when they need people to work for entire runs of shows, like programmers or board ops or shop carpenters? How does union membership translate into long-term work? If I stick with the IATSE as a career, will I be running out to random calls on short notice and at weird times when I'm 40? How does hiring for tours work?

I'm also curious about the process of actually joining. For my Local, after three years of professional theater work and passing a basic theater skills test, you can qualify for the overhire ("F") list, but they're fairly cagey about actually becoming a member. Is it reasonable to assume that as a person with no connections in the union, after a year or so of good, hard work on the F list, I would be invited to get a card?

And finally, I'm just curious to hear from anyone who's been there what it's like. Is it worth it? What's working on the A list like? Are there any potential drawbacks down the road (especially if looking for non-union employment)? Do you gain a lot of valuable, on-the-job experience working on the lower levels of the union, or is it mostly manual labor until you rise through the ranks?

I know that's a lot of questions, but any information or insight anyone can give me would be extremely appreciated.
Thanks!
-Sal

Every local is a little different in how you get overhire calls, membership, etc. Depending on the area there may be local sound, light and scenic companies that hire employees permanently but will get extra help from the local. Many times by doing well in these cases get you a regular job. The same applies to house or tour gigs.
To join or not to join has caused more than one heated discussion here. To me, it depends on your area. In my area, the closest local is two hours away and not enough work closer to bring the union in. I do D list with 22 when things are really busy. To be honest, it has become mostly inaugurals every four years but I have done other stuff too.

[jerkyspace]

I.A.T.S.E. can be good or bad for you, it all depends on where you are and who is running the Local. The Business Manager and Agents who book your calls and what type of Hiring Hall they are running make a great deal of difference. The past decade has seen an interesting and maybe disturbing trend from the Locals and The International: different TYPES of Hiring Halls. You can be working for an EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall or a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall these days and the International Office/President (NYC) repeatedly has told members of the labor organization that "It is the Long standing policy of the International not to create or otherwise get involved in the referral practices for local unions, each local union is an autonomous body and exercises complete control over its referral and seniority rules".

Many people are unaware of this key change and how it affects their rights within their local "labor organization". MOST IMPORTANTLY this will determine whether your "hiring hall" will be subject to overview from the National Labor Relations Board, in the form of the protections found in the National Labor Relations Act, which include among many rights : Protection of a wide range activities that promote Organization and Collective Bargaining, a Duty of Fair Representation, Referral calls based on written objective hiring criteria, Protection from Unfair Labor Practices etc.

I.A.T.S.E. openly embraces the Labor Management Reporting & Disclosure Act on their website,
IATSE International
this is what their Union Bill of Rights comes from. This is similar to the NLRA in that it promotes and protects unions and union workers by protecting Equal Rights, Freedom of Speech and Assembly, Dues/Initiation Fees/Assessments, Protection of the Right to Sue and Safeguards Against improper Disciplinary Action. But the KEY difference is that in order to protect your rights under the LMRDA you must essentially sue in court to protect your rights (whether any harassment issues are involved with other agencies) which can be very expensive and difficult to do when your labor organization has failed to represent you properly. BUT, the National Labor Relations Act is under attack and it is coming from the I.A.T.S.E. legal counsel that has been helping certain Locals find a way out of their Duty of Fair Representation all together. These are the NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Halls like Local 16 I.A.T.S.E in San Francisco, who has AGGRESSIVELY fought against the NLRB and forced legal opinion to grant them this status of NON-Exclusive Hiring Hall.
http://mynlrb.nlrb.gov/link/document...031d458004998d

These I.A.T.S.E. Locals who operate as Non-Exclusive Halls owe you NO Duty of Fair Representation and DO NOT have to publish ANY hiring hall rules nor have to explain their hiring decisions with any written objective criteria. This did not come about as a policy that the members of the labor organization decided upon and voted for. It has been the Business Manager and their agents who have driven this while being challenged by multiple members of the labor organization who felt they were not treated fairly. They tried to seek remedies within the Local but when those failed they sought help with the NLRB. They may have had very strong evidence that their Local did not treat them fairly, but in the end it does not matter at the NLRB (which is free and you can file yourself with no lawyer). If your Local is a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall then they are OFF THE HOOK with the NLRB. You could still sue on the LMRDA issues, which overlap to some extent but the "legal trick" here that seems to harm the whole idea of having a "union" protect such rights, allows these locals to get away with actions that would cause them to be in a great deal of legal trouble with the NLRB under the NLRA and diminish any attempts to litigate against them. The International WILL NOT step in in any way to help you.

So ask yourself: would you join a "labor organization" that feels it DOES NOT owe you ANY Duty of Fair Representation under the National Labor Relations Act nor any of the other protections guaranteed within? Would you join up and pay work fees to these people who feel that they do not have to explain their Hiring Hall Rules in any written objective manner? If something happens with an employer and the labor organization decides to "throw you under the bus" to protect themselves, you will have little to no protection nor remedies, the I.A.T.S.E. constitution does not hold much weight when a Non-Exclusive Hiring Hall decides to blacklist people and stop giving them work. The International is VERY UNLIKELY to step in to help in any way. You can go to the NLRB but they can do almost nothing unless you can prove your Hall is acting like an Exclusive Hall but trying to use the NON-EXCLUSIVE arguments to protect themselves from litigation (and giving you a Duty of Fair Representation under the Law).

Check out the "Hiring Hall" before you decide to even get in touch with them. Does their website post their Objective Hiring Hall Rules online? Will they be upfront and tell you what type of hall they run and how they do it? Check with the NLRB and see if there have been a lot of complaints filed against this Local or not:

NLRB Search for Labor Organization
http://www.nlrb.gov/search/advanced/all?clear=1
http://www.nlrb.gov/search/advanced/...ype%3A(C OR R) (local 16 San Francisco example)

Union Facts:
http://www.unionfacts.com/union/Stag...ture_Operators
http://www.unionfacts.com/lu/4262/IATSE/16 (Local 16 San Francisco example)
(see unfair labor practices and other organization information)

Here is a example of a NON-EXCLUSIVE HALL's "hiring hall rules":
IATSE Local 16 Web Page
I. A. T. S. E. Local 16 RESUME DISCLAIMER
If you are submitting a resume to Local 16, please include the following:
Full legal name
Current address with zip code
Current phone number with area code
Current pager number with area code (if applicable)
Current cell phone number with area code (if applicable)
A list of your technical skills
A list of prior experience in the entertainment field
A list of references with names, relationship and contact information

Local 16 collects resumes from experienced technicians in the entertainment fields for possible referal to our signature employers. By collecting resumes Local 16 makes no promise of employment, but rather, as a service to our employers, will review resume submissions.
Local 16 will keep your resume on file for 6 months. If you have not been referred to an employer within 6 months of submitting your resume, you may, if you wish, resubmit your resume.
After submitting your resume you may be asked by Local 16 to attend an orientation meeting. This meeting is for informational purposes only and does not imply that Local 16 will refer any technician to an employer. At this meeting you may be asked to take an exam to demonstrate your competency in the crafts represented by Local 16. The results of this test influence the circumstances under which Local 16 will refer you to an employer.
At such time as Local 16 is unable to fulfill an employer=s request for labor with the technicians it currently represents, Local 16 may review its resume collection and refer candidates based on the skills listed in their resume, experience in the field, and upon favorable references. The employer or its representative will inform Local 16 of the qualifications of new referrals and, upon a favorable review, Local 16 will continue to refer that technician to future jobs.
Should the employer or its representative inform Local 16 that the referred technician did not possess the required skills, Local 16 is then under no obligation to refer that technician in the future.
Local 16 may infer from resumes that a technician possesses skills related to the primary skills listed on the resume, and may refer that technician to such jobs if the above criteria is in place. Candidates are free to decline any reference for employment, but are informed that they might not be called again if they have declined a referral."

Now here you can find links to the MANY EXCLUSIVE Hiring Halls in I.A.T.S.E or go search for the few NON-Exclusive ones (that don't advertise this obviously):
IATSE International
Local 1
Local 2
Local 4
Local 7
Local 10
Local 11
Local 46
Local 93
Local 115
Local 470
Local 500
Local 720
etc...

and Local 122 San Diego proudly displays The Duty of Fair Representation right here:
http://www.iatse122.org/index.cfm?zo...20Your20Rights

Well you get the point...it is not clearly "labeled" as such with most, but there are a MAJORITY of EXCLUSIVE HIRING HALLS in I.A.T.S.E. that offer "members" of the Labor Organization protection under both the Labor Management Reporting and Disclosure Act AND the National Labor Relations Act. They publish their very objective Hiring Hall Rules and Regulations for all to see online. But, Local 16 I.A.T.S.E. San Francisco is classified as NON-EXCLUSIVE (for now), and does NOT owe "members" of the Labor Organization ANY Duty of Fair Representation. The International NYC Office/President has no problem with this so it is up to you whether you want to enter into this kind of arrangement with this type of hiring hall. These type of halls tend to benefit those who are very friendly to the Office, Officers and Agents and /or are related to them or someone else in the local in some way. For better or worse it is easy to see how a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall would be wide open to abusive and biased Referral Call procedures that the office does not have to explain to anyone.

Do you know whether your I.A.T.S.E. Hiring Hall is NON-EXCLUSIVE or EXCLUSIVE?
Does this even make sense to have two different types within the same Intentional Organization?
Its up to you and the members of your local labor organization to help determine this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa..._Relations_Act (NLRA/National Labor Relations Board)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_M...Disclosure_Act (LMRDA/Department of Labor)
http://www.iatse-intl.org/organizing/us_billrights.html (IATSE LMRDA)
http://www.iatse-intl.org/organizing/us_relact.html (IATSE refers to some of the NLRA on the International site)

[Footer]

I.A.T.S.E. can be good or bad for you, it all depends on where you are and who is running the Local. The Business Manager and Agents who book your calls and what type of Hiring Hall they are running make a great deal of difference. The past decade has seen an interesting and maybe disturbing trend from the Locals and The International: different TYPES of Hiring Halls. You can be working for an EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall or a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall these days and the International Office/President (NYC) repeatedly has told members of the labor organization that "It is the Long standing policy of the International not to create or otherwise get involved in the referral practices for local unions, each local union is an autonomous body and exercises complete control over its referral and seniority rules".

Many people are unaware of this key change and how it affects their rights within their local "labor organization". MOST IMPORTANTLY this will determine whether your "hiring hall" will be subject to overview from the National Labor Relations Board, in the form of the protections found in the National Labor Relations Act, which include among many rights : Protection of a wide range activities that promote Organization and Collective Bargaining, a Duty of Fair Representation, Referral calls based on written objective hiring criteria, Protection from Unfair Labor Practices etc.

I.A.T.S.E. openly embraces the Labor Management Reporting & Disclosure Act on their website,
IATSE International
this is what their Union Bill of Rights comes from. This is similar to the NLRA in that it promotes and protects unions and union workers by protecting Equal Rights, Freedom of Speech and Assembly, Dues/Initiation Fees/Assessments, Protection of the Right to Sue and Safeguards Against improper Disciplinary Action. But the KEY difference is that in order to protect your rights under the LMRDA you must essentially sue in court to protect your rights (whether any harassment issues are involved with other agencies) which can be very expensive and difficult to do when your labor organization has failed to represent you properly. BUT, the National Labor Relations Act is under attack and it is coming from the I.A.T.S.E. legal counsel that has been helping certain Locals find a way out of their Duty of Fair Representation all together. These are the NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Halls like Local 16 I.A.T.S.E in San Francisco, who has AGGRESSIVELY fought against the NLRB and forced legal opinion to grant them this status of NON-Exclusive Hiring Hall.
http://mynlrb.nlrb.gov/link/document...031d458004998d

These I.A.T.S.E. Locals who operate as Non-Exclusive Halls owe you NO Duty of Fair Representation and DO NOT have to publish ANY hiring hall rules nor have to explain their hiring decisions with any written objective criteria. This did not come about as a policy that the members of the labor organization decided upon and voted for. It has been the Business Manager and their agents who have driven this while being challenged by multiple members of the labor organization who felt they were not treated fairly. They tried to seek remedies within the Local but when those failed they sought help with the NLRB. They may have had very strong evidence that their Local did not treat them fairly, but in the end it does not matter at the NLRB (which is free and you can file yourself with no lawyer). If your Local is a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall then they are OFF THE HOOK with the NLRB. You could still sue on the LMRDA issues, which overlap to some extent but the "legal trick" here that seems to harm the whole idea of having a "union" protect such rights, allows these locals to get away with actions that would cause them to be in a great deal of legal trouble with the NLRB under the NLRA and diminish any attempts to litigate against them. The International WILL NOT step in in any way to help you.

So ask yourself: would you join a "labor organization" that feels it DOES NOT owe you ANY Duty of Fair Representation under the National Labor Relations Act nor any of the other protections guaranteed within? Would you join up and pay work fees to these people who feel that they do not have to explain their Hiring Hall Rules in any written objective manner? If something happens with an employer and the labor organization decides to "throw you under the bus" to protect themselves, you will have little to no protection nor remedies, the I.A.T.S.E. constitution does not hold much weight when a Non-Exclusive Hiring Hall decides to blacklist people and stop giving them work. The International is VERY UNLIKELY to step in to help in any way. You can go to the NLRB but they can do almost nothing unless you can prove your Hall is acting like an Exclusive Hall but trying to use the NON-EXCLUSIVE arguments to protect themselves from litigation (and giving you a Duty of Fair Representation under the Law).

Check out the "Hiring Hall" before you decide to even get in touch with them. Does their website post their Objective Hiring Hall Rules online? Will they be upfront and tell you what type of hall they run and how they do it? Check with the NLRB and see if there have been a lot of complaints filed against this Local or not:

NLRB Search for Labor Organization
Search | NLRB
http://www.nlrb.gov/search/advanced/...ype%3A(C OR R) (local 16 San Francisco example)

Union Facts:
Union Facts: Stage & Picture Operators (IATSE) Profile, Membership, Leaders, Political Operations, etc.
Union Facts: Stage & Picture Operators 16 Profile, Membership, Leaders, Political Operations, etc. (Local 16 San Francisco example)
(see unfair labor practices and other organization information)

Here is a example of a NON-EXCLUSIVE HALL's "hiring hall rules":
IATSE Local 16 Web Page
I. A. T. S. E. Local 16 RESUME DISCLAIMER
If you are submitting a resume to Local 16, please include the following:
Full legal name
Current address with zip code
Current phone number with area code
Current pager number with area code (if applicable)
Current cell phone number with area code (if applicable)
A list of your technical skills
A list of prior experience in the entertainment field
A list of references with names, relationship and contact information

Local 16 collects resumes from experienced technicians in the entertainment fields for possible referal to our signature employers. By collecting resumes Local 16 makes no promise of employment, but rather, as a service to our employers, will review resume submissions.
Local 16 will keep your resume on file for 6 months. If you have not been referred to an employer within 6 months of submitting your resume, you may, if you wish, resubmit your resume.
After submitting your resume you may be asked by Local 16 to attend an orientation meeting. This meeting is for informational purposes only and does not imply that Local 16 will refer any technician to an employer. At this meeting you may be asked to take an exam to demonstrate your competency in the crafts represented by Local 16. The results of this test influence the circumstances under which Local 16 will refer you to an employer.
At such time as Local 16 is unable to fulfill an employer=s request for labor with the technicians it currently represents, Local 16 may review its resume collection and refer candidates based on the skills listed in their resume, experience in the field, and upon favorable references. The employer or its representative will inform Local 16 of the qualifications of new referrals and, upon a favorable review, Local 16 will continue to refer that technician to future jobs.
Should the employer or its representative inform Local 16 that the referred technician did not possess the required skills, Local 16 is then under no obligation to refer that technician in the future.
Local 16 may infer from resumes that a technician possesses skills related to the primary skills listed on the resume, and may refer that technician to such jobs if the above criteria is in place. Candidates are free to decline any reference for employment, but are informed that they might not be called again if they have declined a referral."

Now here you can find links to the MANY EXCLUSIVE Hiring Halls in I.A.T.S.E or go search for the few NON-Exclusive ones (that don't advertise this obviously):
IATSE International
Local 1
Local 2
Local 4
Local 7
Local 10
Local 11
Local 46
Local 93
Local 115
Local 470
Local 500
Local 720
etc...

and Local 122 San Diego proudly displays The Duty of Fair Representation right here:
IATSE Local 122 - San Diego, CA

Well you get the point...it is not clearly "labeled" as such with most, but there are a MAJORITY of EXCLUSIVE HIRING HALLS in I.A.T.S.E. that offer "members" of the Labor Organization protection under both the Labor Management Reporting and Disclosure Act AND the National Labor Relations Act. They publish their very objective Hiring Hall Rules and Regulations for all to see online. But, Local 16 I.A.T.S.E. San Francisco is classified as NON-EXCLUSIVE (for now), and does NOT owe "members" of the Labor Organization ANY Duty of Fair Representation. The International NYC Office/President has no problem with this so it is up to you whether you want to enter into this kind of arrangement with this type of hiring hall. These type of halls tend to benefit those who are very friendly to the Office, Officers and Agents and /or are related to them or someone else in the local in some way. For better or worse it is easy to see how a NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall would be wide open to abusive and biased Referral Call procedures that the office does not have to explain to anyone.

Do you know whether your I.A.T.S.E. Hiring Hall is NON-EXCLUSIVE or EXCLUSIVE?
Does this even make sense to have two different types within the same Intentional Organization?
Its up to you and the members of your local labor organization to help determine this.

National Labor Relations Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (NLRA/National Labor Relations Board)
Labor Management Reporting and Disclosure Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (LMRDA/Department of Labor)
IATSE International (IATSE LMRDA)
IATSE International (IATSE refers to some of the NLRA on the International site)

Most IA halls I have worked with work something like this...

Who is your dad?
Who is your cousin?
Who is your uncle?
Who is your fishing buddy?

If none of those people are members of the union, you won't be getting a call unless U2 is coming to town.

I don't think this is a surprise to most people. Sorry you got blacklisted from the local. The thing you have to remember is IA is treated as a labor company in most regions vs an actual union. It sucks, but its reality in most regions.

[ruinexplorer]

jerkeyspace, welcome to the Booth. I'm sorry to hear that you had a bad experience with the union. It is difficult when you end up being blacklisted. I hope that you will find your way.

While I do not necessarily share the same sentiments about the union as the last two posts, I do heartily agree that you need to be informed. To learn a bit more about the issue of Exclusive and Non-Exclusive hiring practices, you can read more about it here.

Business Agents often have thankless jobs. They generally get requests from employers for labor sometimes as little as 48 hours prior to a call. The BA may not always have the greatest amount of time to methodically go through the call list and hire in the most "ethical" means due to time constraints. They often will be required to call those who have been most dependable in taking calls and are known to have the skills necessary. So, sometimes you have to play the "game" of getting to know who will be giving you work. No, this is not an easy task, especially if you are not a sworn member, but someone who is on the non-member call list.

When you have a bad experience, the best way to handle that is through positive conversation. If you are hot-headed and angry at how things have happened and you let that come out in your conversation, you will not be helping your case. If however, you take the time to speak with the BA rationally, you may end up getting more calls (depending on how they staff). Even then, you may not like their answer, but you are at least not shooting yourself in the foot.

[jerkyspace]

Thank you. I always find my way...and I always seem to uncover the "bugs" nobody else wants to fix or deal with (both on the gig and in life). While it has not been pleasant nor easy, I am very happy to not have wasted several thousand hard earned dollars and any more time to become a journeyman member of Local 16 in San Francisco. I would not feel comfortable paying dues to a labor organization who does not feel that the Duty of Fair Representation nor any part of the National Labor Relations Act applies to them. Again, this is the apparent beauty of living in a "free" country. Those who can benefit from the crony halls, more power to them and good for them. But, this is the 21st century and its becoming time that the International at least "own up" and make it clear which halls are EXCLUSIVE and which are NOT. I really wish I knew before I walked away from a very successful and busy freelance career. People can make their own choices about what is best for their needs, and those within those halls can use their internal power to make change if they think they need to. I think it is a problem to run the two opposing types under one roof and share the C&B between them under the same name of IATSE. Denver Local 7, Vegas Local 720 and Memphis Local 46 have all found out the hard way from the NLRB that they can't run the crony ways anymore like they used to.

"Business Agents often have thankless jobs. They generally get requests from employers for labor sometimes as little as 48 hours prior to a call. The BA may not always have the greatest amount of time to methodically go through the call list and hire in the most "ethical" means due to time constraints. They often will be required to call those who have been most dependable in taking calls and are known to have the skills necessary. So, sometimes you have to play the "game" of getting to know who will be giving you work. No, this is not an easy task, especially if you are not a sworn member, but someone who is on the non-member call list. "

I agree it is not easy, but it is a steady job with a great deal of freedom and power...plus no load-in nor load-out. That is the nature of our business, but that is never any excuse to violate the law nor someones rights and to do it repeatedly. Sure an agent might have to make a quick call, but that is why many Locals have written and objective referral criteria (as realistically possible in show biz). Whatever happens, it is reality that there won't always be a chance to do everything exactly by the written rules (or whatever your hiring hall uses to decide), and an "honest" Local/agent would hopefully do the right thing. In a good Local you get taken care of one way or the other. BUT, abuses like these are the problem:

favorable bookings to individuals or groups based on friendship and or relationship to other members while discriminating against all others not in this group,
failing to process grievances and give fair and timely hearings,
failing to give written notice of grievances,
failure to notify member of the labor organization of employer grievances,
failure to inform in writing members of the labor organization that employers have made "do not requests" for them in writing and that they have lost work,
reporting employer grievances (and keeping the member in the dark), to outside agencies like the National Labor Relations Board and the Department of Industrial Relations in order "smear" the character of the member of the labor organization and help to defeat their ongoing case against the Local and employer,
assisting an employer (written testimony) in their defense against a member of the labor organization,
trying to tell the member of the labor organization that they are NOT a "member" because they are not a Journeyman (Journeyman is a classification...if you work under a Collective Bargaining Agreement then you ARE a MEMBER of the Labor Organization...maybe just a "permit or overhire" worker but a MEMBER with regards to the NLRA and the LMRDA),
refusal to give the member of the labor organization a copy of the International Constitution & ByLaws,
refusal to give the member a copy of the hiring hall rules (however vague and contradictory they may be),
reducing the quantity and quality of the referral calls of members of the labor organization who challenge the local outside with the DIR, NLRB, State or Federal Court (after the required 4 month internal remedy route has failed),
not referring the member of the labor organization to any calls in retaliation for challenging the Local and Agents in ANY way (especially with the NLRB),
refusal to explain the sudden loss of work due to this type of blacklisting,
refusal by the international organization to protect/enforce the C&B and investigate the Local who has been abusing it.
The C&B Local and International says no Blacklisting, but if your Local won't investigate and head office (NYC) won't then the C&B isn't being put to use.

In cases like these it does not matter how much favor the member of the labor organization has, it does not matter how hard they work, how they are always available for work, on time and or finish their jobs/tasks early, how organized, skilled, talented and hard working they are, how heavily requested they are by employers, how they may have served as a job steward and head of department for years before being fast tracked into the apprentice program...all that matters is the black and white line that some locals draw in the sand. Cross it and you are done. You are now the "enemy". No amount of smooching will ever change what happened. You can only hope the leadership of the Local changes through elections (and we know how often that happens). Or to succeed in the Courts. This is why the NLRA and the LMRDA Act exist, and this is why I.A.T.S.E. was formed as a "union" in the first place, to protect against such abuse against workers.

"When you have a bad experience, the best way to handle that is through positive conversation. If you are hot-headed and angry at how things have happened and you let that come out in your conversation, you will not be helping your case. If however, you take the time to speak with the BA rationally, you may end up getting more calls (depending on how they staff). Even then, you may not like their answer, but you are at least not shooting yourself in the foot."

Agreed and good advice no matter what type of hall you have. Been there...done that. But, the BA introduced himself in a screaming format. Even after that ALL remedies were very reasonably tried...the Local decided to delay, hide information, discredit the member and then they played burn the apprentice at the stake. Once you run out of internal options, any challenge in any form no matter how reasonable is treated as "railing" against the union. That is a big part of the NON-EXCLUSIVE Hiring Hall play-book. These types of halls will often treat you as the enemy if you do not agree with them. This again is why the NLRA and LMRDA exist (and the C&B too), to help prevent this old school cronyism and retaliation/payback against anyone who "dares" to challenge their Local. Sadly, the Oath of Obligation is used as a "weapon" against the member of the Labor Organization, who despite the four month remedy requirement, feels that ANY information about the Local given to ANYONE outside of the Local will cause them to also be burned at the same stake, despite the laws that says otherwise (NLRA and the LMRDA). These types of Locals just don't want you talking about it, especially to other members of the labor organization. That's why they quickly move to isolate out anyone who speaks up. They want to prevent people from organizing internally or externally against them. Ironic for a labor organization isn't it?

[ruinexplorer]

Obviously, there are grievances in this matter. Please refrain from continuing to use this forum as a punching bag for your bad experiences. I am sure the BA of the Hall would have a different opinion of the matter, but this is not the place for that discussion to happen.

Some clarifications for others on this forum are to follow. Please understand, I am not a legal representative and the following is based on my experience as a former member of IATSE, an individual who has hired both union and non-union stagehands, a self-employed freelance technician (1099 taxable income) and an employee under staging companies as well as venues.

Not all Business Agents are exempt from taking calls. Many locals are small enough that the BA is essentially required to take calls as he/she would be unable to fill the calls. Some will take calls to suplement their income as the fee associated as BA does not always pay well. The Business Agent is an elected position by members in good standing.

Since there is a question as to what defines a member of a labor organization, here is the direct quote from the definitions of Title 29:Labor used by the US Department of Labor, Office of Labor-Management Standards in regard to the The Labor-Management Reporting and Disclosure Act of 1959, as amended.

§ 401.15 Member or member in good standing.

Member or member in good standing, when used in reference to a labor organization, includes any person who has fulfilled the requirements for membership in such organization, and who neither has voluntarily withdrawn from membership nor has been expelled or suspended from membership after appropriate proceedings consistent with lawful provisions of the constitution and bylaws of such organization.

Many of the grievances stated above will have different results depending on the membership status of the individual. At a minimum, to become an actual member of IATSE, the person in question will generally have some sort of assessment of skills, be voted for approval to be included as a member by current members in good standing, pay some sort of initiation cost, and swear an oath of acceptance. There will likely be an ongoing monetary dues associated with being a member, which will be part of being a "member in good standing" agreement. Just working under a contract negotiated by collective bargaining does not automatically grant inclusion in any union. Nor does fees withheld from pay as part of that agreement constitute dues. As a non-member, or someone called by the union as part of a non-member call list, you do have the right to know the collective bargaining agreement with the employer in which you are contracted. This is not the Constitution and Bylaws which are afforded to the membership (which you will be given when you swear-in).

For the record, ControlBooth is not the place guaranteed by the union members "bill of rights" to voice a grievance.

Union Member Rights

Bill of Rights - Union members have:

equal rights to participate in union activities

freedom of speech and assembly

voice in setting rates of dues, fees, and assessments

protection of the right to sue

safeguards against improper discipline
Copies of Collective Bargaining Agreements - Union members and nonunion employees have the right to receive or inspect copies of collective bargaining agreements.

Reports - Unions are required to file an initial information report (Form LM-1), copies of constitutions and bylaws, and an annual financial report (Form LM-2/3/4) with OLMS. Unions must make the reports available to members and permit members to examine supporting records for just cause. The reports are public information and copies are available from the OLMS Internet Public Disclosure Room at U.S. Department of Labor - Office of Labor-Management Standards (OLMS) - ONLINE PUBLIC DISCLOSURE ROOM: Union Reports and Collective Bargaining Agreements.

This is a great place for us to discuss the pros and cons of membership and career paths. Please refrain from throwing out individual grievances so we can keep this as an open discussion.

[jerkyspace]

While they may be on the line of relating to me or not, the listed "types" of individual grievances that come out of the discussed "non-exclusive" hiring hall, are not meant to be a specific "veiled" "bash" at Local 16 specifically (they are identified because they are the one I know for a fact that classify themselves this way). The grievances come from the collective recent NLRB and Court cases over the last few years that relate to the Duty of Fair Representation, the NLRA and the LMRDA. These are what people should be aware of and look out for when thinking of an IATSE career (I did not include the death threats, physical, verbal and mental abuse, sexual harassment and discrimination and other nastier stuff in order to make it less inflammatory...oh well).

If you want to talk specifics vs opinions, I could say that the detailed evidence in my cases would have proceeded to harmful and costly charges against the Local in question if they were an "Exclusive Hiring Hall" like many many other IATSE ones. Being Non_Exclusive doesn't change the facts that the NLRB has accepted and agreed with the information/evidence presented already, it just changes whether or not they can act under the NLRA on it. This has no effect on the harmful actions taken and whether the Courts would have a very different result based on the same strong evidence. The point is that by making the "Hiring Hall" Non-Exclusive under the NLRA (and LMRDA), this gives the BA a "get out of jail free card" they can play over an over at the NLRB, when that would not work in many other Locals under the same IASTE International name, following the same C&B and not very different collective bargaining agreements nationwide that each Local themselves make up. This is not a problem to be openly discussed (to organize to improve conditions)?

The important matter is the Exclusive vs Non-Exclusive issue in all legal realms (which are too many and confusing and that does not benefit employees). Those are specific grievance examples and are from numerous NLRB and Superior/Federal Court Cases available online to the public. My intent was to point out the problems with there being two very different types of hiring halls that seem to be contradictory. If someone was signing up I would hope they knew what TYPE they were signing up for because it could make a HUGE difference down the road (even though it may or may not ever affect them directly). The problem that I see, is that the only good reason that any Hiring Hall would decide to steer away from the National Labor Relations Act, would be to get out of or keep out of trouble. I have yet to figure out any other advantage. If there is some way that Local 16 operates any differently than Local 720 or Local 7 or Local 46 then I have missed it (day to day practice and results). The only difference seems to be whether or not and how much rights the "employee" has when something goes wrong with either the union, the employer or both.

This is when the employee gets told they are not a member of the union and gets throw under the bus absent any grievance being heard nor anything in writing. That speaks to a harmful advantage in the BA/Hiring Hall court over the employee (member of the union or not as apprentice, journeyman, aux, whatever), when they would not have this problem if they just happened to be working in a different IATSE Local that was an Exclusive Classification (or they could and the BA is abusing that too). The legal community is buzzing around the LMRDA and NLRA and unions these days because the grey area needs to be cleared up and probably will in this decade or the next via legislation or court decisions. Legal reviews have specifically pointed out the LOW case success rate that employees have at the NLRB under the NLRA. This is because the lawyers are good at getting around things that are weak or written poorly. In this case employees have overlapping issues that involve their unions C&B, CBA and the NLRA and the LMRDA but several different legal venues and agencies that oversee each in different in sometimes contradictory ways.

Until new unifying court decisions or State/Federal Legislations, IATSE seems to be happy existing in the "grey", BUT employees/members have a right to know because they are not making it clear (they should). I just don't think it means that you don't have ANY rights. Employees have basic rights under the union collective bargaining agreements. It may not be rights to vote in union elections, nor attend meetings, nor other C&B UNION MEMBER specific things like this, but I think it is safe to say that this does not mean that they are some kind of indentured servant, who are lucky to be freed after working several years and after paying several thousand dollars to pass an open book test just to gain these "rights".

Props for going to the government "manual", the Code of Federal Regulations. Everyone should learn how to read this so they can check up on our government. I know it very well. Your quote of the LMRDA is correct, and specific to the LMRDA and in "member of the union classification" realm. The point for all "members of a labor organization" to realize is that this is the same type of argument used by the Local in question, to deny hard working and work fee paying "employees" their rights under the Collective Bargaining Agreement:

From IATSE:

Bargaining Unit
"The group of employees in jobs constituting the appropriate unit for representation by a union. In a sense, the employees in the bargaining unit are the electorate that determines which representative is to be chosen for collective bargaining. Historically, prior to the NLRA and the majority rule in determining the bargaining agent, the unit for collective bargaining was whatever the union was able to make it by exerting economic pressure on the employer. As provided by law, the bargaining unit is "the employer unit, craft unit, plant unit, or subdivision thereof," and essentially it consists of those employees who share a "community of interest." The employee bargaining unit embraces all employees, whether or not they are members of the union, and is basically of two types, namely, craft and industrial. The bargaining unit is separate and distinct from the union, and it is incorrect to refer to the union as the bargaining unit."

This is what I was referring to specifically. You don't have to be an Apprentice, nor Journeyman nor any other "Union" classification for these basic written rights found in your Collective Bargaining Agreement. In most Collective Bargaining Agreements (I hope!), there are written specific procedures for Grievances (involving the employee, employer and union) and basic rights for ALL EMPLOYEES:

And the same section you quote from the CFR:

"§ 401.6 Employee.
Employee means any individual employed by an employer, and includes any individual whose work has ceased as a consequence of, or in connection with, any current labor dispute or because of any unfair labor practice or because of exclusion or expulsion from a labor organization in any manner or for any reason inconsistent with the requirements of this Act.

§ 401.9 Labor organization.
Labor organization means a labor organization engaged in an industry affecting commerce and includes any organization of any kind, any agency, or employee representation committee, group, association, or plan so engaged in which employees participate and which exists for the purpose, in whole or in part, of dealing with employers concerning grievances, labor disputes, wages, rates of pay, hours, or other terms or conditions of employment, and any conference, general committee, joint or system board, or joint council so engaged which is subordinate to a national or international labor organization, other than a State or local central body."

Back to IATSE Definitions:

"Grievance
A formal complaint alleging a violation, misapplication, or misinterpretation of the collective bargaining agreement. Usually a grievance is raised by an individual employee in a bargaining unit, with the SHOP STEWARD and various union representatives assisting the employee in carrying the grievance forward. Occasionally, depending on the nature of the grievance and the contractual provisions, the union or even the employer may bring a grievance."

It does not say the Labor Organization is made up of MEMBERS of the Union, it says ANY EMPLOYEE. A Member is a type of Employee who has additional rights based upon this classification. EVERYONE has the same BASIC RIGHTS is the most important point. ALL EMPLOYEES are protected by the CBA to some extent. After whatever the specific internal remedies are and whatever their results, in the end either the NLRB and/or the Courts will allow the EMPLOYEE and chance to have their rights defended (if the labor organization fails to do so for them as promised in the CBA). It means the "union" is obligated to certain rights based on the collective bargaining agreement and therefore the LMRDA and the NLRA apply to ALL employees not just "members" of the labor organization. Without the protection of the union and the CBA you have less rights:

IATSE Definitions again:

Employment-at-Will
"A concept which holds that a worker's employment is "at the will of the employer" and that the employer is free to terminate an employee at any time....The managerial right to discharge an employee at will has been largely curtailed through unionization and by the collective bargaining agreement, which states that the discharge of workers covered by contract must be for just cause."

Without the union and collective bargaining agreements the employee could be fired for no reason with no way to restore their rights outside of a labor organization (one that represents their rights against the employer). I think the law clearly protects employees who are members of a labor organization, whether or not they are members of the union, under their CBA(s).

You would seem to be suggesting otherwise(or just just talking about layers of member definitions?). IATSE should not be telling or making employees feel in any way, who are booked by the hiring hall and who pay the hiring hall a work fee, while working under the hiring hall CBA and the C&B with the employers, that they have NO rights under the LMRDA/NLRA because they are not a Member of the Union (again a level of classification). I do not think you have to be an apprentice, aux or journeyman to have access to the basic rights under the US Constitution/Bill of Rights, State/Federal Labor Laws/Standards and the LMRDA and/or the NLRA. What is harming all members of this labor organization is the use/abuse of the Non-Exclusive Hiring Hall classification that is taking these away (or at least forcing the employee to the NLRB and or Courts instead of resolving it within the union). That is what all members of all labor organizations should be organizing against. That is another point to consider especially for those looking to sign up and work through this to make it to the magic membership levels.

You really did not need to say this, but if it makes you feel better, that is your right:
"For the record, ControlBooth is not the place guaranteed by the union members "bill of rights" to voice a grievance."
Who is really doing the bashing here? (not an invitation...just endless indirect sarcasm with a laugh).

I think IATSE could be much better and is slipping in the 21st century with outdated thinking. It is still better than freelancing, trust me. But, the way things are now you need to consider which Hiring Hall type you would want to be involved with (nothing is clearly defined across the whole international organization). This labor organization has a very serious problem, and people should organize to help resolve it. Non-Exclusive Hiring Hall=no National Labor Relations Act. The NLRA is GOOD for Labor Organizations right? Either way having both Non Exclusive and Exclusive under the same International Union Name and C&B? Is there some sense in this beyond giving the BA(s) freedom to abuse and not have to explain anything to the NLRB under the NLRA? Because it seems specifically "designed" to negotiate that particular hurdle very much to the benefit of the "labor organization" over the "employee member" and even the "union member"?

No disrespect intended, just exercising the discussion muscles.
cheers


References:

IATSE Definitions
http://www.iatse-intl.org/organizing/us_terms.html

NLRB the NLRA
http://www.nlrb.gov/national-labor-relations-act

The Code of Federal Regulations NLRA
29 CFR PART 104—NOTIFICATION OF EMPLOYEE RIGHTS; OBLIGATIONS OF EMPLOYERS
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...tart=1;size=25

The Department of Labor the LMRDA
http://www.dol.gov/olms/regs/statutes/lmrda-act.htm

The Code of Federal Regulations LMRDA
Title 29 PART 451—LABOR ORGANIZATIONS AS DEFINED IN THE LABOR-MANAGEMENT REPORTING AND DISCLOSURE ACT OF 1959
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...4.1.10&idno=29

The Code of Federal Regulations LMRDA
Title 29 PART 401 - MEANING OF TERMS USED IN THIS SUBCHAPTER
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...dno=29;cc=ecfr

Labor Union "legal" definition+ History
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti...om/Labor+Union


* the union in my case, specifics aside, had multiple four month internal grievance routes, as did the International's West Coast Office and the NYC HQ/President...I have tried and tried again to find remedies and answers from within...hard to talk about types of Hiring Halls with getting myself entangled...I don't need to "use" this excellent forum/site to publicly "try" my grievances...I am using the legal routes left to me and keeping the specific to myself other than informing other members of labor organizations along the way about what IATSE has specifically said and done that is not in question...since I am excluded from the workplace (for now)...but still in touch with many other members otherwise *

[fjb3005]

Well, after about a year and a half of working as an overhire with the local, I have been invited to join IATSE. I'm pretty excited about this, but before I jump in headfirst, I wanted to get some outside opinions of the union. I know all locals are different and many people have varying opinions on IATSE, but that's why I wanted to post my questions here. I'm currently a high school senior, and I will be going off to college next year for Theatre Design/Technology, with a concentration in Lighting Design. From the looks of it, my college for next year will be under a different local's jurisdiction, so I wouldn't be able to commute regularly back and forth for calls. However, I'm hoping that having a card might help to get on some overhire lists in wherever city I end up next year. Also, I'm hoping that when I apply for summer stock and internships and such, having the union card would at least imply a base set of skills which could help me to get the position. My concerns are, however, that having a union card would actually hurt my chances at getting jobs and positions wherever I end up next year. For the record, I've already addressed these and other questions to the BA at my local, I just wanted to get another set of opinions. So what would you recommend? Would joining the union help me out at this stage, or would it have the potential to hurt me as I go into college? Or would it really not affect me at all? I'm proud of the work I've put in and the experience I've gained through working long hours with the union, and I feel like having a card would help me out in the long term, however others may have different opinions about the IA. Your thoughts?

I have worked for going on my 18th year on the "extra board" in Denver. I also, freelanced operations/logistics for the NFL and PGA. It is like pulling teeth to get voted into our local. Until last year they never held a class in anything to teach endless stream of new hires what or how to do anything. I do fine off the extra board, its just difficult to get the votes unless your related to people. My advice, if they are offering a card, you get it and hold onto it like a winning powerball ticket. For the most part wherever you land, if you're a card you will automatically be bumped ahead of the extras. Plus at your age, keep working hard and making this kind of money, spending wisely, you will have a very comfortable retirement.

[dogfall]

I have worked as an overhire for 7 years. I was asked to join a few times and didn't, because I was getting as much work as I wanted without being a member. That is then this is now...I would like to get a travelers card. Should i do this through a local or is there another way?