Look for Ladder Advice

[jtravisp]

Hi all,

I hope I'm posting this in the right place! I am looking for a ladder for focusing lights in our theater. We hope to have a lift in a couple of years, but it's not in the budget right now.

I've seen theaters use the "trestle" style of wood ladder. I will be doing some of the focusing and I'm not terribly comfortable on that style and would prefer a-frame. It's been difficult to find a-frame ladders that are tall enough (18-21').

This one is fiberglass: Shop Werner 20' Fiberglass Twin-Step Ladder at Lowes.com
It would probably work. The unfortunate part is that it is huge and we have very limited storage space.

This one is aluminum: Little Giant Type 1A SkyScraper Telescoping Ladder — 11–21-ft., Model# 21 | Ladders + Stepstools | Northern Tool + Equipment
We have actually been using a shorter version of this ladder. Should we avoid aluminum? The upside of this ladder is that it stores much better.

What are my other options?

Thanks!!!

[jtravisp]

Another option: does anyone use "warehouse ladders" like this one: Ladders | Rolling-Steel | Steel Rolling Warehouse Ladders - GlobalIndustrial.com

It seems like a safer option than an a-frame.

[josh88]

I'm a huge fan of the little giant types of ladders, they can be short, tall, an extension ladder. I think everybody should at least have one of them just for their versatility. Fiberglass is great because it won't conduct electricity, though ideally you never run into a situation where that would happen. As I'm sure you're figuring you're not finding many that tall because of the height. At that top of one of those it's pretty easy to get enough sideways force to knock it over, doesn't take much when you're that high in the air. Lifts are safer, personally, and I'm not afraid of heights, I wouldn't want to use an A-frame that tall very often.

I would also point out the little giant weighs around 100 pounds and the Werner is 150 pounds. just another thing to keep in mind for when you're moving/storing/maneuvering it.

Edit: the rolling ones (locking it as you should) are safer, but still quite easy to tip at the top with sideways forces. Plus they take up even more space when not in use.

[icewolf08]

We have multiple sizes of Little Giants, A-Frames, and a Trestle ladder. Personally, I hate the super tall "skyscraper" LIttle Giant. It should be called a Giant Giant anyway. It weighs way more than any of the standard A-Frames, and I never feel secure when it is at max height and I am working near the top.

The Trestle ladder (sometimes also know as a-frame extension ladders) to me feels a lot more secure. Once on top with my legs "locked" through the rungs I am pretty happy. I can work up there for a good amount of time, stand, sit, haul up gear on a rope, etc. It is an acquired taste I think. Also, I don't think you can get these in wood anymore, we have an aluminum one. Having worked on both wood and aluminum versions, the aluminum does feel sturdier.

[Footer]

The Trestle ladder (sometimes also know as a-frame extension ladders) to me feels a lot more secure. Once on top with my legs "locked" through the rungs I am pretty happy. I can work up there for a good amount of time, stand, sit, haul up gear on a rope, etc. It is an acquired taste I think. Also, I don't think you can get these in wood anymore, we have an aluminum one. Having worked on both wood and aluminum versions, the aluminum does feel sturdier.

They are also extremely dangerous and actually illegal to use as the entertainment industry uses them in NYS.

If you can't afford a lift, buy a decent scaffolding. They store tight, go up quick, and are much safer. A standard steel construction grade scaffold that goes up to 15' should not run you more then a grand. A good aluminum "painters scaffold" should come in under 2k.

http://www.scaffoldmart.com/scaffold...6fttowers.html

[bdkdesigns]

I absolutely hate the large sized Little Giants, but love the smaller versions. I didn't feel comfortable on top of the big one. It just had so much give in it that it felt uncomfortable and like I was about to tip at any moment.

We have a large Trestle ladder for our space. I used to hate the thing but feel completely comfortable on it now. I'll just lock my legs into the top and free up my hands to focus. I just wish we had something on wheels because it sucks walking up and down that thing constantly during a focus. They had a dolly built for it but I junked that thing right away because it was so poorly constructed, it's surprising that noone was ever killed on it. Haven't gotten around to seeing if I could build a better one and probably won't for safety reasons.

Hopefully one of these days we might actually be able to buy some scaffolding or a lift but I don't see that in our immediate future. We only get 8k for a yearly budget by the state/university to cover everything from office supplies, toner, to show budgets. However, other NAST accredited universities in our state get far more than that.

[cbrandt]

I absolutely hate the large sized Little Giants, but love the smaller versions. I didn't feel comfortable on top of the big one. It just had so much give in it that it felt uncomfortable and like I was about to tip at any moment.

I've spent far more time than I care to remember on the top of the skyscraper type little giant at full extension. As much as I hate hauling it around and setting it up, it fits into many more places and spaces than any type of lift, and you can throw it in the back of a van or in between shelves when it is all folded up.

As for stability, yes, at 18 feet a single man lift is a little more solid, but I'd rather be at the top of a little giant at full extension than a man lift at full extension.

[len]

Other ideas:

Scaffolding (I know, it was mentioned, but I'm saying it again).

RENTING. How often do you need to get up there? If it's only 3 - 4 times a year, renting a lift might be safer and cheaper, until you can buy a lift (assuming that makes economic sense). Chances are, delivery is fairly easy for you, and maybe you can get a discount if you're a school, etc.

I like Little Giants. The skyscrapers are kind of scary, but IMO anything at that height gets a little freaky. I did see a guy fall from a LG at about 24', but it was his fault, not the ladder's.

[zmb]

If you can't afford a lift, buy a decent scaffolding. They store tight, go up quick, and are much safer. A standard steel construction grade scaffold that goes up to 15' should not run you more then a grand. A good aluminum "painters scaffold" should come in under 2k.

http://www.scaffoldmart.com/scaffold...6fttowers.html

Castors should be a nescesity. Besides the second person to stand it up once assembled, I can move it around without anyone else.

[jtravisp]

I am now considering this: Ladders | Rolling-Steel | Perforated 24"W 15 Step Steel Rolling Ladder 20"D Top Step | 861041PS - GlobalIndustrial.com

Any objections? The working height is more than sufficient for what we need (it will put our lights at shoulder level). Safer than an a-frame.

[SalvatoreDelorean]

I am now considering this: Ladders | Rolling-Steel | Perforated 24"W 15 Step Steel Rolling Ladder 20"D Top Step | 861041PS - GlobalIndustrial.com

Any objections? The working height is more than sufficient for what we need (it will put our lights at shoulder level). Safer than an a-frame.

I use one of those in the black box I work in. They're super sturdy and relatively safe, but they take up a huge amount of space. To be honest though, we also have a super sketchy wood trestle ladder on wheels that I hated at first, but now I go up and lock my legs over it and feel way safer than I do on the rolling step ladder. On those ladders, when I'm on top with my hands in the air focusing, I'm always afraid of falling back down the stairs. You can't lock your legs into it like you can with a trestle, and the top step is so small that if you lose your balance you have nowhere to go before you tumble down those stairs. I've never actually seen anyone hurt themselves on one of those step ladders, but they just feel less safe to me.

What kind of house are you in? Those little giants are great for focusing front of house positions in smaller theaters because they fit over rows of seats nicely. You can adjust both ends so they work really well on sloped or stepped floors. In a black box though, I'd get a rolling ladder (either trestle or step) if you have the space to store it. Everything goes so much faster. On that trestle, I just keep the wheels unlocked, grab the grid and scoot around from light to light when I'm focusing. Pretty sketchy but it gets it done in about half the time.

[Smayniac]

The house I work in has a Little Giant, an old 12 step wooden "A" ladder and a 16 step fibreglass double sided "A" ladder. I use the LG for as many things as I can, the wood is here because another theater was retiring it and we call the 16' "Clifford" the big red ladder, it's too big for one person to move around. I'm in the group that loves the old trestle ladders and the newer FG units are much more stable than the wooden ones we had before.

I'm not sure they're available anymore but one theater I worked in had spring loaded casters so that the ladder sank down onto its own legs when in use but rolled freely when empty.

Bob

Bob

[JChenault]

I am now considering this: Ladders | Rolling-Steel | Perforated 24"W 15 Step Steel Rolling Ladder 20"D Top Step | 861041PS - GlobalIndustrial.com

Any objections? The working height is more than sufficient for what we need (it will put our lights at shoulder level). Safer than an a-frame.

I would opine that if you can afford it, you would be much happier with one of the Werner snap up scaffolds than the rolling ladder.
The advantages of the snap up scaffold as I see it.

• Size - The footprint of an assembled scaffold unit is about 4' 6'' by 6'. And it is not a solid box, IE you can maneuver the unit around and over props, furniture, etc. I could not figure out the size of the rolling ladder, but it seems pretty large.
• Storage Size. The Werner unit can be easily dissembled into smaller parts and stashed just about anywhere in your space. The rolling ladder unit just stays big.
• Working area. You can stand at the top of the scaffold and walk around. IE you can reach more than one or two fixtures at a time.
• Adjustability. You can change the height of your working platform by getting different size accessories or putting your scaffold planks on a different rung.
• Stability. The ladder ( to my eye) seems to have a fairly narrow base. Not sure I would want to lean out to the side
• Portability. If you have to take the unit through a doorway, or up and down stairs, you can easily do this ( may have to disassemble and reassemble )

Now there are some disadvantages

• Cost - our unit which gets us up to 12 feet off the floor cost a bit over $2000.00 Well worth it to my mind.
• Assembly - It does take three or four minutes to assemble so it is not always available.
• Ease of getting to the top - The Werner unit used to have internal stairs. Unfortunately they no longer make those so you have to climb up the interior of the scaffold using the rungs of the scaffold as ladders.

The websites that describe the Werner snap up scaffold are pretty awful. You will need to call them and get some help figuring out what you need. Werner makes scaffolds which are not 'Snap Up' You only want the "Snap up" scaffold. If you can afford it, I think you will be much happier.

( Disclamer - I do not work for Werner, I'm just a happy customer )

[Benjod82]

We just bought the monster (in a good and bad way) Little Giant Type 1A SkyScraper Telescoping Ladder this past fall to replace a trestle ladder that had cracked at the foot. We have been relatively happy with it, that being said we are lucky enough to have access to a couple different lifts that we use 95% of the time.

The lift is a pain for two people to move around, but it does allow access to anything we've needed, even on uneven surfaces & stair cases. I feel just as secure at 20' on this as I have on any trestle ladder I've used in the past.

If it was my only way to get to our lights I'm not sure I would have picked this ladder though...

[SalvatoreDelorean]

We just bought the monster (in a good and bad way) Little Giant Type 1A SkyScraper Telescoping Ladder this past fall to replace a trestle ladder that had cracked at the foot. We have been relatively happy with it, that being said we are lucky enough to have access to a couple different lifts that we use 95% of the time.

The lift is a pain for two people to move around, but it does allow access to anything we've needed, even on uneven surfaces & stair cases. I feel just as secure at 20' on this as I have on any trestle ladder I've used in the past.

If it was my only way to get to our lights I'm not sure I would have picked this ladder though...

How do you use a lift on stairs?

[Lance]

How do you use a lift on stairs?

I think Benjod meant to say "ladder" over the stairs and uneven surfaces

[avkid]

Has anyone here used one of the new Little Giant Revolution XE ladders?

[StNic54]

I'm a huge fan of the Little Giant series of ladders. If you are planning to put a ladder on wheels, you should check with OSHA regulations and local safety regulations as well. Often times these rolling ladders are being discouraged or altogether banned due to safety concerns. Also, who are you sending up these ladders? Employees? Students? HS Students (hope not)? I would triple-check about insurance issues if you aren't able to purchase a proper lift.