Curious . . What brand gel and what does it cost?

[BillESC]

I'm interested in what brands of gel you all use and what your current cost is.

Thanks for the help.

[icewolf08]

I don't remember what I am currently paying for gel, though I know there are slight variations between manufacturers. Mostly in the $5-$6 range. We use whatever the designer specs.

[gafftaper]

I generally only buy Roscolux. The two sheets of plastic with the color baked in the middle seems to make it more durable to me (sorry Keith... I do like your gobos better). Current price locally is $5.79 a sheet.

[Footer]

Usually 5-6ish, depending. If I need something quick and have to get it local its usually a bit more then going through a large vendor.

[sound_nerd]

Yeah, in the $8 CDN range for a sheet, I go with Rosco or Lee depending on the colour, although I like Lee far more for durability and saturation.

[Logos]

I use Lee and I pay $A11.50 for a sheet but I live in Australia so that information is no use to you at all.
(He sniggers quietly and sneaks away.)

[gafftaper]

I use Lee and I pay $A11.50 for a sheet but I live in Australia so that information is no use to you at all.
(He sniggers quietly and sneaks away.)

Maybe Bill's thinking about opening a branch office in OZ.

[Timmyp]

I'm paying about £4 a sheet, I don't know how the dollar's feeling at the moment, but that's probably around $7-8.

For a roll I'm looking at about £60.

Do you buy in Rolls and Sheets in the US?

I've only ever bought one Roll. And that was L103 (straw) and it was shared between three local Am-Dram groups!

I usually buy Lee HT.


Tim

[Grog12]

We have everything available from the big 4 (R,L,G,A) runs in the 5-6ish range a sheet.

[Footer]

I personally love the fact that this thread brought out nearly every Non-us number possible, interesting way to do conversions though.

[len]

The few I've purchased have been in the $7.50/sheet range. I usually buy Rosco cuz I'm most familiar with their numbers.

[Pie4Weebl]

Rosco usually, occasionally a lee blue. In Chi I pay $6.50 a sheet, not sure what cost down here in STL is.

[JD]

Every brand. Most is Roscolux, but there are some Lee colors that Rosco does not match! (126 mauve, 119 Blue, 139 green) I even have an old stash of Roscolene, which I don't think is carried anymore.

[Kelite]

<(sorry Keith... I do like your gobos better)>

That's quite alright, every quality product has a growth curve! We have dealers stocking Apollo gel in over 26 states and several countries for last minute shoppers. You'll be seeing more of the 24 x 24 inch sheets and Apollo Perf-Gel in the future!

[Jezza]

I'm paying $5.75 for Rosco or Lee locally, + shipping. Not bad. I tend to purchase Rosco more often as I am more familiar with their colors and the Lee gel book is absolutely stupid to try and search for anything. I usually buy Gam diffusion for around $6.00 and will pick up Rosco or Apollo patterns for around $10.00 a piece (steel).

[gafftapegreenia]

I was buying Rosco in Detroit for about $7 a sheet, thats about average in the area. Not sjure on the prices in Milwaukee yet.

I usually use Rosco because I like the colors and EVERYONE has it. However, some of those Apollo colors look awesome and can't wait to try them out.

I agree about LEE, that book is horrible to search.

[Jezza]

I agree about LEE, that book is horrible to search.

You see, I'm sure there is a method to it, something about saturation or hue or transmission or something, but it is NOT obvious and the number system is totally screwy--can someone from Lee explain their gel book!?

[derekleffew]

You see, I'm sure there is a method to it, something about saturation or hue or transmission or something, but it is NOT obvious and the number system is totally screwy--can someone from Lee explain their gel book!?

I'm not from Lee, and I'm sure Keith, Skip, Steve Terry, or others will correct me if I'm wrong, but...

The Lee numbering system and colors were derived from Cinemoid--a plastic color medium, like Roscolene, as opposed to polyester like Roscolux, that became defunct as it could not stand up to the energy of Q-I (T/H) lamps. Those of us who used Cinemoid, which were 5xx numbers, are quite comfortable with the Lee numbers, which use 1xx. The Lee 7xx and 3xx are newer colors added when they ran out of 1xx numbers. Yes, it's a caluge, but Lee still offers a "Numeric Edition" swatchbook, and a "Designers Edition includes Numeric listing" swatchbook. My "Numeric Edition" is still what I use most often, does not include 3xx and 7xx, and is rather dog-earred. Most British LDs prefer Lee, as Cinemoid was a Rank-Strand product. Many American LDs, particularly in dance, seem to want to emulate the British and specify LEE Filters only.

To further confuse matters, the Lee 0xx numbers are "clones" of Roscolux colors, with notable exceptions, i.e. Lee002 IS NOT the same as Lux02; Lee003 IS NOT Lux03; but Lee004 IS very close to Lux04. I once went 'round and 'round with a Master Elect. who said the sheet he had that just said "003" was Lux03. I didn't have my swatchbooks with me so I couldn't prove it, and it was only Followspot color for a one-off that the LD wouldn't use anyway. And I was right; we cut, framed, and loaded 6 colors in 6 spots and the LD only used OW and Frame#1. Happens ALL the time. Rant OFF. But I digress. Also Lee has the "HT" prefix, which costs $2-3 more per sheet, but does hold up longer, and IMO, is worth the added cost in saturated colors.

The only color media manufacturer that makes sense spectrally is GamColor. When Joe Tawil took the colors of the defunct Gelatran, he was able to devise a system that made sense, as he was starting from scratch. I feel GAM colors are the "flashiest," as well as having the sexiest names, like G195 Nymph Pink, G888 Blue Belle, and G985 Ripe Plum. Three of Roscolux's sexiest colors are what I call the "ego" colors: X336 Billington Pink, X39 Skelton Exotic Sangria, and X349 Fisher Fuchsia. Do the designers, or Tom Skelton's estate, get a royalty whenever these colors are sold?

Roscolux has been able to keep somewhat of an order, by adding 3xx in between xx colors, but Excel doesn't understand that and it makes my color lists odd when I sort by color#. In the early 1980s Rosco was having quality-control issues and began adding an "-A" suffix to colors they could no longer replicate. Thus there was R35 and R35A, and they were close, but not the same, color.


Sorry Keith, no offense to Apollo Gel implied, but it took me 10 years to accept GAM, and I still only use a few of those colors, not available in Lee or Roscolux.

For a .PDF of an Excel conversion chart of Lux to Lee & GAM, visit my site at http://www.derekleffew.com/reference...ntsandwebsites. For the actual Excel file, so you can sort other ways, email me.

Hope this helps. As I've said before, I have a fetish for "modern" stage lighting history.

Derek

[Footer]

I always have two lee book around, a numeric and a designer. Lee is weird simply because it is an older system, but instead of throwing it all out, they just went with it. Same reason we still measure in feet over here in the states, we are to lazy to learn a new system. The last theatre I was at the house elec put all the 3's or rosco in a separate filing cabinet, it was very annoying. Short of going to the dewey decimal system, gel organizing will never be a perfect art.

[Kelite]

This post is not directed toward anyone in particular, but more as an FYI to all gel users.

The actual light spectrum, with visable light beginning around 350 nanometers(Ultra-Violet) and ending around 800 nanometers (Infra-Red), is the spectral wavelength professors and scientists use when placing a specific color on 'the map'. All gel manufacturers use a spectral chart to indicate the color of their gels. Each gel has a slipsheet within the swatchbook, indicating the color name, number, and the color's placement within the spectral curve.

Apollo has chosen to use the spectral numbers as our gel numbers (how simple is that?) to simplify the process. The Lavs/Violets are in the 3000 range, Blues are in the 4000 range, Greens/5000, Yellows/6000, et al.

With four digits, we have more than enough room to add transmissions between existing colors- avoiding prefix numbers and letters.

I completely understand using products which are familiar to you, and am encouraged by the growing number of Apollo Gel users at the school level as well as theater.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled program.....

[gafftaper]

This post is not directed toward anyone in particular, but more as an FYI to all gel users.
The actual light spectrum, with visable light beginning around 350 nanometers(Ultra-Violet) and ending around 800 nanometers (Infra-Red), is the spectral wavelength professors and scientists use when placing a specific color on 'the map'. All gel manufacturers use a spectral chart to indicate the color of their gels. Each gel has a slipsheet within the swatchbook, indicating the color name, number, and the color's placement within the spectral curve.
Apollo has chosen to use the spectral numbers as our gel numbers (how simple is that?) to simplify the process. The Lavs/Violets are in the 3000 range, Blues are in the 4000 range, Greens/5000, Yellows/6000, et al.
With four digits, we have more than enough room to add transmissions between existing colors- avoiding prefix numbers and letters.
I completely understand using products which are familiar to you, and am encouraged by the growing number of Apollo Gel users at the school level as well as theater.
Now, back to our regularly scheduled program.....

No way Keith... you guys actually thought about it and came up with a reason for the numbers! How logical and scientific of you.

I liked Derek's little history of Gel but couldn't help think that it was a little crazy how we are using numbering systems based on other numbering systems from dead manufacturers and dead technology.

[Kelite]

<couldn't help think that it was a little crazy how we are using numbering systems based on other numbering systems from dead manufacturers and dead technology.>

Our thoughts EXACTLY.

As young lighting designers develop and formulate their favorite palettes of color, the light spectrum can be trusted to provide accuracy. We would like to support their quest for suitable colors by being exact, rather than by taking a 'hit or miss' approach.

[derekleffew]

I liked Derek's little history of Gel but couldn't help think that it was a little crazy how we are using numbering systems based on other numbering systems from dead manufacturers and dead technology.

Kind of like advocating a system of measurement of length based on some guy's foot who died like a million years ago.

[Charc]

No way Keith... you guys actually thought about it and came up with a reason for the numbers! How logical and scientific of you.
I liked Derek's little history of Gel but couldn't help think that it was a little crazy how we are using numbering systems based on other numbering systems from dead manufacturers and dead technology.

Gaff, I fear Apollo's smart numbering process has the same forward thinking as the metric system... but I'm ready to convert! I even tried picking up an Apollo swatch book, but the philly theatre supply store (yep, we have one) doesn't have Apollo swatch books... so all I have is rosco and lee...

[gafftapegreenia]

I have an Apollo swatch book. I must say, the little blurbs on the back of each color info sheet make for some high quality reading. Seriously, those are the best, like on AP6900, Butterscotch.

[Kelite]

<the little blurbs on the back of each color info sheet make for some high quality reading.>

KC Hooper and the rest of the sales/marketing gang added theater lighting tips to the swatchbook last year. Knowing the number of high school and church drama teachers that may not have an in-depth background in technical theater or color theory could benefit from them.

Along with Perf Gel and 24 x 24 inch sheets for better yield, it's just another reason to keep Apollo in mind for your gel. We're in this for the long haul-

edit (As an aid to the drama teachers, Apollo has the first of several 'Playbooks' available to assist in a number of popular high school productions.)

http://downloads.goapollo.com/DiaryOfAnneFrank.pdf

'Our Town', 'The Crucible', and 'The Glass Menagerie' are next!

[BillESC]

Anyone who wishes to get an Apollo swatch book can contact me and we'll send one out free of charge.

[TupeloTechie]

what about the goboman gel? Has anyone ever used it? It seems to be alittle cheaper, but I'm not so sure on the quality of it, and the color options.

http://goboman.com/color_filters.asp

[avkid]

They want $10 plus s+h for a swatch book.

[gafftaper]

They want $10 plus s+h for a swatch book.

Ouch! "Hi, I'm a small company, new to the market, Give me $10 to see what I sell."

[avkid]

And oh my gawd, $9.98 for shipping!!

[gafftapegreenia]

Wait, Goboman wants $10 for a book? I got mine for free.....

Anway, the Goboman book is worse than the LEE, there is no order. The colors are just ordered randomly. Yes, they have numbers, but that's where it ends. I don't believe Goboman makes their gel. I think they actually have a deal with Formatt Filters in the UK. After much haggling I got Formatt to send me a swatchbook - they said they don't like to send them out because it costs them money - anyway, it was like a large version of the Goboman book. Same numbers, more colors and no order. Doubt I'll be using them.

Edit for typos.

[Logos]

Just as a matter of interest does Apollo have a distributor in Australia yet. I am always open to new ideas and using a colour called Butterscotch appeals somehow.

[gafftapegreenia]

using a colour called Butterscotch appeals somehow.

It's even better when the back of the color curve reads "Similar to AP6800 with a bit more orange. Good for deep desert sun. Subdues blue tones. Good for dim lantern of firelight. Nice for golden sunset and tasty on a sundae."


I'd like to add that I recently found a sort of "history of gel", unfortunatly its in German.
http://www.hbernstaedt.de/KnowHow/Farbfolien/folien.htm

This is bad, this thread has got me all interested in gel history now.

[Kelite]

<Yes, they have numbers, but that's where it ends. I don't believe Goboman makes their gel.>

Uh, no. It's two people working from the home garage. And all my best to them for their efforts.


The additional 'Apollo Playbills' are available for viewing or download. Feel free to send this to as many drama teachers as you see fit. Hard copies are available as well...

http://downloads.goapollo.com/OurTown.pdf

http://downloads.goapollo.com/TheCrucible.pdf

http://downloads.goapollo.com/TheGlassMenagerie.pdf

[gafftapegreenia]

Uh, no. It's two people working from the home garage. And all my best to them for their efforts.[/url]

Well, okay, I am corrected. But riddle me this, why are the Formatt and Goboman swatchbooks so similar?

[Kelite]

Well, if I were to purchase gaffer tape from a major manufacturer and needed to display a sample of the wares, the manufacturer would produce a sample tape card for my use. The assembly of the tape card with tape samples would look very similar to the original manufacturer's marketing items.

Fair enough?

[gafftapegreenia]

Fair enough.

[Kelite]

<Just as a matter of interest does Apollo have a distributor in Australia yet. I am always open to new ideas and using a colour called Butterscotch appeals somehow.
__________________
Tony Moore
Semi retired semi lunatic>


Hi Tony,

At the moment Kenderdine in Auckland has been helping us serve the land down under. I've visited with several companies during a visit to Sydney, but no one company has the 'sole distributorship' rights to Oz.

I'm keen as mustard to get a few on board the bus though!

[Sean]

<Yes, they have numbers, but that's where it ends. I don't believe Goboman makes their gel.>
Uh, no. It's two people working from the home garage. And all my best to them for their efforts.

I also applaud Steve and Rebel's efforts on making Goboman work. They are not (by their own admission) manufacturing gel in their garage.

--Sean