Old theatre lights CAN be useful.

[derekleffew]

Took longer to open the package than to build the unit.

Lamp kit = $7.46
Shade = $9.96
Bulb = $5.00 ? 14W Florescent = 60W.

Okay, the SourceFour™ yoke label DOES say "Not for Residential Use," but I doubt the mattress tag police are going to come arrest me. And yes, I pulled the shutters from force of habit. Until I need the fixture, it's going to make a lovely addition to my office.

Notice the UL label in picture #2.

As my roommate was walking by, he said "Too bad they got rid of all the VL2Cs, you could have done that to them!" That would be slightly more complicated, but not by much.

I want a cut of each one of these sold on ebay!

[SteveB]

Took longer to open the package than to build the unit.
Lamp kit = $7.46
Shade = $9.96
Bulb = $5.00 ? 14W Florescent = 60W.
Okay, the SourceFour™ yoke label DOES say "Not for Residential Use," but I doubt the mattress tag police are going to come arrest me. And yes, I pulled the shutters from force of habit. Until I need the fixture, it's going to make a lovely addition to my office.
Notice the UL label in picture #2.
As my roommate was walking by, he said "Too bad they got rid of all the VL2Cs, you could have done that to them!" That would be slightly more complicated, but not by much.
I want a cut of each one of these sold on ebay!

That is the butt-F _ _ _ _ _ N ugliest table lamp I have ever seen. I guarantee you that is not going into the new house/apartment if your SO has any taste.

SB

[STEVETERRY]

That is the butt-F _ _ _ _ _ N ugliest table lamp I have ever seen. I guarantee you that is not going into the new house/apartment if your SO has any taste.
SB

Thank you.

ST

[gafftaper]

That is the butt-F _ _ _ _ _ N ugliest table lamp I have ever seen. I guarantee you that is not going into the new house/apartment if your SO has any taste.
SB

But honey it's cool and I made it myself...

Put it in the garage!!

I've got some 40 or 50 year old century fresnels I'm going to rewire and use someday when we get a bigger house.

[Footer]

Ya.... I think it would take a lot for my girlfriend let me bring that home... so far I have punched a hole in her fridge for a certain beverage dispenser... ran ethernet cable all over the house.... and who knows what else... I think the placeing an old fixture in our living room might end me out on the front lawn. Now for the office....

[ship]

he he he, my girl friend doesn't mind my tinkerings or my "guy zone" garage... just the amount of time I spend there tinkering. Just finished re-doing the reading lamp over the bed, it's now 54" high with two side arm swivels to it. One a low voltage wash light, the other a low voltage MR-11 flood. Both are controlled indipendantly and swivel to about a 160 degree axis so they can cover the bed or my desk.

My creations are all over the place - sometimes they work, sometimes as with the vinal vertical blinds that came with the house that I glued wall paper to don't work out so well - the glue did not stick so well on some of them. For the most part she is understanding and likes such creations. Definate advantage.

[gafftapegreenia]

Derek, you really don't like old fixtures do you?

Reminds me today, I was moving some of the worklights around, in this case Electro Controls PAR 64's. (Another re-qire project - the list grows). Anyway, the assistant designer just said, "God, those are ugly, I hate them". I was hurt, but the designer from out last show, She Loves Me, just said "Noah, she fails to see their inner beauty". We are such dorks, oh well.

I'm planning a table lamp with one of the old 360Q's I was forced, hear me, forced to scrap. The only useable parts were the reflector, one lens and the retainer ring. This thing was one of those that left me saying, "how did it end up like this?". Currently, it is an empty shell, but I plan on doing the socket on the yoke, along with a small lamp internally to make it glow. With the shutters and reflector gone there are plenty of holes for light to glow from. Put these two lamps on a three way switch and, *BAM*, high class.

[derekleffew]

Derek, you really don't like old fixtures do you?

I love old fixtures! The one in the picture is a first generation 436 dating all the way back to 1993.

Currently, it is an empty shell, but I plan on doing the socket on the yolk, along with a small lamp internally to make it glow. With the shutters and reflector gone there are plenty of holes for light to glow from. Put these two lamps on a three way switch and, *BAM*, high class.

Eggs have yolks; theatre lights have yokes.

Please post pictures so we can show those naysayers how attractive stage lights can be. I suppose it helps that I live with a guy who's also into lighting.

[gafftapegreenia]

[QUOTE=derekleffew;67352]
Eggs have yolks; theatre lights have yokes.
QUOTE]

GAHHHH! The proofread police catch me at last.

Have you hugged your Source 4 today?

[Charc]

So that is an old version of S4? I noticed when I took a tour of the regional theater I'll be interning at that they had those older S4s, though I didn't know it at the time, and I kept scratching my head. I also kept dying a little inside as one of the PAR56s in the lobby needed relamping... STAT!

I have a few "old" lights lying around. Well the 360 Radials, I don't know if they count, but I can't even figure out what to lamp them with. I have a half dozen of those on the side. They are all pretty much messed up. Looks like some kind of screw base... *mutters about radials*

I have two "Strand Century" lights that look to be PC. It has some really weird like blue / yellow knobs, and the whip has no connector. It is on my list of things to do. I want to clean these two out really well, get the ol' stage pin on there, and test their lamps. Maybe the quality of light is worth it. Maybe it's just the variety I'm looking for. I'm slowly amassing our "old lights" into something useable, thinking one of them will be "just perfect" for what I need some day. (So far, they're all just perfect, they shoot light out the end!)

[gafftapegreenia]

To some people, anything not S4 is old, so radial lekos count.

Hey, my college has some of them old S4's too!! I noticed they dont have that handy handle on the back.

[Charc]

To some people, anything not S4 is old, so radial lekos count.
Hey, my college has some of them old S4's too!! I noticed they dont have that handy handle on the back.

Exactly what tipped me off from the floor!

Can you even buy replacement lamps for those radials? Are they worth lamping, or scraping? Maybe work them into architectural lighting?

Man, I really wanna know what those Strand PC units are, it's bugging me now. They have a weird front. And it doesn't have a standard yoke, as to those aforementioned knobs, that don't connect to the unit, rather to the yoke. And it has some kind of pin, where I would mount a C-Clamp, I have no clue how to get this into the air. Sorry the description is poor, I keep walking by it, and have yet to actually pick it up to look at it in-depth. It might not even be PC. This sounds like a fun project.

Kudos to anyone that can read my mind / poor description and produce a picture and model number.

[gafftapegreenia]

Umm, I don't know the number, but there are, or at least were, tungsten-halogen lamps that had a long neck so the filament lined up in the focal point of a radial reflector. If your ship, you would just jack the lamp base and use regular lamps.

Man, I reall want pics of those Strands. Did you check the online strand archive yet?

[Charc]

Umm, I don't know the number, but there are, or at least were, tungsten-halogen lamps that had a long neck so the filament lined up in the focal point of a radial reflector. If your ship, you would just jack the lamp base and use regular lamps.
Man, I reall want pics of those Strands. Did you check the online strand archive yet?

They looked relatively new too, so I could swear it's just some kind of light that just never caught on, like the 1KL6 series by Altman. I don't mean to mislead you if I'm wrong. The digicam is in my bag for tomorrow though... but I need to remember to take the pics.

Edit:
I thought the Strand archive is inaccessible with the new site?

[gafftapegreenia]

http://www.strandarchive.co.uk/lanterns/index.html

The Strandarchive is like Klieglbros.com, in no way affiliated with the actual company, but rather a support base for fans/users/historians.

[Charc]

http://www.strandarchive.co.uk/lanterns/index.html
The Strandarchive is like Klieglbros.com, in no way affiliated with the actual company, but rather a support base for fans/users/historians.

To the best of my recollection, it's not up there. Perhaps I got the manufacturer wrong, though I think I'm right. Maybe it's an after-market yoke that's tripping me up? I intend to find out.

[gafftaper]

To the best of my recollection, it's not up there. Perhaps I got the manufacturer wrong, though I think I'm right. Maybe it's an after-market yoke that's tripping me up? I intend to find out.

It's called a camera Charc... Use it... Post... Answers will come quickly...


The big thing around my house is I'm notorious for "fixing" things. We had a portable fan with low, medium, and high push button switches. The buttons died. I went down to my tool box and grabbed this big fat 2" long toggle switch and wired it to high. We've been using the thing for 10 years like that. The fan selector in an old car went out... too poor at the time to afford the $50 part, I managed to rewire it to work in off and high. There have been other similar projects. My wife makes fun of my ability to make everything in life simple. In our house you get a choice of High or off. There is no middle ground in my world baby!!

[dj_illusions]

I got a really really old fixture that I found in an old venue, it is sort of like a big par can, I gutted it and turned it into a pot plant, it is growing bamboo at the moment, which I stole from the same venue.

I will post a pic. I wouldnt mind knowing what kind of fixture it actually is...

[derekleffew]

Charc, is the socket in your radial ERSs that you think is a screwbase actually a medium prefocus? If so, you have many lamps from which to choose. Once you post the pictures, I'm sure someone will identify them, then we'll tell you the lamp we used to use, and ship will come up with the preferred modern variety.

[Charc]

Okay, actually two different fixtures. Sorry for the confusion.

The first:

Strand Century Polaris Fresnel

The second, an unidentified PC.

My image files are too large, and I can't figure out a way to size them down at school.

Suggestions welcome.

[Charc]

Charc, is the socket in your radial ERSs that you think is a screwbase actually a medium prefocus? If so, you have many lamps from which to choose. Once you post the pictures, I'm sure someone will identify them, then we'll tell you the lamp we used to use, and ship will come up with the preferred modern variety.

I'll go grab some pics before Meeting.

(Meeting? What's meeting you say?! Meeting for Worship. Part of the quaker religion. I go to a friends school. Essentially we nap in silence for 45 minutes. Look it up.)

[derekleffew]

Using Graphic Converter, do a "save as" and select a lower resolution .jpg, thus a smaller file. And/or crop the photo to just the fixture.

[derekleffew]

I feel I must confess to an error, before STEVETERRY catches me. The fixture out of which I made a desk lamp was a 2nd generation S4, as it has the integral safety attachment point. Conveniently, it also has 3 holes in the top of the yoke, to allow for offset hanging (or use two clamps side-by-side, if you're sure you never want to pan the fixture!) The "handy handle" on the lamp cap came about with the HPL750, and thus I suppose is the 3rd generation.

Perhaps someone at ETC can fill in the gaps and add dates to these iterations of the Source4™ ERS. I know there also have been several lens tube modifications over the years. The timeline at http://www.etcconnect.com/minisite/s...r/history.html is somewhat lacking in the minutiae of details.

Yes I hugged my SourceFour™ today, but the older one that I didn't make into a lamp is now jealous, as it's hanging in the garage next to a Strand-Century LekoLight.

Yes, I realize I need to dust. The garage doubles as a wood shop, and everyone knows carpentry and electrics don't mix.

[Charc]

I just noticed that "safety attachment" point yesterday. At least I assume that's what I found. Are my safeties supposed to be permanently attached to that point?... oops.

Well here are the pics of the Polaris. Is it worth trying to find a lamp for and added a stage pin?

Edit:
Forgot to take pics of the radials, they are in the background of pic 3. Can you see the lamp base type?

[Charc]

This is the unidentifiable PC.
Notes in instrument:
Only distinguishing marking has its own picture.
Note that the gel frame holder seems to have a terrible design.
Note the lamp, which I've never seen before, and there seems to be no reflector.

[STEVETERRY]

I just noticed that "safety attachment" point yesterday. At least I assume that's what I found. Are my safeties supposed to be permanently attached to that point?... oops.
Well here are the pics of the Polaris. Is it worth trying to find a lamp for and added a stage pin?
Edit:
Forgot to take pics of the radials, they are in the background of pic 3. Can you see the lamp base type?

Certainly. that's a modern high performance Ianiro pole-operated TV fixture that will put out a lot of light and have a nice spot/flood range. It looks like it's in pretty good shape.

ST

[STEVETERRY]

This is the unidentifiable PC.
Notes in instrument:
Only distinguishing marking has its own picture.
Note that the gel frame holder seems to have a terrible design.
Note the lamp, which I've never seen before, and there seems to be no reflector.

I would say it's from one of the smaller manufacturers of the 40's and 50's--perhaps Duwico or Columbia.

Definitely not Kliegl.

BTW, that "bad" gel frame holder was designed for quick gel changes.

ST

[STEVETERRY]

Perhaps someone at ETC can fill in the gaps and add dates to these iterations of the Source4™ ERS. I know there also have been several lens tube modifications over the years. The timeline at http://www.etcconnect.com/minisite/s...r/history.html is somewhat lacking in the minutiae of details.

There have been many thousands of small improvements done over the 15 year life of S4, and they continue. They are not really collected in one place for dissemination. Good thing, because they are mostly boring manufacturing improvements or optical prescription changes!

ST

[STEVETERRY]

Forgot to take pics of the radials, they are in the background of pic 3. Can you see the lamp base type?

Those units are Altman 360's, (not 360Q's). Normally known in the rental business as "incandescents", as opposed to "Axials". I must confess, it seems like "radial" for an ERS is a Control Booth term!

They take a medium prefocus T-12 lamp (probably almost impossible to find these days) or a quartz conversion like the 750W EGG (as in ANSI code, not food type).

They were designed for the C13D filament of the prefocus T-12 lamp, and the EGG is a smaller coiled-coil filament. The LCL is similar, but the filament geometry is wildly different. As such, you won't get a very nice field with it. It was one of the first attempts at a quartz conversion lamp.

ST

[derekleffew]

Charc-
Here's a link to the .pdf for your Strand/Ianiro/Quartzcolor Polaris. www.strandlight.com/PDF/US-05/Polaris_07April05.pdf Note it could be as young as 12 years old. You'll need the appropriate socket and 1000W lamp. It is a studio fixture, hence the pole-operation, but you don't have to use the pole, and it's impractical over 15' anyway. A very nice light.

As for the PC Spot, also known as a box spot, it's an antique, and not worth refurbishing for stage use. It IS missing its spherical reflector.

Your radials are Altman 360s (not Qs). It IS a medium prefocus socket, and can take either EGE 500W or EGG 750W. Original lamp was a non T/H 750T12/9, ANSI code DNT, but hard to find and more expensive than the EGG. Maybe ship knows of a more modern lamp than the EGG, but I doubt it. Use the lens in the sunlight trick to determine if they are 6x9 or 6x12, clean them up inside and out, spend a good deal of time bench-focusing them, and they will be perfectly usable. This is what everyone used until the axial 360Q came about.

[derekleffew]

...I must confess, it seems like "radial" for an ERS is a Control Booth term!...

I first heard the term "radial" used by Larry Scheoneman, owner of DesignLab Chicago, in the mid 1980s. Someone here on ControlBooth said their theatre called them "toploaders," which I really like and want to propagate!

[Logos]

Charc-
As for the PC Spot, also known as a box spot, it's an antique, and not worth refurbishing for stage use. It IS missing its spherical reflector.
[/SIZE]

I agree that it's not worth refurbishing but it may not be missing it's reflector. I have a few antiques of similar era (Strand Patt 45 etc) that had no reflector at all. The problem was that reflectors were made out of glass at that time and were expensive so the really budget lights didn't have them. The Lamp looks like an old Phillips T1 bayonet base. (UK/Aus) Modern replacement is T24? not sure.

[STEVETERRY]

I agree that it's not worth refurbishing but it may not be missing it's reflector. I have a few antiques of similar era (Strand Patt 45 etc) that had no reflector at all. The problem was that reflectors were made out of glass at that time and were expensive so the really budget lights didn't have them. The Lamp looks like an old Phillips T1 bayonet base. (UK/Aus) Modern replacement is T24? not sure.

I think the lamp is a G-18 medium screw base, last commonly used in mini scoops called "wizards" around 1980.

ST

[STEVETERRY]

I first heard the term "radial" used by Larry Scheoneman, owner of DesignLab Chicago, in the mid 1980s. Someone here on ControlBooth said their theatre called them "toploaders," which I really like and want to propagate!

I think Larry made it up. Maybe it's a Chicago thing.

In New York, we call them "incandescents".

(For any of you that are lucky enough to own the classic roadhouse crew tee shirt: "We don't care how they do it in New York", sorry. New York is where the thing was invented!)




ST

[gafftapegreenia]

As for the PC Spot, also known as a box spot, it's an antique, and not worth refurbishing for stage use. It IS missing its spherical reflector.
[/SIZE]

We talked about the whole reflector/non-reflector thing in the Question of the Day board a while back. Seems the reason was that, besides cost, the screw base lamps of the day were hard to get correctly aligned with both the focal point of a reflector and the focal point of the lens. If you did get it right, it could move easily. Thus, the beam was more even WITHOUT a reflector than with one.

Also, I wouldn't call that a box spot. A box spot is truly a "box", like the Altman #101. Thats just your standard, old-school PC. Looks like someone rewired it. At least you don't have asbestos to worry about. Clean it up and display it in the lobby before the show with a donations bucket beneath it.

[Charc]

Re: Multiple replies on radials.

I woulda noted them as 360 Radials, but I coulda sworn I saw a sticker on one that said "Century", or something besides Altman. However, given my track record with the "Strand PC", I could be wrong, remind me to investigate.

As for naming them? My Dept Head has referred to them as chimney lights, as "they can only be placed in that orientation (lamp base pointing up) so the heat can escape".

The ones I have there are in pretty bad shape. We do have about a dozen in service in our other larger venue.

Next order of business:

Anyone ever had to completely disassemble a 6x22 because, for some reason, the template-holder holder was 180º out of alignment? That was not fun, but I got a new understanding of how lights are assembled. I was assuming during reconstruction that ever shutter is supposed to be sandwiched between two of those metal disks. I found two shutters on the same "plane" with two metal disks stacked ontop. Also, for the life of me, I couldn't get those **** shutters out of the fixture without breaking them.

P.S.
What do I do with the relic?

[gafftapegreenia]

That was not fun, but I got a new understanding of how lights are assembled. I was assuming during reconstruction that ever shutter is supposed to be sandwiched between two of those metal disks. I found two shutters on the same "plane" with two metal disks stacked ontop. Also, for the life of me, I couldn't get those **** shutters out of the fixture without breaking them.
P.S.
What do I do with the relic?

I feel your pain with the 360's. In my rehabbing some 360Q's, I learned alot about their construction. Hands on experience, always the best! Those shutters, yes the only way to remove them it to cut them off or drill out the rivet and pull out the shutter. Only the "modern" 360Q's have provisions for shutter replacement.

As for the relic, like I said, clean it up and hook it up in the lobby before shows with a bucket for donations.

[Charc]

I feel your pain with the 360's. In my rehabbing some 360Q's, I learned alot about their construction. Hands on experience, always the best! Those shutters, yes the only way to remove them it to cut them off or drill out the rivet and pull out the shutter. Only the "modern" 360Q's have provisions for shutter replacement.
As for the relic, like I said, clean it up and hook it up in the lobby before shows with a bucket for donations.

I'm not sure if we are allowed to stoop as "low" as donations...

[gafftapegreenia]

Well then, use it as a tech table light a a sign of your insane geek-cool-nerd-tech awesomeness.

[gafftaper]

My college T.D. out here in Seattle taught me axials and radials... so it's not just a Chicago thing. I've never heard anyone call them "incandescents" out here. I've heard "Leko" used really generically... even used to describe a Source Four.


Charc, Derek has shown you the way. Take that antique and build yourself an ubergeek lamp from it. Or you can save it as the first part of your personal collection.


So you're at a Quaker school huh? I suppose that explains the extreme concern for your safety.