system re-vamp

[rgsw]

I am currently looking at a complete re-vamp of or school lighting system and I was wondering if anybody could recommend some good solutions.

Our current layout is two front of house bars - each carrying 8 sockets (2 per channel) and a further 4 bars (again carrying 8 sockets) over the stage.
We have a VERY old lighting board - Furse Regal - and I am looking at replacing this as the first item. I would like it to be easy to control moving lights with as I am thinking of buying two S4 revolutions as I love the S4's we currently have. This would obviously mean the installation of DMX universe.
Any board recommendations - bearing in mind that we have very limited space in our lighting box - 60cmdepth - 120cm width are max dimension for the board.

So can anyone provide some very rough costings - I'm sure ship will provide me with a brilliant solution and accurate quote (attempt to suck up).

I have already estimated at 8k for a dmx system and a replacement of our control rack to split the 4 channels per bar to 8 so obviously I would require/prefer a 48/96 board for spontaneity setups - estimated 5.5k for etc express 48/96 and a further 5k for two s4's revolution

I have my original application for a grant and would be more than happy to e-mail it to anyone for criticism

[bdesmond]

Hi there,

What kind of dimmers do you have? If you're thinking of replacing those, that's going to put a potentially bigger dent in your pocketbook than a console.

My recommendation for a console is a Strand 300. You can definetely get one for under five grand. You're probably goign to need to get DMX -> something conversion to plug into whatever your dimmmers run.

As far as the intels go, do you really need them? It sounds like you want them in order to have the cool toys. I would do some addiitonal research into them if I were you and figure out what ones are really suited for your environment. Varilite & Martin are a couple of manufacturers out there.

The DMX is not difficult or expensive to install. I'm not sure where you're getting eight grand to run some DMX cable out to the FOH catwalks and the electrics over the stage but I haven't seen your space.

As far as the grant application is concerned, if you want to mail it to me, , I'll read it over & send feedback.

[digitaltec]

Im just woundering why everyone seems to suggest getting a Stand desk? What is so good about them over a ETC or a Leprecon? Maybe I should start a new post on the subject. Im just curious. I have only used one Strand desk and I didn't like it all that much. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.

Thanks

[rgsw]

thanks very much for the advice so far.

i am only planning to have 2 dmx sockets per bar depending on cost. cause with 2 per bar that would be a total of 12 dmx points so if anyone could give a ball park figure. Ideally i would like 4 per bar but i'm worrying bout money.

i am definitely looking at replacing the dimmer rack in that 8k as the old one is once more indifferent (not trying to be controversial) by CCT's joint venture with Furse. to repeat myself i would like to have 48seperate dimmers (already have the plugs and wiring wired in but in pairs). I don't have a clue what the dmx system would need!

thanks desmond u should hve got my e-mail by now

[bdesmond]

Originally Posted by digitaltec

Im just woundering why everyone seems to suggest getting a Stand desk? What is so good about them over a ETC or a Leprecon? Maybe I should start a new post on the subject. Im just curious. I have only used one Strand desk and I didn't like it all that much. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.

Thanks

I'm a Strand guy because that's what I use. One thing I really like about their 300 series (and 500 I gues too) is that the board is exandable. YOu can purchase a 24/48 desk, get a bunch more fixtures, and say "hey, I want a 48/96 desk". You order the fader module, it shows up, you plug it in (toolless, you can do it with a door key though a flat blade is easier), punch in the code, and bam. You can also order submaster modules. This was what my vendor did the convincing with. With the ETC desk, you're SOL unless you buy a new one. One of the other cool things with the Strand desk here is that the modules are all connected with a CAT5 cable, so, theoretically, you could wall mount a submaster panel somewhere remote, or something like that.

I admittedly have played with an Express only a few times. I think that people need to look at other options, not just jump to ETC because that's all they've ever heard of.

[Les]

If you have a lower budget, I guess I would go with Strand. Try to stay away from Colortran though. If you go with ETC, they can be expanded, its just that on the Express, you have to hit a button to have access to all of your 'hidden' faders. That is, if you are running 110 channels, and your board will only accomodate 96. The more high-end models, such as the Expression series, has no faders. It has ten pages of 12 submasters, so other than the GM and the C/F sliders, that is all that there is on the desk. With 10 pgs x 12 subs, you can set the board up to run 'channel-per-sub' as long as you have fewer than 240 channels. However, since these do overlap, it may be hard to program a show using both channel 6 and 36 at one time. I would just reccomend programming your specials, effects, and areas onto the subs. For example, areas on page 1, specials on page 2, and f/x on 3. On page 4, you can program in 'looks'. I know you just need to know what board to use, so my point is, ETC's can be very accomodating, plus I doubt you will have over 192 channels; which the largest Express can handle with ease. In the long run, there are alot of good consoles out there, and you will probably love which ever one you get your hands on, and think it is the best... Your console is no better than the person running it, and vise-versa.

Here are a few of my suggestions:
ETC Express
Strand 300-500
Leprecon

[dj_illusions]

I am also a Strand guy!!

There are quite a few reasons why I like the Strand desks, but I think its important to realise I was converted to Strand, and yes it was my own choice, I wasnt forced or anything. Where I used to use any desk under the sun, I now always put down a strand for my gigs!

Alot of people, when first using a strand desk sit down and freak out because it initially looks so complex to use the desk, however once you use it and get a bit friendly with it, you will realise that they are actually very very simple desks to use, and very intelligent!
All the commands you type in are common sense, and you can program ot to do pretty much whatever you want through the use of groups and macros. for example, when using moving lights you can make a group that has them all pointing to the centre and in blue, you can then tell the desk that you want to assign that group to the flash button on sub 1, or one of its specially designed macro trigger buttons.

But as I said, they basically follow common logic and once you figure it out and spend some time with them they are very easy and a very user friendly desk to use...

I think I have made posts about this somewhere else, but after one show of using the desk, you pretty much know how to use every feature on the desk!

I would seriously suggest having a look at one and getting a demo!

[rgsw]

i was going to choose a strand 300 24/48 but decided against it as i couldn't get the offline editer to work (i know being picky) and i didn't like that fact that you had to have a huge compact pc sitting near the console.

chose an etc express 48/96 instead

[digitaltec]

You guys all have good reasons on why to use Stand consoles. I see your point where when you add more fixtures you just add on a wing. Which could be a handy feature, if your lighting rig is always expanding.

You got to keep in mind I work with consoles like the Grand MA, Maxxyz, Case, Hog II, and soon some Avolite consoles. Also, usually when I use static fixtures, I'm only using the bump buttons cause it's concerts or industirals.

But I will look more into the Stand line of consoles for installs and stuff. Thanks again for your input.

[bdesmond]

Originally Posted by rgsw

i was going to choose a strand 300 24/48 but decided against it as i couldn't get the offline editer to work (i know being picky) and i didn't like that fact that you had to have a huge compact pc sitting near the console.

The computer is smaller than a new dell optiplex or dimension in the desktop size case. I'd guess it's about 24" x 12" x 4". Because the desk sits in a right angle fashion, I just put the box behind it. Evnetually I'll probably move it into a rack, but, that's in all my spare time.