Design Issues and Solutions -

[jamesmiller]

My name is James Miller, and I work for Hyd Productions. We are planning an upcoming tour, and they have placed me in charge of the technical plans for the tour.

We will be traveling mainly to typical “Road-House” theaters that are setup for touring Broadway shows, etc. I have worked in theater for a long time, but I have never had to deal with the technicalities of a tour before. I was hoping that someone here could fill me in some questions that I have about lighting?

Anyway, I really need to know how to handle the lighting for the shows. The show has not yet been picked, but it will be rather large, with a somewhat complicated lighting plot. As such, I need to know how to handle the setup of lighting in venue.

Do we just create a brand new lighting plot for each theater? Do we use one master plot for ALL theaters? Do most shows tap into the dimmers and wiring already located in the theater, or do most shows bring there own dimmers and wiring?

At our theater, we have SP plug-in bars for the lighting 6 fixtures at every 24” spacing on the electric batons, is this how most road show theaters are setup as well? On this one, I’m curious on how to wire our fixtures into the house wiring and dimmer sets… (ex: how long the plug cord needs to be to run from the fixture to the Tye in point).

Thanks for any help you can offer, and I look forward to being a productive member of this forum!

Thanks Very Much,
James Miller

[BillESC]

I'll assume you're not planning on carrying your own lighting.

You're best bet is to advance the venues and obtain their hanging light plot. Using the venues plot re-circuit and color as required for your production. This should be done for each venue.

You can request that fixtures be moved as required for special purposes but for the most part the less demanding you are the better the day will be.

[jamesmiller]

We do have the required fixtures for the production, so I was thinking of just hanging our fixtures, and tying them into the house dimmers... That way we don't have to rely on every theater to have the same kind of lighting to pull off a consistant look.

Although, if its a more standard practice you use house lighting, thats an option as well.

Thanks Very Much!
James Miller

[Footer]

First, read this. Why Didn't I Think of That?

Agreed. There are 3 ways you can go on this one, and varations of each.

1. Carry everything yourself. This being, power, dimmers, lights, color, everything. Usually you still have to use the Houses FOH, so make that simple (3 color wash in 10 areas). This will allow you to get exactly what you want, including hanging positions over stage.

2. Send out a plot with the rider. Depending on the show and how much the venue wants you there it is possible to send ahead a full plot. You will need to have a plot that is pretty basic as far as hanging positions goes. You might walk into a space with 6 electrics and a space with 2, you never really know. Get the theatres you are visiting technical packets and shoot for the best space, and then adapt to the rest.

3. Use what the house has in the air. This method is by far the easiests. Most venues have 2 systems from the front, side, top, and back with a 3 colored cyc. Most have a few specials hanging on the 1st elec and 3rd elec. Not all do. Some might just have Front and back white light. If you advance the show correctly, you should be able to at least get a feeling of what each venue has.

I would try to send a plot along, however, don't always expect that it will get hung correctly. Also, remember you are going to be limited on focus time, so hanging 150 lekos that all need strange shutter cuts might not be the best idea. You need to also consider color, try to have the venue supply it but carry some in the truck anyway. If you are carrying movers, you need to have everything for them including power distro etc.

I would avoid carrying your own lights and running on the house dimmers. I think that might just kill you time wise. Not every place is circuited the same, its going to be a bear to get everything hung, circuited, and patched in 1 day for an evening show. Most touring road shows bolt all their fixtures to unistrut and pre wire and color them. The unistrut clamps onto the pipe and one soco connects to it. 6 lights hung and circuited in 2 minutes.

I would bring your own console if at all possible. Inhibitive faders are going to become your new best freind. Have fun, its going to be a trip.

[jamesmiller]

Thanks for the information everybody! We intend to have the lighting controlled by a compter DMX controller, which we will carry. This is due to the complecated lighting in the show, and that fog machines, strobes, etc will also run off of DMX.

So pretty much, its either use our own lighting that is pre-wired and attached so that it can be hung very quickly, or just use the house instruments. It's not really a big deal to us, because all the venues I have seen technical information for have plenty in the way of lighting.

I like the idea of having all the fixtures pre-circuited and bolted though, and I'll be looking into the feasability of this. Only problem is, we will only have 2, 53' trucks to carry EVERYTHING. Also, due to the complex nature of the show, we proably will not be arriving day of the show. More than likely the day before.

Obviously, the less technical way to do it is to just pack everything in, pre-wired and our dimmers, to patch into the road power connections. That's about the only way to get a constant lighting plot from theater to theater.

Anyway thank you again!
James Miller

[SteveB]

Originally Posted by jamesmiller

We do have the required fixtures for the production, so I was thinking of just hanging our fixtures, and tying them into the house dimmers... That way we don't have to rely on every theater to have the same kind of lighting to pull off a consistant look.

Although, if its a more standard practice you use house lighting, thats an option as well.

Thanks Very Much!
James Miller

This seems to be an economic question, I.E. is the tour promoter expecting to pay to truck the lighting gear around ?, or are the venues expected to provide it ?. Who's paying for the time to hang your gear and IS there time ?, or is it faster and cheaper to use house stuff.

If you carry lighting, I would bring dimmers and control - the whole schebang. If a space has the fixtures you need, in the quantitiy you need, chances are they have dimmers and control.

If you bring it all (which most Broadway type tours do) you should expect the house to provide, a minimum of XXX amps per phase of power (usually 400), plus a pre-rigged FOH sufficient to handle the event requirements, some method of connecting your control system to FOH dimmers (usually via a DMX send or an in-house FOH circuit termination box), plus follow spots, plus power for audio, etc, etc...

In this case, I would be researching the venues house plots to ascertain the minimum FOH you will find and tell the designer to design with that limitation in mind, including number of follow spots.

If you expect the venue to provide lighting, then expand the research to include house systems, including unit types and quantities, number of circuits, locations, control, etc... with the idea that you limit the tour plot you expect folks to hang to something reasonable.

Note that getting the designer to limit the system to what the typical house can provide, is a long dead art, in my experience and I have yet to meet the tour LS that actually researches the spaces, despite the fact that most all spaces have either the spec's on-line, or at least have contact info. online. Well, not true, as I had a LD/SM last Sunday that was very proficient at her planning.


Or do it like the Kennedy Center Children' Theater does it. Hire a designer to design for a month's worth of events at Kennedy Center, then provide an adapted plot into a generic touring version for the assorted houses to hang. Leave it up to the tour lighting supervisor (who usually was not involved with the month's run at Kennedy) to discover that the plot needs to be adapted to something smaller (sometimes MUCH smaller) in about half the houses, all while on the road, attempting to stay ahead of the deluge of e-mails, cranking out adapted plots for houses like mine that have it written in to the contract that YOUR agent signed, that you will use the Rep Plot as existing in the theater or pay for the change and back. I've done 5 KCCT events in as many years and the crew is ALWAYS un-happy (with tour management) and never returns with a tour.

Side Note that we have a 5 truck tour of Annie coming in May. They have a requirement for a 60ft, grid as MINIMUM. Their agent signed the contract for our venue, where the grid is 42ft., without any attempt at contacting any of the tour tech personnel (who might not have been hired at the time) to find out if our space is too small. As Annie has a LOT of scene changes, usually many done with drops, one wonders how this is going to work. WE signed the contract with the OLD rider that is NOT the same one we just got in the mail, that now says 60ft. grid, PLUS 2x400 amp, 3 phase services. We have 2. but the second is 100ft away in the other theater. Sigh. Tough titties on the 60ft grid though.

Steve Bailey
Brooklyn College

[bdkdesigns]

Sounds like you have a much larger scale than what we have, but here is an example of the rider for the current national tour that we have out on the road. Montana Rep

[jamesmiller]

Annie tours with 5 trucks? Wow. From the show I seen (the national tour) a while back, it sure didnt look like they had 5 trucks worth of stuff. Although that huge-a** staircase had to take up 1 truck all by itself...

Based on my experiance, for a show of this size and requirement, I have put into the technical rider a minimum fly space of 1.5 x the height of the proscenium. So if the proscenium is 20', the high trim for the batons must be at least 50'. So I guess even we are approaching 60'.... heh. We will have a fairly complecated fly plot as well.

Also, based on what information I got from the production company, this is a self-booked tour. AKA: all expenses paid by the company, including theater rental and labor. I don't know if this has changed or not, but thats the last I heard. As such, the theater has no expense on the show.

They have several shows selected, but I don't want to make that information public yet without the companies permission, since they have not made the show public yet themselves.

[SteveB]

Originally Posted by bdkdesigns

Sounds like you have a much larger scale than what we have, but here is an example of the rider for the current national tour that we have out on the road. Montana Rep

This tour's at our venue 4/19. Third time for MT and always a well organized tour. Fits our space as well.

Omaha Children's Theater is another good tour, well organized

Maybe check out MT and OCT's websites to view their tech info.

Steve B.

[SteveB]

[QUOTE=jamesmiller;121422]

"Annie tours with 5 trucks? Wow. From the show I seen (the national tour) a while back, it sure didnt look like they had 5 trucks worth of stuff. Although that huge-a** staircase had to take up 1 truck all by itself... "

Well, maybe 3 trucks this time. Evita and Joseph were both 5 so it always seems like that's the norm. The space has room for maybe 2-3 trucks worth of scenery/lights. etc... always seems like 20 lbs of stuff in a 5 lbs box.

FWIW, I'd bring everything, lights, sound etc... this way fewer variables, AS ALONG AS IT ALL FITS IN THE VENUE !. Joseph left it's LED wall on truck 5, which was a shame as it made the show and our audience didn't get the benefit of a key part of the scenic design, so what's the point ?.

If you bring it all, you only have to make sure it all fits and that's easier in some respects that adapting each and every time, but your call depending on the complications of the plot. It's probably a break even as to whether it's faster to have a house pre-hang and load color (IF THEY DO IT CORRECTLY), with just a focus and load cues into the console, OR to rig all your stuff, with MOST of it pre-focused (if the rig hangs in the same place every time) and only requiring a few touch ups as well as FOH. So many big tours use the bulk on ML's these days that any focus is the few conventionals as well as some touch up of position palettes.

We do get a kids show every 2 years or so, that travels with it's own truss for scenic and lighting. Nothing complicated, they simply ask for 24-30 circuits on deck, to which they plug in all their truss mounted fixtures, so it makes sense for them to not carry dimmers. They do carry MLs, as well as a console to run it all. I see that often, a company that brings nothing but a console, usually an Express or Expression, though had an Australian dance company 3 weeks ago that had a Strand 300 that I ran. The 1,4 & 7 keys on the keyboard were intermittent.....

And sorry 'bout any attitude on my first post as I see it done poorly a lot and those instances tend to stick in my mind.

Steve B.