Basic Dimmers

[DarSax]

Let's say I'm in the market for ~96 permanent install 2.4kw dimmers. I know nothing about dimmer technology, nor about sinewaves or any of that stuff. If I was going to get them installed, I'd need to hire a contractor/lighting company to do it for me, so I don't know how much control over what brand anyways--it'd probably be by Barbizon, and I'd trust them over there.

Irregardless. Can you guys just tell me about some simple, cheap, reliable brands/products of dimmers for my own personal knowledge? I try to keep up with that information for other products, but for dimmers, I haven't a clue...


EDIT: Ballpark estimate. How much would this cost? Rounded to the nearest, I don't know, $5,000.

[soundlight]

ETC Sensor+ Sinewave dimmer modules are pretty close to "top of the line".

But ETC standard Sensor modules will do fine for all but the most discriminating venues.

NSI makes some good stuff, rather durable too. It always seems that NSI's consoles are "stubborn" in a bad way, but their dimmers are definitely "stubborn" in a good way - they just keep on going! I prefer the "DS" series, with the individually replaceable dimmer and control modules, but still maintaining the 19" rack format.

Colortran (now under Leviton along with NSI) makes some pretty good install dimmers, I know a place that has had a colortran 96 rack for quite a few years (10 or so) and it's still chugging along fine (I can't say the same for the original Colortran console - an Encore - it was upgraded to an ETC Express - and I got the Encore to fix up, but you still have to leave it on for it to maintain cues.)

[avkid]

Originally Posted by soundlight

an Encore - it was upgraded to an ETC Express - and I got the Encore to fix up, but you still have to leave it on for it to maintain cues.)

Did you replace the batteries??

[gafftaper]

The standard these days are probably Strand or ETC dimmers. NSI and EDI are worth looking at as well. EDI used to be a very big player 15 years ago but kind of got swept aside. I would be reluctant to go with any other brands.

Most dimmer manufacturers offer several quality levels. The Sinewave technology is VERY cool but probably about twice as much money. There's nothing wrong with the old technology, there are just some things it can't do. Sinewave dimmers eliminate buzzing inside the lamp filaments which means quieter operation and should also mean longer lamp life. Sinewave dimmers also allow dimming of ballasted lights like flourescents, HMI, and LED.

I was recently told by my Barbizon guy out West that they were no longer going to be Strand Dealers so that may limit your choices a bit if you are likely to have Barbizon do the work.

What is your console status? The future of lighting is Ethernet control, not DMX. Ethernet allows a level of communication between the console, dimmers, and lighting instruments themselves. Currently that level of communication is all proprietary. Although the new ACN standards will allow cross brand communication, it may not be 100%. So if you are at all considering upgrading your console in the next 10 or 20 years it would be best if you go with the same brand of dimmers. All dimmer racks will work with your old DMX console, it's the compatibility with future console purchases that may be a problem. If you tend to be an "ETC guy" when it comes to consoles I would definitely purchase an ETC dimmer rack to be on the safe side for the future.

[DarSax]

ETC's probably the best bet. I don't know what the status is on the "new line of consoles to replace the Express," but if they take too long in coming or are too expensive, I'm going to say screw it, and buy an Express 24/48.


Edit: Hate to be pushy, but do you guys have any idea at all about price? I'd like to find out, like...within the next hour, though I realize that's a huuuuge wish.

[Van]

IMHO ETC Sensors are a great way to go, they have great support and parts and repair are widely availible. I have a long and distinguished hatred of anything made by NSI and they would have to install an automatic coffee maker / foot massager into their rack systems that would automatically deploy at the snap of you fingers, before I'd even consider looking at them to install in my theatre.
If you have the Money, however, you simply cannot beat ET's IPS dimmers. Hands down the best dimmers with the most capabilities and safest operating ability. Don't get me wrong they are expensive, but you simply can't beat them. No scrimmer buzz, forward or reverse sinewave dimming, Auto-sensing of inductive loads, and faster short resopnse time than a GFCI.

[soundlight]

$35K. That's a ballpark for the ETC 96 rack.

I priced an NSI Topaz 96 rack, fully loaded, at $30K though...

And you could get a set of 8 NSI 12x2.4K DS Rack Dimmers with a rack and wiring for about $20K or $25K.

None of this includes labor costs, so tack on another two thousand at least for that.

EDIT: The NSI DS series solution will actually only run you about $15K. And the modules are interchangeable. That price includes a seven hundred dollar, 35 space rack for the dimmers. While not the best solution, it's reliable and MUCH cheaper.

If you have the bux go with ETC sensor or NSI Topaz dimming.

[DarSax]

Put simply, !

Thanks, though. I may have run into some money for my theater, and right now we have a basically unusable board, 30 working 20 year old dimmers on a dangerous hard-patch system, rusty 20 year old fixtures, and I need to figure out what to spend money on.

edit: Besides Van...any other thoughts on NSI? I might have $50k, tops, astronomically, for this whole project. There is no "future" in my school, we're already 20, 25 years behind...

[gafftaper]

My suspicion from the ETC people I've talked to is that "EOS Jr." is up next some time this spring or summer and maybe the lower end replacments will come out next fall at LDI. But they don't seem to be in any hurry. They also aren't beneath a quick surprise announcement like that cute little Smartfade. So who knows. I would take a look at Congo Jr. You can get one for around $12,000 and it's got a ton of features in it. The biggest complaint I hear is the programming language... is different. It takes 10 whole minutes to learn. I've seen 3 hands on demos now and I'm very interested in picking up a full size Congo if I can.

Sorry I can't help you with pricing. The problem is it depends so much on the installation and package deal you get. Doing a quick search, I didn't even find a list price on the internet.

[BenFranske]

ETC, Strand and NSI/Leviton/Colortran are all good choices. I have worked with all three and for basic needs you would probably be happy with any of them. Most recently I've consulted on installs that used NSI/Leviton/Colortran, a few years ago I did some Strands and quite a few years ago some ETC Sensors.