Wrapping vs. tying cable

[kiilljoy]

When running cable across a grid or down a batten, is it better to tie the cable up with tie line or wrap the cable around the pipe? I think we wrapped it in college, and I have seen it done both ways recently. Partly past experience and seeming ease of labor makes me favor the wrapping method.

I've never been told if there is a reason for doing this one way over another. I am aware that wrapping the cable probably creates something of an inductor, but is it enough to hinder the operation of the dimmer/lights? Wouldn't coiling the cable at one end produce something of the same effect? As much as there are such things in this business, is there a standard way to do this? Number of ties or number or turns per foot or something like that?

[porkchop]

Originally Posted by kiilljoy

When running cable across a grid or down a batten, is it better to tie the cable up with tie line or wrap the cable around the pipe? I think we wrapped it in college, and I have seen it done both ways recently. Partly past experience and seeming ease of labor makes me favor the wrapping method.
I've never been told if there is a reason for doing this one way over another. I am aware that wrapping the cable probably creates something of an inductor, but is it enough to hinder the operation of the dimmer/lights? Wouldn't coiling the cable at one end produce something of the same effect? As much as there are such things in this business, is there a standard way to do this? Number of ties or number or turns per foot or something like that?

I tend to tie cable up, it makes it easy to manage large amounts of cable and it's what I'm used to so I can find a single cable to remove it easier. I also feel it's easier to add on cable to the mess that way, but that's probably more a personal preference thing.

AS far as how many ties or the distance I have no rule of thumb what ever it takes to have focus slack at the fixtures and have the cable be reasonably close to the pipe.

[gafftaper]

Both Wrapping and tying is ok... depends on what you are doing... as long as you don't wrap too tight... remember cable doesn't like to make 90 degree turns.

The negative to wrapping is that it may get in the way of something you want to add later and be a pain in the butt to remove where tieline can be released and retied quickly.

[MNicolai]

The only acceptable way to do it where I work is tieing it up. Wrapping cables around a pipe doesn't necessarily create an inductor (correct me if I'm wrong) because it's not as if you're leaving it in coil. Our reason is ease of accessibility. If you have a bunch of cables wrapped around the batten then if something doesn't work or has to be replugged for some reason it's a pain to track cables down. If a cord is plugged wrong accidently it just became a huge project to figure out which cable is going to right place and which isn't.

Another issue is neatness. If there a bunch of cables twisted around it's a mess, especially if you're still hanging lights. Even worse though, when it comes to strike if you have them just tied on, you can untie the lines and drop them all to the ground and they'll remain relatively untangled, but if you twist them around it takes more time to strike them, especially if you have a lot of them, and then when they're all struck it's more likely they're tangled.

[porkchop]

Originally Posted by MNicolai

The only acceptable way to do it where I work is tieing it up. Wrapping cables around a pipe doesn't necessarily create an inductor (correct me if I'm wrong)...

I got to agree with you for the most part, if you wanted to do something really odd and make the wraps really close together (like touching concentric rings) you would create an inductor, it'd be a really big version of what happens every time you start you car. But like I said that'd only happen if you got way too creative with your wraps, for the most part I have to say ties over wraps for neatness and the fact that you don't always get it right the first time.

[Marius]

Somewhere in the deep, dark, forgotten past I was told in no uncertain terms that wrapping was wrong. I have no idea who or when, but since it made sense to me I stuck with it. Aside from all the very good reasons to tie rather than wrap that have heretofore been mentioned, one other is that should you need to add an instrument at the last minute it is easy to undo a couple of the ties, hang the instrument, then retie. If you have totally mummified the pipe that would be much more difficult. And never gaff a cable to a horizontal piple.

Rick T.

[Jezza]

Wrapping is unacceptable -- destroys the internal "right hand" spin of the conductors underneath the insulation thus rendering it forever "kinky" -- IMO unusable. Wrapping renders the batten inoperable as faults can never be found and adding additional fixtures is a nightmare. Wrapping is ugly and is the lazy solution for the electrician who doesn't want to look on the ground for the piece of tie line that is undoubtedly there.

Tieing up nice 1' loops of excess cable with a clove hitch to the batten is generally the acceptable approach. I'm a big proponent of the double stacked batten system -- one for cable and one for instruments. Its a dream to work on.

[MNicolai]

Originally Posted by Marius

Somewhere in the deep, dark, forgotten past I was told in no uncertain terms that wrapping was wrong. I have no idea who or when, but since it made sense to me I stuck with it. Aside from all the very good reasons to tie rather than wrap that have heretofore been mentioned, one other is that should you need to add an instrument at the last minute it is easy to undo a couple of the ties, hang the instrument, then retie. If you have totally mummified the pipe that would be much more difficult. And never gaff a cable to a horizontal piple.

Rick T.

Is that the truth. If you tape cables to horizontal pipes it's unacceptable. The most you can even do on vertical booms is spike tape that is to make the booms visible in the wings. Affixing cables with gaff tape is a waste of tape, time, and a pain in the butt to strike. I think the absolute worst thing you could do is tape a cable to a pipe using something aside from gaffer's tape...

Originally Posted by Jezza

Wrapping is unacceptable -- destroys the internal "right hand" spin of the conductors underneath the insulation thus rendering it forever "kinky" -- IMO unusable. Wrapping renders the batten inoperable as faults can never be found and adding additional fixtures is a nightmare. Wrapping is ugly and is the lazy solution for the electrician who doesn't want to look on the ground for the piece of tie line that is undoubtedly there.

Tieing up nice 1' loops of excess cable with a clove hitch to the batten is generally the acceptable approach. I'm a big proponent of the double stacked batten system -- one for cable and one for instruments. Its a dream to work on.

We actually have electrics with two upper battens and about 16" or so of space between them; the downstage batten is used for the circuit raceways with 18" leads for each circuit, then the upstage pipe can be used for for cabling or for really complex lighthangs, and then the lower pipe is used only for hanging lights. If you took an isosceles triangle and made the base parallel to the ceiling, that's how all of our on-stage electrics are configured.

[Grog12]

Originally Posted by Jezza

Wrapping is unacceptable -- destroys the internal "right hand" spin of the conductors underneath the insulation thus rendering it forever "kinky" -- IMO unusable. Wrapping renders the batten inoperable as faults can never be found and adding additional fixtures is a nightmare. Wrapping is ugly and is the lazy solution for the electrician who doesn't want to look on the ground for the piece of tie line that is undoubtedly there.
.

Not to mention you run the risk of creating one of these

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnet

Short answer don't be lazy and tie up your cable.

[kiilljoy]

I can see how wrapping can create problems in adding fixtures, and tracing problems. In the particular grid I'm using, I haven't experienced that yet. Anytime I've had to add a light or move a light, I've been able to work around my cabling. Probably helps that I'm the only one dealing with it and that it's only about 8' from the floor. Now, the point about kinking the cable is something I had not thought of. Anyway, all good information to know.