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2k and 5k fresnels

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by stantonsound, Aug 16, 2007.

  1. stantonsound

    stantonsound Member

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    Quick question. I am a little out of my element, as I do not usually work with the larger fresnels, but I need to use 2K, 5k, and 10k lights this weekend. We have the power, that is not the problem, but what type of power do they use? Are they just high amperage fixtures, or do they use a higher voltage?

    I think they use the 60A or so 120volt style stage pin plugs, but the rental shop (they don't stock them, it is a subrental through them) said that they have a transformer box like a followspot.
  2. Footer

    Footer Senior Team Senior Team Premium Member

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    Well, they very well could be HMI or some other type of discharge lamp and have a douser of some type on them. Just be sure to pre-warm the lamps before running them to full, you can blow those lamps pretty quick if they are traditional lamps. If they have a ballast of any type, odds are you will not be able to dim them without a douser.
  3. Van

    Van CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    Depends, some of the larger units use 110v and a "standard" albeit Big globe, < call 'em globes when dealing with movie guys and Aussies> A DPY or DTY, CMX will be in most 2K or 5K. I don't remember if there is an incandescent 10k or not, I bet Ship could tell you. Most 10k and larger units that I have dealt with, have a "head" and come with a "leader" to get from the head to the fixture. Let me try that again, most 10k and larger are 220/240, you supply them with a 60 80 or 100 amp Bates connector. The bates looks like a GSP but much bigger. The "head" is a transformer to supply higher voltages to the fixture itself. In the case of HMI fixtures, there is no "dimming" availible. The fixtures will come with a "scrim Box". "Scrims" look kind of like window screens on a round, thin metal, frame. They usually come in a set of three. One is a looser weave and only covers half the frame, the two other have increasingly finer weave so as to cut down the light further. So you don't really "dim " these fixtures, you blockthe light you don't want. Scrims slip into what you might think is a gel fame holder on the front of the fixture. Typically if you need to color correct, or simply color one of these fixtures you attach a full or half sheet or color to the front side of the scrim using "C-47's" < clothes pins> Sometimes you get a tubular metal frame that sits on the front of the fixture, If you get one of these you typically use "Snot Tape" to attach the gel to the frame. Another accessory sometimes included in a scrim bag or just with the fixture will be a "cookie" typically a 1/2" or 1/4" piece of plywood with organic shapes cut out of it. This is essentially a break-up gobo for an HMI fixture.
    If the rental house told you there is a seperate box then you can be assured these are HMI fixtures, and most likely you will need to supply them with 220/240. Remember you'll be dealling with really big, Really hot. fixtures. IASTE requires every fixture of this type to have a "Tender" or a person that must stay within 10 to 12 feet of the fixture for the entire time that it is in operation. This is for the saftey of the fixture and people around it.

    Hope that helps, I'll check back in later if you have more questions.
    stantonsound likes this.
  4. stantonsound

    stantonsound Member

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    Thanks Van. Perfect. That helps a great deal. I am doing big lighting at a racetrack, and must overpower the ambient track lighting to create dramatic effects for the intros and victory lane.....at least that is what the design says. They want the big fresnels, so I want to know a little about them. I have a few electricians on hire, so I really hope that someone knows about them. If not, I am in trouble, or at least I will not use them!

    I am planning on using lasers through CO2 cannons as well as the small portable search lights, gelled, with the beams going through the 8 F100's and a handful of AF1000 strobes. Paired with 12 parbars loaded with S4 pars with 750 watt lamps, I hope it will get the job done! (I tried, but pyrotechnics are not allowed.....) They hired me yesterday and the show is Saturday.

    I will post pics.
  5. Van

    Van CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    Whoa ! Ambitious. How about a couple hundred ACLs in the mix, just for fun.

    Seriously, Good Luck.
  6. Grog12

    Grog12 CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    OOOh or a couple of Shoguns!!!!!

    ((<<<----Really wants one)))
  7. JD

    JD Well-Known Member

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    Just watch out for the 208 volt vs 240 volt thing. Many of the large older ballasts are transformer type as compared to electronic, and they are not tolerant of the difference in voltage. You might want to give both the rental house and the venue a call to confirm the operating voltage and what is available.
  8. Logos

    Logos Active Member

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    OK things are a bit quiet and I seem to have lost Chris15 and Hughsie89 completely. I am feeling a little lonely but that's no reason to be rude behond my back. We call them lamps too. If they were domestic we'd call them bulbs I might due to my English experience under stress call them bubbles but I would never call them globes.
  9. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    All should be 120v as specified. They would say HMI Fresnel if they intended other than incandescent. Not a big deal - don't unplug them under load. As Van says, the screens to dim if not dimmers of sufficient size in addition. Interesting screens.

    Most likely, those supplying the gear know lots about the gear, stay to your morals and safety but give with questions of understanding what they are doing (get them to explain in a nice way to help you understand) what's going on. Gonna be a different experience these lights. Will the 750's punch thru? Yea probably sufficiently for the film given the directed instead of diffused and spread light. Not the on film even if you cannot see it.

    For me, na, got such gear at work except the 10K in other than LED or 2K re-lamped/worked fixture. We don't use 10K but have lots of 2K and 5K Fresnels. Most often the 750w S-4 Leko plays nice with it on shows.
  10. stantonsound

    stantonsound Member

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    Actually, I lucked out. We used 8 bars of S4 pars lamped with 750's, 3 ACL bars, and two search light trailer units with four 10k lights on each. I added some big martin strobes (normally I hate strobes....but they worked), 12 rotating police beacons (it is an effect that you can see in the daylight, so I figured it would work well), and some 10 degree 2k lekos. I wanted to use lasers, but we ran out of time in the set up (only had 6 hours, including rigging time!).

    I had never worked with a 2k leko, nor had I seen one, but an older guy that I work with had bought them at an auction and they worked very well. They were about 5 feel long and very heavy, but it could bake the paint off of a car if you weren't careful.

    I tried to get the whole tour, and gave them a proposal including 4 shoguns, but I have not heard back. I will most likely subrent them from someone else, but I would love to own a couple of them!
  11. Van

    Van CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    Glad It all worked out for you !
  12. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    old Mole Richardson Studio 2K Fresnels are by far different than say an Altman 2000L Studio Fresnel. Sounds like you describe old school tanks.

    They work, just as with all often have interesting things and new or old unless the lamp bases are cared for, often deteriorate in a big way. This and the old studio fresnel porcelain parts of the lamp bases often don't survive transport well & the wiring is often fried.

    None the less, old school or new school which is much more similar to say a Altman 165Q with crank handle, is all besides the point. Same concepts.

    Kind of a shame you didn't get to work with them, always fun to learn from a new or old piece of gear.
  13. Van

    Van CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    I used to have 4 Mole-Richardson 2K's hanging in a theater I worked in. Everybody else was afraid of them. Then they "upgraded" from a bunch of 6k dims to a colortran rack with 1.2's in it and we couldn't use them anyway.
  14. Logos

    Logos Active Member

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    Did they bite?
  15. Van

    Van CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    No, They'd occasionally jump at someone, but they took a shine to me.......:rolleyes:
  16. Logos

    Logos Active Member

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    I'm sure all you had to do was throw them a photon or two.

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