Emergency DMX takeover

No, I was thinking of "the only 10V dimming system I've ever heard of in a 35 year career that's touched on damn near every discipline that wasn't medicine." :)

I expect that it's probably suboptimal for both of those to be called "10V dimming". :)
And damn those architectural pukes for attempting to usurp our standard, anyway! :)
However, if we just count luminaires, guess who's winning? Don't forget, we threw this control method in the garbage in 1986--the year DMX512 was adopted (I was there). It shouldn't surprise us too much that someone else modified (perverted?) it for their market's purpose.

Well, if their design post-dates our deprecation, I guess I'll allow it, especially if the change made it cooler. :)
 
So, after some more ground truth, it turns out the rooms already have mickey-mouse lights, and in one of the two rooms, the dimmers are wall-box Lutrons, which appear to be being controlled wirelessly from an adjacent box mounted on the wall, which is listening to 3 or 4 Lutron decora sized 6-button panels.

Hopefully, I can find a way to drive those via DMX, and also to retrofit them in the other room.

And, y'know, find out what they are, since they're not labeled where you can see them. Pics to follow, after Workflow. :)
 
So, after some more ground truth, it turns out the rooms already have mickey-mouse lights, and in one of the two rooms, the dimmers are wall-box Lutrons, which appear to be being controlled wirelessly from an adjacent box mounted on the wall, which is listening to 3 or 4 Lutron decora sized 6-button panels.

Hopefully, I can find a way to drive those via DMX, and also to retrofit them in the other room.

And, y'know, find out what they are, since they're not labeled where you can see them. Pics to follow, after Workflow. :)
Look at ETCs echo line. Could be something inexpensive modules that fit and give you DMX control.
 
As discussed in a different posting thread 3 or 4 months ago, anything that requires me to replace in-box dimming on this project with something like a Sensor bumps the cost up $3-8k *just for electrical labor*, not counting the actual dimmers.

I don't need theatrical-grade control on the house lighting; if I can find a way to take over the Lutron's, I'll take it.
 
As discussed in a different posting thread 3 or 4 months ago, anything that requires me to replace in-box dimming on this project with something like a Sensor bumps the cost up $3-8k *just for electrical labor*, not counting the actual dimmers.

I don't need theatrical-grade control on the house lighting; if I can find a way to take over the Lutron's, I'll take it.
I didn't say Sensor - I said Echo. Look at their zone controllers. Not "theatrical grade" but still ETC and I think several hundred dollars. Just saying look at what you might spend to drive the existing with DMX.
 
I didn't say Sensor - I said Echo. Look at their zone controllers. Not "theatrical grade" but still ETC and I think several hundred dollars. Just saying look at what you might spend to drive the existing with DMX.
I looked at the ETC echo page, and Sensor were the only actual dimmers I saw listed.

Do you have a product page link for in-box, Bill?
 
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Ah, those. I bypassed them because they didn't look in-wall; they're not. They apparently expect to bolt onto a blank cover through a hole, leaving the LV and the dimmer outside the wallbox.

I might could get by with building a box around the remains, and the 600W limit might be good enough, but the DMX interface in that system appears to allow *Echo* to drive DMX lighting, rather than the other way round, unless I'm badly misunderstanding their description.
 
Ah, those. I bypassed them because they didn't look in-wall; they're not. They apparently expect to bolt onto a blank cover through a hole, leaving the LV and the dimmer outside the wallbox.

I might could get by with building a box around the remains, and the 600W limit might be good enough, but the DMX interface in that system appears to allow *Echo* to drive DMX lighting, rather than the other way round, unless I'm badly misunderstanding their description.

Well, you could wire nut the feed and load in the existing box and put a blank cover on, and install this anywhere between the panel and the first light. Exposed or ACP ceiling - easy.

And while I admit some of the literature is not as theatre person friendly, I am pretty sure it works. Look at second page of data sheet:

• Supports DMX pass-through for real-time output of incoming level when recording snapshots
• Meets USITT DMX-512A specifications
• Supports live control and recording for the following fixture profiles:
-- Intensity
-- RGB
-- RGBA
-- RGBW
-- RGB_S (Selador Desire® D22, D40, Source Four® LED Series 1, Source Four LED Series 2)
-- RGB_SF (Desire D60)
-- IRGBS (ColorSource® PAR, Spot)

All I'm saying is if you want DMX control of the existing lights, this could be more economical than getting DMX to control a wallbox dimmer or dimmers, and be more reliable. I found the relay zone control a very cst effective way to control just a few worklight zones.
 
Well, you could wire nut the feed and load in the existing box and put a blank cover on, and install this anywhere between the panel and the first light. Exposed or ACP ceiling - easy.

And while I admit some of the literature is not as theatre person friendly, I am pretty sure it works. Look at second page of data sheet:

• Supports DMX pass-through for real-time output of incoming level when recording snapshots
• Meets USITT DMX-512A specifications
• Supports live control and recording for the following fixture profiles:
-- Intensity
-- RGB
-- RGBA
-- RGBW
-- RGB_S (Selador Desire® D22, D40, Source Four® LED Series 1, Source Four LED Series 2)
-- RGB_SF (Desire D60)
-- IRGBS (ColorSource® PAR, Spot)

All I'm saying is if you want DMX control of the existing lights, this could be more economical than getting DMX to control a wallbox dimmer or dimmers, and be more reliable. I found the relay zone control a very cst effective way to control just a few worklight zones.
I hadn't thought about in-ceiling. Might be conduit, thought.

As for the controller, though, again, that seems a box to allow *Echo controllers* to drive DMX fixtures.

Not a box to allow DMX controllers to drive Echo dimmers. Which is what I need.
 
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You need to check with your sources but I've been assured it does allow DMX to speak to Echo devices - in particular zone controllers - real time - by the factory and several reps. In any case, I posted teh question rather directly in the ETC Echo forum (which I see does not get much traffic.....)
 
I'd like to clarify how the Unison Echo DMX Scene Controller works. I was formerly the Product Manager that had this product developed, and am currently the Architectural Market Manager for ETC.

The DMX Scene Controller does have a DMX input. This input will pass-though DMX to the DMX output for live DMX control of the connected DMX fixtures. That DMX input does not control any other Echo products that may be connected to the control bus. It can be triggered by local control stations to playback DMX scenes/presets (cues for the consoles folks) in conjunction with other Echo enabled power products. The DMX input is only for setup of the scenes that are stored in the controller. Those scenes may also be configured using a mobile device app instead of a DMX console/controller if an EchoAccess interface is part of the system.
 
So not possible to operate an echo zone controller by dmx signal?

Jay - you were right and I was wrong - and was sure I was told differently by several sources who normally represent ETC well.
 
Ok; you think he said the same thing I think he said. Good. I'm not going crazy. :)

That said, as I've mentioned in a couple other threads, I've located a number of 1-gang 1kw dimmers which speak Zigbee/Z-wave, from GE, Leviton, and I think Lutron. I'm probably going to just buckle down and prototype an Artnet/sACN to Zigbee bridge.
 
Well, that remains to be seen; a competent electrician hasn't yet been asked for a quote on redoing the existing wiring to reroute it to a pack dimmer. But I expect that to be up into 4 digits, and the dimmers will only be in 3, so...
 
Very layout dependent I imagine. Intercepting a circuit in an electrical closet and installing a single DMX dimmer - lots of them for under $100 it seems - seems much less expensive. Or slip in an ETC Smartmodule for under $1000 - 20 amps over 4 zones.

Replacing wall box with one that can be DMX controlled - needs low voltage or data I presume.

Just seems the all the products necessary to keep it in a wall box add up and are less reliable and harder to service.

I am curious to know what you find on the Lutron - ZigBee etc route.
 
Very layout dependent I imagine. Intercepting a circuit in an electrical closet and installing a single DMX dimmer - lots of them for under $100 it seems - seems much less expensive. Or slip in an ETC Smartmodule for under $1000 - 20 amps over 4 zones.

Single DMX dimmers for under $100?

Even assuming they would have worked, if you meant those ETC ones, I think you're optimistic about their pricing.

Replacing wall box with one that can be DMX controlled - needs low voltage or data I presume

The Zigbee dimmers I'm looking at cluster around $50 each.

Just seems the all the products necessary to keep it in a wall box add up and are less reliable and harder to service.

I am curious to know what you find on the Lutron - ZigBee etc route.

Meetoo. :)

Reliable is an issue, though not about the dimmers proper, I don't think.

On the other side of the coin, the fewer things I make massive changes to, the fewer additional responibilities I acquire. I do feel the need, at least, to present the customer with more than one option (including, "don't worry about the house lights", an option we hope they won't take).
 
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Google "1 channel dmx dimmer". I was surprised and I have no praise for Lutron and Leviton wall box dimmers. The ETC is around $1000. It just seemed several devices required between dimmer and DMX, all of which need power and data in and out. (You could get a DMX controlled servo and turn the existing dimmer.) And I didn't look at Alibaba.

Should lead with new LED house lights and then your DMX work is done. Sell it on the RGB house lights!

I understand options.
 

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