208v over 19pin mult-cable

[Fluffy Pony]

So this probably has been discussed before...but I just want to make sure I'm understanding this correct.

I'm looking to purchase a power-distro. I'd like to set it up to run my Vipers and an LED Wall on 208v.

My question is, can I use a normal 19pin mult-cable for this? I know people do, but LEX only lists 125VAC on their 19pin extension cables. Is that 125VAC per conductor?

Second question, similar to the first. Can I use a powerCON break-out with 208v? The break-out would only be used for fixtures with auto-switching power supplies.

I'm new to 208v so please let me know if I'm way off! I know you are supposed to only use one type of connector (L6-20) for 208v service but I'm not sure how that relates to using the break-out with powerCON tails....

Thanks for any advice!

 

[STEVETERRY]

New section 520.68(D) in the 2023 NEC allows you to use six-circuit trunk cables at either 120V or 208V in the same facility under the requirements of (5) and (6) below.

However, your problem comes with using the powerCON at both 120V and 208V in the same facility. While the connector is rated at 250V, section 406.4(F) prohibits this. Only the multicircuit connector is exempt from 406.4(F). See below.


520.68(D) Special-Purpose Multicircuit Cable Systems.

Special-purpose multicircuit cable systems shall comply with the following requirements:
(1) Branch circuits shall be rated at not more than 20 amperes and not more than 150 volts to ground.
(2)Trunk cable types shall be extra-hard usage (hard service) or hard usage (junior hard service).
(3)The ampacity of trunk cables shall be determined in accordance with Table 520.44(C)(2)(1).
(4)Trunk cables, breakout assemblies, and multicircuit enclosures shall be listed.
(5)Section 406.4(F) shall not apply to multicircuit, multipole plugs or receptacles that are part of a special-purpose multicircuit cable system.
(6)All multicircuit, multipole connectors shall be clearly marked with the voltage of the branch circuits serviced by the connector.
(7)Installation and operation shall be performed by qualified persons.

406.4(F) Noninterchangeable Types.
Receptacles connected to circuits that have different voltages, frequencies, or types of current (ac or dc) on the same premises shall be of such design that the attachment plugs used on these circuits are not interchangeable.

ST

 

[Fluffy Pony]

New section 520.68(D) in the 2023 NEC allows you to use six-circuit trunk cables at either 120V or 208V in the same facility under the requirements of (5) and (6) below.

However, your problem comes with using the powerCON at both 120V and 208V in the same facility. While the connector is rated at 250V, section 406.4(F) prohibits this. Only the multicircuit connector is exempt from 406.4(F). See below.


520.68(D) Special-Purpose Multicircuit Cable Systems.

Special-purpose multicircuit cable systems shall comply with the following requirements:
(1) Branch circuits shall be rated at not more than 20 amperes and not more than 150 volts to ground.
(2)Trunk cable types shall be extra-hard usage (hard service) or hard usage (junior hard service).
(3)The ampacity of trunk cables shall be determined in accordance with Table 520.44(C)(2)(1).
(4)Trunk cables, breakout assemblies, and multicircuit enclosures shall be listed.
(5)Section 406.4(F) shall not apply to multicircuit, multipole plugs or receptacles that are part of a special-purpose multicircuit cable system.
(6)All multicircuit, multipole connectors shall be clearly marked with the voltage of the branch circuits serviced by the connector.
(7)Installation and operation shall be performed by qualified persons.

406.4(F) Noninterchangeable Types.
Receptacles connected to circuits that have different voltages, frequencies, or types of current (ac or dc) on the same premises shall be of such design that the attachment plugs used on these circuits are not interchangeable.

ST

Awesome, so if I understand correctly, you can run 208v with a powerCON connector; BUT, I should use the L6-20 break-out into an L6-20 male to powerCON input cable. That way there is no way to accidentally give a fixture 208v. Am I understanding correctly? Thanks!

 

[STEVETERRY]

Awesome, so if I understand correctly, you can run 208v with a powerCON connector; BUT, I should use the L6-20 break-out into an L6-20 male to powerCON input cable. That way there is no way to accidentally give a fixture 208v. Am I understanding correctly? Thanks!

That would be one approach, but you still have the potential problem of a 120V-only fixture with a powerCON panel mount male hanging next to a 208V fixture, also with a powerCON panel mount male. However, since the powerCON is listed as an "appliance coupler", you can treat it as part of the fixture. And practically speaking, 99% of powerCON fixtures are universal voltage, so the risk is low.

ST

 

[almorton]

Jeez, this sort of discussion makes me glad our power here in the UK (and Europe,in the main) is so much more straightforward.

 

[RonHebbard]

Jeez, this sort of discussion makes me glad our power here in the UK (and Europe, in the main) is so much more straightforward.

@almorton If only your rental houses could agree on one standard for their break ins & outs for the 16 contact multi pole connectors
they use. When our shop in Canada won the contract to build the the automation, pinball machines, & electrified props for the who's Tommy The Musical, the British producer hadn't agreed on their dimmer supplier and were considering three who each configured their 16 contact multi-pole connectors differently. We had to ship everything without the 16 pole connectors fitted and wire them in London once we knew who their supplier was. The fact we needed 3 phases on each of the six automated tracks opened a fresh can of worms.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard

 

[almorton]

These days the 19 and 37 way Socapex multis are pretty standardised so cables mate with each other.

 

[RonHebbard]

These days the 19 and 37 way Socapex multis are pretty standardised so cables mate with each other.

I think the 16 pole connectors may have been Harting. We have 19 pole Veam's and Socapex's. Our 37 poles are Pyle National.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard

 

[almorton]

Harting sounds right, they used to be used a lot.

We have a Harting multipole on our SM desk so it can be unplugged and installed elsewhere in the theatre for when we swap from prosc to arena or particularly in the round.

 

[SteveB]

Jeez, this sort of discussion makes me glad our power here in the UK (and Europe,in the main) is so much more straightforward.

Not really though. You do on occasion distribute 230/400 correct ?. Same issues

 

[STEVETERRY]

Not really though. You do on occasion distribute 230/400 correct ?. Same issues

But not to single-phase loads like luminaires. In the 230V entertainment industry, single-phase loads connected phase-to-phase with no neutral (therefore two ungrounded conductors) are extremely rare to nonexistent.

ST

 

[almorton]

As Steve says, connecting a load across 2 phases without a neutral just doesn't happen, its phase to neutral. Some motors use the 3 phases and no neutral when operating in delta mode.