# 3" Fresnel Buying

#### Charc

##### Well-Known Member
Not to hijack,

(Moved to a more related section for this post. B.Ship)

but it has to do with 3" fresnels... are there any commercially available besides the Altman 100Q? My quick search produced only one retailer, selling 'em at about 96 USD. I was hoping for something closer to 60 USD. Don't really care about the manufacturer or quality. These'll get used in maybe 6 shows in the next two years (afterwards, who cares? I'll graduate!)

Apologies for the hijack,
Charles

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#### gafftapegreenia

##### CBMod
CB Mods
Re: Fresnel Sizes

To anwer for the 3" size. $90 is probably what your going to pay for them new. In addition to Altman, Times Square also makes Inkies. I thought L&E once did, but their website offers no clues. Also keep an eye on ebay, every month or so another few 3" Fresnels come up for bid, usually Altmans or Kliegls. Would PAR 16/20's be appropriate for your application? #### Charc ##### Well-Known Member Re: Fresnel Sizes To anwer for the 3" size.$90 is probably what your going to pay for them new. In addition to Altman, Times Square also makes Inkies. I thought L&E once did, but their website offers no clues.
Also keep an eye on ebay, every month or so another few 3" Fresnels come up for bid, usually Altmans or Kliegls.
Would PAR 16/20's be appropriate for your application?
Ya know what side tracked me from my search was in fact PAR 16s. And I do plan on getting some, though I'm in the early stages of research on 'em. I figured I'd get some DJ type lights, but I can't find anything that really fits the bill. I'm not sure what the de facto wattage is, because the ones I found that I liked apparently have a maximum of 50 watts, when a post on CB once mentioned 75 watts. I guess a Diffuser might soften a PAR 16 up enough? I just thought that fresnel would be quite smooth, and nice to use way up close on the stage. The instruments I was looking at were these. Anyways, I want a black, PAR 16, that doesn't have to be really durable. I was considering chopping off the Edison connectors and using stage pin instead, but I figured I might plug them into our new portable event lighting (which is all Edison). I have yet to look into the cost of Edison-SPC adapters.

In terms of lamps, 120 volts, max 75 watts, considering 50 watts, but I dunno if that's now enough. I'm not sure on beam angle either (or rather VNS, WFL, etc.) I figured I'd want to get the widest possible, but without barndoors, I'm not sure.

#### icewolf08

##### CBMod
CB Mods
Re: Fresnel Sizes

If you are interested in going the PAR16 route you might want to look into L&E's PAR16's, they are more robust than many of the other ones and they are rated to 75w. Creative Stage Lighting also makes them, and they are less expensive than the AMDJ version, and virtually identical.

Like others have said, the 3" fresnel land is going to be around $100. #### ship ##### Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member Selecon has the “Frodo Fresnel.” ACT lighting lists it as one primary dealer that can get that gear. Most theater supply companies have accounts with any number of brands. Just because you can only find pricing in one place, doesn’t mean it’s not available. I’m Sure BMI and Production Advantage amongst a multitude of websites also list the Altman 100 Inkie in various prices, this in addition to any number of suppliers that have an account with Altman. Just about everyone has an account with Altman. Selecon, ARRI have 3" or smaller Fresnels even low voltage types. Times Square might make a 3" or smaller Fresnel that often could be very reasonable in price. (Couldn’t get onto their website.) Way back when I would contact Bash for the price on used Inkies. Potentially any number of used gear sites including Altman themselves - their rental house might have some available.$96.00 each list price ha? My how fast the price goes up, bought mine much cheaper years ago.

“Don’t really care about the manufacturer or quality.” “afterwards, who cares? I’ll graduate!” I hope that was a joke because those statements would about ensure nobody would hire you to work for them - ever. Yes at times something that will get you thru a few shows but not when followed up on a personal note by what followed. As a professional it should never matter the duration of time you will serve at your post, your career demands that at all times you do the best not just for you in making it easy, but look out for the theater and it’s future people using the equipment. A cost effective fixture perhaps, not something that will serve while you work for them and who cares not your problem after that. Very much an attitude change on your part necessary even if joke because it’s not.

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##### Member
We have six of these Arri 150's in our inventory. They are well made and have held up well thru 4 seasons of hard use. We do 30+ weeks of opera every year, our schedule and stage guys are not kind to gear. These fixtures cost more than the Altmans but if you have money to spend on them you'll be happy.

http://www.arri.com/entry/products.htm

#### soundlight

Not that they are better than Arri's (the arri's are better), but our Altman inkies take a whole lot of abuse each year. They're used in the light lab, on the set (as in screwed in to floors, walls, etc) for shows, and for lighting projects, and they're great. I've found both the Altman and Times Square units for $78. (Production Advantage and Stage Lighting Store, respectively). #### stantonsound ##### Active Member Hmm, too bad it's sold, these were the 3" Fresnels in question as mis-sold as a 2" Fresnel. What do you mean it is sold? #### avkid ##### Not a New User Fight Leukemia What do you mean it is sold? The new page format is confusing a bit if you're not used to it. The buyer/seller bar did not used to appear until after the auction ended. #### Charc ##### Well-Known Member “Don’t really care about the manufacturer or quality.” “afterwards, who cares? I’ll graduate!” I hope that was a joke because those statements would about ensure nobody would hire you to work for them - ever. Yes at times something that will get you thru a few shows but not when followed up on a personal note by what followed. As a professional it should never matter the duration of time you will serve at your post, your career demands that at all times you do the best not just for you in making it easy, but look out for the theater and it’s future people using the equipment. A cost effective fixture perhaps, not something that will serve while you work for them and who cares not your problem after that. Very much an attitude change on your part necessary even if joke because it’s not. Uh it was a bit of a joke, but in truth that's my expectation for any PAR 16 I buy. Since I plan to pay for these out-of-pocket, and foresee no use past two years, and plenty of abuse; I see no problem with expecting them to last a couple of years. That's not to say I wouldn't care about, I mean, I'd have payed for them after-all, and if they survive our theatre program, then I'll probably donate them. Ship, please don't think my attitude towards gear is "break it, and someone else well replace it." That is most definitely not the case. As our theatre program is quite limited in its gear and funding, I understand the importance have maintaining and saving every piece of gear. All I'm saying is that, since I want to experiment in lighting by using these little guys over the next two years, since we won't divert any funding towards them, I'm okay with spending my money, to have them invariably bite the bullet. #### icewolf08 ##### CBMod CB Mods Uh it was a bit of a joke, but in truth that's my expectation for any PAR 16 I buy. Since I plan to pay for these out-of-pocket, and foresee no use past two years, and plenty of abuse; I see no problem with expecting them to last a couple of years. That's not to say I wouldn't care about, I mean, I'd have payed for them after-all, and if they survive our theatre program, then I'll probably donate them. I would think real hard before you go buy equipment for your school out of pocket. This is probably not such a great idea. I know that most high school tech's feel like the school never gets them the equipment they need/want, but as a student, you shouldn't be spending your money on it. If it was your equipment that you were going to keep and use for yourself and loan to the school then I would think about it, but not if you are just going to leave it with the school. Also, why do you not see any future use from them after you leave? Don't you think that once you set a precedent people will follow? Once you have equipment, designers will want to use it. #### Charc ##### Well-Known Member I would think real hard before you go buy equipment for your school out of pocket. This is probably not such a great idea. I know that most high school tech's feel like the school never gets them the equipment they need/want, but as a student, you shouldn't be spending your money on it. If it was your equipment that you were going to keep and use for yourself and loan to the school then I would think about it, but not if you are just going to leave it with the school. Also, why do you not see any future use from them after you leave? Don't you think that once you set a precedent people will follow? Once you have equipment, designers will want to use it. Well in terms of students interested in lighting at my school. There'd be one... In terms of buying this out of pocket, I was thinking, it wouldn't be that expensive to get a cheap DJ style dimmer and console. Then I'd have a small portable lighting package. (I'll see if I want to spend all that money after the school gets their own portable event lighting.) #### ship ##### Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member Glad to hear that not caring was not the case, sorry to hear that you would consider funding your program by way of your own cash. As with others, you need a wall as it were between what's personal and even of on loan to a publically funded organization or at times even private non-for profit and even for profit organization away from your hopes of getting the job done and getting the job done well by way of you helping it. Seems we go to the other extreme here in you not lacking care, and instead caring too much. Wall up and control that love where you would and instead within the bounds of the budget and scope of the theater make majic thru other means. Don't do it, making art by way of your own pesonal budget is a really nasty hole to fall into which while it won't hurt you now will tend to become a nasty habit. Out of college, I quickly fell into a$2K hole for my own home theater which in the end hurt my credit rating and made me eat at best donuts if anything for dinner not just for months but for years in making up for while I could last afford it yet made art by way of the ease in just buying a bottle of glue to the extent of buying a table saw. Don't do it, stop right there, take a girlfriend and or friends out to dinner, buy a book or something and design otherwise other than spending personal money on a production. This even if ticket sales pay you back.

In the case of somewhere that cannot provide it's own, you have to punt. we are talking a 150w light fixture, if necessary some form of caged 150w lamp might just have to do amongst other options. Your budget for what you can afford verses what in saving for college and or a personal life should not be a factor and in fact were you to ask the administration would be frouned upon. Don't buy these lights or controllers, make do or within the program get what you need instead. Much more to learn by way of keeping that wall than solving the problems of the program for them.

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