Allen and Heath GL2200

[Hughesie]

How about that the GL2200 is no longer in production?

I definitely would not look at an external power supply as a negative, that's standard for large format consoles and in critical applications you find dual power supplies with auto switchover.

the one i worked with was strange, it came with two psu's but you could not connect both at the same time

which compared to the crest i worked on that had two psu's and they connected via daisy chain

psu1->psu2>desk

problem with that was it the second one failed it would be useless anyway
the point is you would have to change the cable in the back of the desk to switch them over.

 

[jkowtko]

i would say that after using the desk for a little while with the internal power supply i found a slight amount of noise through some of the sources that i required more gain for, also i don't like running a power lead to the desk right next to some inputs, just something about xlr metal plugs and power doesn't seem quite right. the external power supply ONLY sends what the desk needs and doesn't send 240v to the desk then have 1/2 of it grounded. after saying this i can imagine why the in built power would be better because the external power supply was very heavy.
also the fader movement, or ease of movement was annoying when i had the script resting on the desk and it slid down on the faders.
summary from my perspective
allen and heath, great brand name with great quality products and the 2200 was a great desk to work with and had no major drop backs
except it had no noise generator but you could just use a cd or ipod playing a test tone or something, the crest i worked on had a noise generator and my view is, it either has one option (white noise) or it takes up too much space (white noise nob, where to assign it, pink, sine wave, adjust sine wave)

Oops, I didn't read the manuals carefully enough ... it's got an internal power supply ... so that's one off my list. I understand the issue of noise, hopefully this won't be noticable as I try to run the power cables straight down the back of the booth and leave the signal cables horizontal on top.
Sound generator: the GL2200 has one, no? 1k and pink?
Faders: sound like this is the only remaining real issue ... as has been mentioned, one accidental bump on these seems like it can send the fader careening one way or the other ... I will have to be very careful with this.
Thanks. John

 

[SHARYNF]

Here goes some personal opinions:

If you set the gain structure correct on the mackie, you should not have any noise problems, it is easy not to set it up correctly and have the signal levels too low.

Considering all the other issues you have raised at your PAC, fixing speaker placement, and getting the reliability issues with your wireless would be a higher priority.

A&H is great, but this is an older board, and they take a bit of keeping on top of to keep them in great shape. A&H offers great service, that is probably the main reason people go with them.

SOOOO I'd fix what you have first, before moving on to add another item.

Sharyn

 

[Hughesie]

the gl2200, to my knowlage (eg i couldn't find one during use) does have a noise generator

the fader problem can be overcome and + it can be handy to be able to quickly flick them down during a huge scene change

 

[j_blinker]

Sorry to be slow into the mix (no pun intended), but the aux/group flip feature discussed earlier exists for 1 main reason; it is a dual function board. When the flip is engaged the desk is setup for monitors. The Aux masters are on the faders for better accuracy and resolution and the output is on the XLR jack NOT because its a better connection or more/less common but rather to make use on the inserts found only on the XLR outputs. When used as a monitor desk this is preferable because when you solo mixes the EQing for the mixes will affect your cans/ listen wedge too.

These boards have served me well on tons of shows. For theatrical productions the models with more mute groups and groups are handy.

 

[avkid]

the one i worked with was strange, it came with two psu's but you could not connect both at the same time.

A simple Transfer switch fixes this.

 

[jkowtko]

Here goes some personal opinions:
If you set the gain structure correct on the mackie, you should not have any noise problems, it is easy not to set it up correctly and have the signal levels too low.

I hear the noise when LR is set to unity and all other faders and groups (and I thought all pots) are turned completely off, and groups disconnected from the LR. Evidently the main has some low level noise that is fairly prominent -- I found a thread in the Mackie forum dated back in 2005 about this. The group faders, on the other hand, are much quieter (although not completely silent) even with the faders pushed to the top. So for the last few shows I was able to control the noise reasonably well by lowering LR to -10db and pushing groups to +5db (from Unity formerly) and then riding the channel faders a bit higher for the show.
NOTE: This noise cannot be easily heard on the PA ... only on the headphones and recording. For this production I daisy-chained two CFX boards together, so the wireless board runs it's main out to one input channel on the main board. I used the main so I could include FX from the wireless board, which routes only to main or aux, not groups. Otherwise I would have tapped out of the group outs directly, which are much quieter. I could have also tried aux out, but didn't have the time to test this out.

Considering all the other issues you have raised at your PAC, fixing speaker placement, and getting the reliability issues with your wireless would be a higher priority.
Sharyn

Sharyn, these projects are all somewhat orthogonal ... upgrading a board doesn't interfere with my ability (or inability) to resolve the other problems. I am working on them all at the same time, however I don't have a lot of time to devote to theater work and there are many obstacles out of my control, so the process has unfortunately been slower than I would like.

 

[SHARYNF]

This series from Mackie was not really designed for recording, the FX processor is not the quietest, but as you say it is not distracting on the actual speakers. As mixers age, the capacitors tend to start to go, and the faders get noisy. Most low end pa mixers will have a level of noise over head phones.

Sharyn

 

[TimmyP1955]

I used a GL2200 for three or four years. I had no noise problems, and had no troubles with the low-effort faders. The only complaints I ever had were with the lack of features - but for what it cost, it was a great console.

I would not want to use the faders as aux masters, as they are too handy as group masters. Plus, if you are having to adjust your aux masters that often, you have a problem IMHO. I never made more than one or two minor tweaks per night.

 

[j_blinker]

The aux to fader flip is definitly for when the board is being run as a dedicated monitor desk.

 

[museav]

JKOWTKO, if they are not used for long periods of time the Mains Insert jacks are known to give problems on some Mackie boards. This might even be worse with top mounted connectors, between dust and stuff getting in the jacks and simple oxidation and aging. A quick cleaning by inserting and removing a 1/4" TRS in a few times in the Mains Insert jacks might help.

Your main output graphic EQ settings on the CFX might also be affecting the noise levels, how is the EQ set? Also check the EFX return, that is another potential noise source between the group outputs and the main outputs.

Since you mentioned that the noise can be heard in recordings, what outputs are you using to feed the recorder?

 

[jkowtko]

I was daisy-chaining the output of the vocal board to one input channel on the main board, and I recorded off the main board. That input channel was coming in noisy.

I thought I had all the EFX feeds turned off, and the EQ was definitely set flat. The next time I need to use the main outs I'll check the insert jacks as you suggest.

Thanks. John