Automated Rake

Hey All,

So for the paramount I am doing a price out for a universal show deck. One that I can remove a row, replace it with platforms with track, remove the center section, add a turntable, etc. The big trick is they want an adjustable rake. So it can be flat for concerts and then add a rake for shows and avoid the cost of a crew coming in each time as sometimes the concerts happen during tech. The deck is roughly 50' wide and 40' deep, with the 50 platforms and frame and people, I am aiming for 15 tons of expected weight. I have several ideas that I would love feedback on.

Idea #1:
Hydraulic rams, have some sort of scissors mechanism that can lie flatish and have rams push on it from upstage (I have 6'9" upstage of my last useable lineset) thus causing it to lift and wham bam thank you mam. Pros: I know it will work, I cam get rams that have limits way above what I need. Cons: I am starting from scratch and have no good place for the HPU. I am also concerned with noise if it ever becomes an effect that will happen during a show, the control system, as well as the headache of match all the speeds exactly on the manifold so the stage isnt cockeyed.

Idea #2:
Electric Actuators, same as above with a scissoring mechanism or maybe a single leg that rides on a track that the actuator pushes the bottom. Pros: inherently quieter, I know I can use creative conners system with it as well as Flyhouse's IRig control system. Cons: Never used actuators before that would be rated this high so I am worried about cost.

Ideally I would put my platforms on I-beams, so the lifts would just lift the beams and I could remove the platforms to replace them with the custom pieces to accommodate additional tricks and gadgets. I also would like to keep the height of the deck (beams and platforms) to less than 13" and if I follow AEA I wouldn't have it raise more than 20" in addition to that (based on 1/2" rise per 1' run), but I would like it to go to 3'-4' so I can get underneath for maintainance and ease of running encoders, cables etc. I also am aiming to create a system that I could eventually add to a universal show control if it become a cue-able effect in the future and I know hydraulics can cause problems (in my experience)

Would love ideas. and suggestions for actuators for those who have used really butch ones (30"+ throw and 5-8 ton capacities).
 
Jeez, does it also make coffee in the mornings? Give backrubs?

I've not done anything that large, but this sounds like it might be a good application for a worm drive style system.

I'm sure you're on this, but this is a super big and dangerous mechanical device. I wouldn't touch it without all the proper insurance, liability shield, etc. And I would get an actual mechanical engineer to do the math, at least, if not design the system.
 
FWIW, Lion King Tour (friend of mine is the Automation Carpenter which = Computer programmer/operator and set up/strike mechanic for the rig) gave me a full under the floor tour of the rake. If you've seen the show, it rises and lowers during the action, has a circular center section that can rise with it or not and things like the Rock can track on and off.

Anyway, the rake mechanism is hydraulic and dead silent, motor, pump and reservoir are in another room. The mechanism is a large "V"on it's side with one leg on the ground. There two of these. The hydraulic ram pushes a roller between the "V" legs to increase or reduce the angle between the legs. Very quiet, very smooth, very reliable. Big advantage is if there were ever a failure/leak/burst line, power outage etc., the stage doesn't drop, it just stays where it is. IIRC there was a hand crank that could lower but not raise in case of a problem. I believe Hudson Scenic built it, but not sure.
 
Great Project, interesting engineering issues. I got nothing on Ideas, but am facinated to hear more about the project as it progresses.
If I were in the local IA in Chicago, I'd probably pitch a fit though. Designing a system strictly for the purpose of putting guys out of work is going to raise huge Greivence flags, IMHO.
 
If youre looking to lift and support 30000 pounds, go for a few Spiralifts. Since you're already going to be spending several grand on this project, what's a few thousand more for a care-free way to actuate your deck?
 
I already tried spiralifts, they just dont get low profile enough, the whole deck would sit at 2'
 
Have you talked to Chicago Scenic? One of my former professors is now their head of automation... he has been doing some pretty crazy stuff over there. It might be worth it to at least get a second opinion from those guys.
 
I am familiar with Chicago scenic, I actually worked for the nonunion equivalent in Chicago for 3 years, they are on my list for when I need show control, just out of my price range for the bulk of the project, they do great work over there.
 

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