Blacklight

What exactly does HPL and BTW stand for for a bulb? (or is it just code...)

Your'e exactly right when I first started < before the days of google searches and the like> I thought I could figure out the "coding" of lamps I found out a long time later that there is no code , no Logical code and things like FEL, BTW, HPL, EGH, etc. are designations assigned to lamps by ANSI. I don't have time for more of these right now but maybe soon if Ship doesn't beat me to it. :mrgreen:
 
Wow, BTW ... A lamp I have no notes on it’s existence of. Yep, in some ways lamp speak does turn one’s mind to mush - thus my own, in other ways (is this a plot against me... a lamp I don’t know about, ... where did you hear about the existence of a BTW lamp?)
 
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What’s the large type used for a scoop? Depends upon the scoop but normally a DKZ. Nice lamp, back a few years ago, they still had silica sand in them to swirl away the blackening of the filament. Sort of fragile lamp. I’m prone to the Thorn DKZ/DSE lamp these days - a bit smaller in size - but again it depends upon which specific scoop you have.


HPL (non-ANSI but sort of one) BTW not known to be but possibly also ANSI (American National Standards Institute) lamp. It’s an industry standard with lots of leeway in what lamp is used but in general that all lamps of a type will for the most part if following the standard be the same or similar in type and output. This ass opposed to non-standard lams that can call themselves what ever they want and not be standard. Ballasts to arc source fixtures also use the ANSI standard - but not the lamps. Thus you get crap like the MSI 1200w/S from Phillips seeming like the HMI 1200w/S from Osram but in actuality the MSR 1200 DE/SA being the lamp intended to emulate the Osram better quality lamp.

Or was that the UMI 1200/HB, CSR 1200s/DE, DI-12/s. With time Radium, Wolfram and Eiko will also have similar arc source Mac 2K lamps, all with different lamp codes also. For especially a moving light lamp, there is no ANSI code - thus MSR means nothing more than Phillips lamp speak for a type of their lamps and nobody will other than at best simulate this three letter code of lamp.
Or even the HTI 1200w/D7/60 from even Osram that’s the same basic lamp - different lamp code

Midget at least Midget II fixture uses the same lamp for all intensive purposes as a Altman 1000 fixture - just using more advanced lamps - all similar to a Leko lamp in being the same basic class of lamp. All incandescent/halogen lamps instead of arc lamps. The 750w/115v Phillips #6981P lamp is a darned good lamp - same lamp as developed for and used on the High End Systems Color Command fixture.

HPL lamps are similar to this type of lamp except they have permanently mounted heat sink to the lamp base as opposed to using the lamp base for a heat sink. Way back when in these two classes of lamp being all the same except for the heat sink, Phillips in the GLA/GLC line had removable heat sinks to make what worked in a say Altman fixture, also work in a S-4 fixture. ETC with their licence to do HPL lamps probably didn’t like this and Phillips bought the licence to make HPL lamps later. Should you remove the heat sink from a HPL lamp and install a locking slot, it will work in this lycian midget, just as a normal Midget lamp will work in a S-4 fixture, it just won’t have the heat sink to retain it in the fixture or help cool it. Same basic lamp, one has a heat sink, one does not.

“Why do the lamps for S4 PARs need the pokey stick thingy, and don't just use the regular metal clampy thingies?”

Indeed and as soon as I know what you are talking about...



If assuming by BTW you mean BTN, than also are recognizing the surface are of the filament grid between the lamp as one being smaller than another - you are recognizing something important about lamps.

First, nope. It’s three parts.

Brightness persay is color temperature. A lamp that’s more blue/white will look brighter than a dim candle - even if it’s less in actual light output. Say in going to an extreme, a single blue Christmas light will look brighter than that of a candle, yet the candle is actally putting out more light one can see by. Intensity than is the key. Or Luminous output and or candlepower - how many candles of light upon a one square foot surface one foot away...

In lumious intensity, the 750w/115v HPL has the 750w/120v BTN beat for intensity. Remember that the BTN as a halogen lamp was a second generation type lamp improvement upon the incandescent DDY lamp. (Amongst others.) It’s “halogen effect” allowed a more efficient light output lamp even in color temperature than that of the incandescent version, but it’s early 1970's technology. The HPL lamp is third generation technology in both lowering the voltage thus rising the output by way of for each percentage of voltage, the output rises 3.6% and it now being a 115v lamp instead of 120v lamp, it sees a difference in output, also in a more efficient engineered lamp, it can burn with more output but for 200 hours less or even less than this in expected lamp life. In providing more output by way of about 4,400 lumens in output more on the HPL lamp, you give up about 200 hours of expected lamp life. This all at their respective voltages which changes things even more - the BTN at 120v thus often more than 500hours of lamp life but also less luminous output given it mostly won’t see a full 120v voltage applied to it. The HPL lamp on the other hand is rated for 300 hours of life at 115v and often it will be operating slightly over it’s rated voltage thus the lamp life goes down but also the luminous output goes up. This also in adding 0.5% color temperature difference in percentage change by way of applied voltage.

You now have two lamps rated for the same wattage and different voltages that beyond lamp efficiency have advantages and disadvantages in being very different lamps.

Add to this a third factor in lamps and that’s the filament or arc gap. The more pinprick the source of light, the more efficient the lamp especially within the billiards table that it is that is a fixture. The smaller the filament, the more efficiently the reflector and lenses can send out light collected and focused or reflected into the desired beam of light as opposed to being caught as stray light off the gate, baffles or in just having say a field verses beam angle to at least a Leko’s light output. The larger the filament and a BTN has a large filament, the more of it’s light especially towards the edges of the filament, will never be efficient light to light the stage with. It just hits the reflector and gets absorbed by the fixture in being at the wrong angle. The smaller the filament - be it stacked or a type of smaller filament grid, the more compact the source of light and the more light can accurately get out of the fixture and focused upon your target. Stage three in lamp development was when lamps started to get smaller filaments thus were able to take better advantage of refined optics for more light output.

BI-Plane is a stacked in three dimension filament, “coiled coil” refers to the filament wire itself having two wires taking up the space of one. Different terms and meanings and neither as per saying size of filament or fully enplaning what is going on.


On base up/down that’s a question of once a filament - no matter if in halogen or incandescent lamp, once that filament becomes white hot, it tends to sag. These filaments require filament hangers to support them so as not to sag. Such a hanger often will well support and keep the small shape in one direction but not another. If not supporting the filament, it tends to follow gravity in falling out of place and even potentially melting it’s way thru the glass of the lamp, or at least no longer being held tight in the lamp’s center. Most modern lamps with their smaller halogen lamps can have smaller filaments or at least in general the lamp is rated for supporting an even hotter filament yet thus more rugged in burn position. Most but not all halogen lamps are universal burn but some especially the RSC types still have a +/- burn rating due to the length of filament exposed.

HID’s at times can be dimmed but remember that discharge lamps are not resistance to a filament lamps - they instead provide an arc of light which requires a certain amount of voltage applied to it so as to maintain the arc of light. Remove too much of that voltage supplying the amperage and you have problems in many but not nearly all cases. Very much depends upon the lamp. Ballasts supply that voltage and also supply a amperage based upon that voltage needed by the lamp to strike an arc of light between the two electrodes. No ballast for quick burst of energy and all you really have is a transformer in supplying a specified voltage. Such won’t help unless you have a sufficient amperage of that voltage applied to so the energy can jump the arc gap.
 
(it is probably BTN, and not BTW...)

For the S4 PAR, we took the bulb out, and it had a thin metal rod going down on one of the sides of what looked like a normal HPL lamp. It was just there to help keep it in. (we could replace it with a regular HPL, but it did not stay in easily) I don't know if the bulb came with the stick, or somebody had to attatch the stick. That's all I know about it...
 
That little stick of metal or "spring pin" if I understand you correctly is stuck into a slot on the heat sink of the lamp correct?


If that's the case, than it has a purpose and it's not to better hold the lamp in.

The purpose of that little stick - given it's what I think you are saying, is to prevent this lamp from being plugged into the wrong fixture. This stick either designates this lamp as a 750w or 230v lamp dependant upon what side of the heat sink that pin was on.

Way back when in the S-4 fixtures, they were only rated at 575w and used 18ga wire in the fixture wire which is not rated for a 750w lamp. Thus when the 750w lamp came out, it needed something to prevent it from being installed into the 575w fixture - only to be installed in the upgraded 750w fixtures or A-Modified 575w fixtures. (Long story on differences, I used to do upgrades.)

So, that pin is there to prevent the 750w lamp from being installed into a 575w rated fixture. It's also kind of there to help one verify the wattage of the lamp - see pin, know it's 750w. (Sometimes on the older lamps the printing used to rub off also.)

This all as opposed to 230v lamps where the pin is on the other side at least I believe for the 575w version and what is it both sides for the 750w lamp? Don't know, I only have 575w/230v lamps in stock. (They come back from Euro tours at times.)

At least in the case of the 750w/115v lamp, it won't plug into a Euro fixture, or at least in theory won't. On the other hand, the 230v lamp does plug into the American fixture (I use such lamps to test 208v line voltage and or 120 or 208v to 230v transformer power supplies at times.)


Don't remove the sticks, and if you have them still, put them back in by way of a bench vise to insert them. Such sticks are useful and have a purpose.
 
OOOOOOOHHH...
that makes sense.
I just checked the bulbs today to get more details, and indeed all of the 750W had the sticks on them, and the 575W did not. Since all of our ERS's take 575W, and our PAR's take 750W, that is why I got confused. That would also explain why the bases of the bulbs (heat sink I think you called it...) were different colors, and probably why the 575W bulbs did not fit in the 750W PAR sockets, but still worked (...and come to think of it, weren't as bright)

I also played with the ERS's today, and I think I figured out exactly where the image flips. I put a gobo in, and took the barrel entirely out. It was hard to see the gobo without the lenses (I shined it on the cyc.) but I moved the shutters around, and I noticed that without the lens tube, it was not inverted. I also loke through the lens tube of a 36 degree, and found the focal point was about 3-4 inches out from the barrel, and was definitely inverted. So, I think (correct me if I am still wrong) that the 2nd focal point of the reflector (as in the 1st being the bulb) is before the shutters and gobo, thus ending my pathetic confusion.
Just the exact locations of the focal points was throwing me off, but now I understand.

Thanks for your patience and help... :p
 
I'm noting of late a lot of compact fluorescent Black Light Blue lamps on the market of late.

Such a lamp while I have not tried or studied into it, should have a very interesting on the good side output in the UV range.

One might even be able to lamp up a scoop and or a circuit of strip/cyc light with such lamps given one can deal with the flicker on mode.

Such lamps as long as sufficient in wattage - a combined 75w should also work fairly well on a dimmer - granted the lamp life would be shot by way of dimming, but should last a few shows at least.

Interesting lamps, give them a play test and review.
 
And upon further review, 24 lbs is a lot to hang on my near-capacity bar...
 
That company looks like one of the many who sells lights from the various DJ companies (Chauvet, American DJ, and MBT being the biggest) with the occassional re-branding of fixtures they didn't invent.

What about UV leds at 8 pounds, or a more conventional blacklight at 18 pounds?
 
At the conclusion of this threat I got some Elation UV washes and I'm pretty impressed with them. They've got a pretty good kick and are small, lightweight, and fairly cheap. They aren't Wildfires, but they'll do just fine.
 

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