Control/Dimming Can you temporarily lock Eos console keys?

matcreyn

Member
I’m setting up guidelines for returning to operations during this fall (despite COVID numbers). With the training of operators and limited budget for disposable nitrile gloves, I’d like to know if there’s a way to temporarily lock the console keys of ETC Ion and Element consoles so we can wipe down the console between operators without shutting all the way down. Weird question, I know. Thanks.
 

jtweigandt

Well-Known Member
Cleaning never a bad thing, but all indications are that the main route of infection for most is likely air/droplets.
If you have light/sound or multiple booth personel present, mask,mask,mask. Unfortunately putting out the Peter Max poster
and flooding the booth with normal UV probably won't work :)
 

macsound

Well-Known Member
I think it's also important to note the difference between cleaning and disenfecting. In general, when you wash your hands, you're cleaning them - that is - removing material by way of soap and water being a surfactant.
The same thing applies when we wash our clothes, bodies and largely, everything. It was realized long ago that the use of antibacterial soaps wasn't more effective than non-antibacterial soaps and in many cases, left a residue that would be "sticky" to dirt and germs so your hands would get dirtier faster. Also the active ingredient Triclosan was deemed to be bad for the environment, creating something between super bugs and algae blooms in sewer systems.

So where we are now, we mostly clean, occasionally sanitize but also realize the part of washing that's the most effective is the friction, not the solvent.
General principle:
"The significant effectiveness of moistened cloth compared with the alcohol wipes suggests that, possibly, direct contact with friction alone is sufficient to remove a majority of spores. Similar findings were observed in the better decontamination efficacy of microfiber clothes compared with other materials as well as in the removal of C difficile spores from hands with soap and water as compared with alcohol-based hand rubs."
Source: https://www.ajicjournal.org/article/S0196-6553%2813%2900193-4/fulltext

So something like diluted simple green on a microfiber cloth will definitely clean better, probably remove contaminates just as well and probably not rub off the key lettering that alcohol might over time or overuse.
 

TimMc

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
There is a compendium of cleaning resources compiled by Local 16's Denise Woodward and it's available from my friends at PracticalShow.tech.


Click on the link under the video to get a PDF of her power point presentation and other resources. Aimed pretty much at audio products but from her EPA list of sanitizing products you can see quite a selection if your circumstances require more aggressive chemical treatment.

For myself, I'm hoping for the level of cleanliness that comes from soap or mild detergents, warm water, and light friction. Exactly how that will be achieved, when it will be used, on which products, and what alternatives might be considered may be a part of an Audio Engineering Society convention Live Audio Track panel discussion (hint: if you don't know Ms Woodward, the convention is a virtual presentation /hint). How much of each is *needed to project a duty of care* depends on your own circumstances and guidance of relevant authorities and/or employer directives.
 

TimMc

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I’m setting up guidelines for returning to operations during this fall (despite COVID numbers). With the training of operators and limited budget for disposable nitrile gloves, I’d like to know if there’s a way to temporarily lock the console keys of ETC Ion and Element consoles so we can wipe down the console between operators without shutting all the way down. Weird question, I know. Thanks.
Here's another thought... clear plastic stretch wrap over keyboards and manual controls. Think "Saran Wrap" but not tightly stretched. When the student is done, the student can fold it into itself, dispose of it by whatever your school protocol is, and then wash up. Teacher in gloves dispenses new wrap to next student, who covers the controls. One at a time, also helps with distancing.

Follow ETCs guidance on cleaning. Note they do not tell you how to "disinfect" to a particular level, but how to not damage their products.

Good luck. I hope you're able to structure the "lab time" in ways to get a lot accomplished. Don't discount the benefits of video; a camera over the console/video display, showing on a TV for the rest of the class to view from distance (perhaps seeing the stage lighting as well), may be useful.
 

JimOC_1

Active Member
"The significant effectiveness of moistened cloth compared with the alcohol wipes suggests that, possibly, direct contact with friction alone is sufficient to remove a majority of spores. Similar findings were observed in the better decontamination efficacy of microfiber clothes compared with other materials as well as in the removal of C difficile spores from hands with soap and water as compared with alcohol-based hand rubs."
Source: https://www.ajicjournal.org/article/S0196-6553%2813%2900193-4/fulltext

My impression is that's not true for this virus because bacteria and spores are not like the covid virus.
apples and oranges
surfboards and Mack trucks

TimMC's PracticalShow.tech post with links is a better approach.

This link lists agents that should kill the virus just by contact.

A more direct info is coming out slowly.
From an ARP news letter "Lysol cleaning products have proven effective in killing the novel coronavirus on hard surfaces, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) announced.
Lysol Disinfectant Spray and Lysol Disinfectant Max Cover Mist received approval Monday from the federal agency for their effectiveness against SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. They are the first surface disinfectant products to receive such approval; the EPA said it expects more will follow."
 

jtweigandt

Well-Known Member
The lysol spray products, and the disinfecting wipes, in the non bleach variety are all quaternary ammonium products
Work well for a wide variety of pathogens. Most of the disinfecting wipes on the market, and a large number of spray products have quat family compounds. Good on lysol for getting certification, but chances are real good the rest of the family works as well.

I laughed though early on, my Vet emergency center staff as they ramped up cleaning had put out commercial lysol containers to spray.. the joke was on them, because their concentrate dispenser system used for hospital wide prep of spray bottles and hose end sprayer was already a quat.. and probably a meaner concentration.. but the Lysol name made them feel good.

There are also commercially available hydrogen peroxide wipes. Pretty effective, essentially no odor.

Also just as a warning. windex has ammonia compounds, and will cause crazing and cracking of polycarbonate.... like your glasses and high end “plexi” products. I think the quats would likewise...
 

macsound

Well-Known Member
"The significant effectiveness of moistened cloth compared with the alcohol wipes suggests that, possibly, direct contact with friction alone is sufficient to remove a majority of spores. Similar findings were observed in the better decontamination efficacy of microfiber clothes compared with other materials as well as in the removal of C difficile spores from hands with soap and water as compared with alcohol-based hand rubs."
Source: https://www.ajicjournal.org/article/S0196-6553%2813%2900193-4/fulltext

My impression is that's not true for this virus because bacteria and spores are not like the covid virus.
apples and oranges
surfboards and Mack trucks

TimMC's PracticalShow.tech post with links is a better approach.

This link lists agents that should kill the virus just by contact.

A more direct info is coming out slowly.
From an ARP news letter "Lysol cleaning products have proven effective in killing the novel coronavirus on hard surfaces, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) announced.
Lysol Disinfectant Spray and Lysol Disinfectant Max Cover Mist received approval Monday from the federal agency for their effectiveness against SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. They are the first surface disinfectant products to receive such approval; the EPA said it expects more will follow."

That was exactly my point with cleaning vs disinfecting. Just like washing your hands, you're not disinfecting them when you use soap and water, you're washing the dirt and anything else down the drain. Same would be the case with using microfiber and cleaner vs a lysol wipe.

Any pathogen wrapped in lipid membranes include coronaviruses, H.I.V., the viruses that cause hepatitis B and C, herpes, Ebola, Zika, dengue and others can be annihilated because detergents are both hydrophilic and hydrophobic.

Quote from the CDC
Cleaning removes germs, dirt, and impurities from surfaces or objects. Cleaning works by using soap (or detergent) and water to physically remove germs from surfaces. This process does not necessarily kill germs, but by removing them, it lowers their numbers and the risk of spreading infection.

Disinfecting kills germs on surfaces or objects. Disinfecting works by using chemicals to kill germs on surfaces or objects. This process does not necessarily clean dirty surfaces or remove germs, but by killing germs on a surface after cleaning, it can further lower the risk of spreading infection.
 

TimMc

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Don't forget that for sanitizing agents to work (including detergents), there is a minimum "wet" or "contact" time. Depending on the chemical(s) used, contact time could be a few seconds to several minutes. Note that it's up to the equipment manufacturer to tell us WHAT TO NOT USE IN ORDER TO AVOID DAMAGING THEIR PRODUCTS. They will not tell you what to use in order to make multiple operators 'more safe' - that's a workplace/school health issue that needs direction from public authorities.

@macsound reinforces my research, re the lipid membrane on a number of virii. If one destroys that the virus cannot infect other cells, which is why handwashing is important (since people can't keep from rubbing their eyes and putting fingers in nostrils or mouth). That said, surface transfer of sufficient virus to infect someone is not yet well documented with this virus. The airborne vector is the most prominent and effective way of transmission, based on the reading I've done so far. I'm not saying surface cleaning/disinfection is unnecessary (the more people that touch stuff the more helpful it is), but that the perception is far greater than known efficacy of surface/hand/mucous membrane transmission. In the scenario posed by the OP, the students and teacher are at much greater risk by sharing an enclosed space for a hour than from using the keyboard and control surface of the console and then immediately washing hands or using hand sanitizer.

The ritual cleaning of the equipment might make parents and administrators feel better but with enforced personal hygiene, it's likely unnecessary. Sanitize hands, use equipment, sanitize hands. Masks, distancing, open room/air exchange.
 
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