Changing Dimmer Assignments

[Stevens R. Miller]

Let me say first that I fully respect the fact that high levels of current are involved in stage lights, and that I have no intention of fooling around with something that calls for skills I do not have.

What I am wondering about is how difficult it is to change dimmer assignments. Our system is a Colortran I48 Quad (vintage about 2003, I think). Our number one electric has fifteen instruments hung on it. For reasons that are lost to the mists of history, some of them are paired onto the same dimmer(*). In fact, they are linked like this, from stage right to stage left:

          +---------------------------------------+
          |                                       |
      +---|-------------------------------+       |
      |   |                               |       |
19  17  15  14  13  11  10  21  20  18  17  16  15  14  13
              |   |                                   |   |
              +---|-----------------------------------+   |
                  |                                       |
                  +---------------------------------------+

The observant reader will note this uses dimmers 13 through 21, except for dimmer 12. If we have a "dimmer 12," I can't find anything it controls.

As you might imagine, this pairing of lights isn't what we want. So, the questions are: how do we change the assigments, and who would be likely to have the expertise required to do it? (I am in a middle school with no standing drama department, electricians, or anyone else with continuing responsibility for this; the last time we wanted to redirect the lights, we had to put in a work request to the administrative headquarters in order to get a technician who had the key needed to run the winches that lower and raise the bar. The I48 cabinet is not locked, however.)

Here are some pictures of our equipment:

View attachment 13223

View attachment 13224

View attachment 13225

View attachment 13226

(*) It crossed my mind that our lighting console, a slightly cranky--if also venerable--Innovator 24/48, might have been patched so as to assign more than one instrument to a single fader. As far as I can tell, however, it is patched one-to-one, all the way.

 

[Amiers]

Is the 2nd Ele wired like this?

 

[Stevens R. Miller]

Is the 2nd Ele wired like this?

Yes and no. There are 18 instruments on Electric Two, all more or less directed at center stage. They are on Dimmers 1 through 9, in pairs, like this:

9  8  7  6  5  4  3  2  1  9  8  7  6  5  4  3  2  1
|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |
+--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--+  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |
   +--|--|--|--|--|--|--|-----+  |  |  |  |  |  |  |
      +--|--|--|--|--|--|--------+  |  |  |  |  |  |
         +--|--|--|--|--|-----------+  |  |  |  |  |
            +--|--|--|--|--------------+  |  |  |  |
               +--|--|--|-----------------+  |  |  |
                  +--|--|--------------------+  |  |
                     +--|-----------------------+  |
                        +--------------------------+

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

Using 12 is probably a matter of determining if there is a conductor to anywhere from the rack. Its been a while since I've looked into one of these racks but see if by pulling the module and maybe a fee adjacent if you can see a load wire on the terminal for the module space. (In line with another recent post TURN OFF THE POWER TO THE RACK before doing this.)

After that, I really think the easiest solution are to get jumpers and twofers house on the electric for "re-distribution". Last, were you determined, come up with a plan that accounts for the number of circuits and number of receptacles, and have an electrician rewire the plug strip in place. One of those cases where it might no longer be UL listed but I wouldn't worry about it. Replace or add new labels over the old.

Were it me, I'd lay them out in the 1-1-2-2-3-3-4-4- pattern - basically a built in twofer at that spot.

Good diagrams by the way!

 

[Stevens R. Miller]

Using 12 is probably a matter of determining if there is a conductor to anywhere from the rack. Its been a while since I've looked into one of these racks but see if by pulling the module and maybe a fee adjacent if you can see a load wire on the terminal for the module space. (In line with another recent post TURN OFF THE POWER TO THE RACK before doing this.)

That sounds feasible, but also above my pay-grade.

After that, I really think the easiest solution are to get jumpers and twofers house on the electric for "re-distribution".

Didn't quite follow that. I know what a jumper is (been an amateur radio operator for over 40 years), but I got lost after that word.

Good diagrams by the way!

Thanks. I come from an era that includes a number of lost arts.

 

[robartsd]

Twofer - cable with one plug and two outlets (often a Y shape 18-36" long). Jumper - extension cord (be sure it is SO cable not your everyday extension cord). Run from outlet on the electric to where you need the power, using twofer if it is more convenient to double an outlet than run power from another outlet on the same circuit (or if you have more loads for a circuit than outlets - don't overload a circuit). Secure cable to pipe at regular intervals.

I think by house he's simply stating that the facility should own an inventory of such cables to be used as needed.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

extension cords and two way taps (cube tap?) to connect any light to any circuit

thanks RO - "house" should be "to use'

 

[RonHebbard]

Using 12 is probably a matter of determining if there is a conductor to anywhere from the rack. Its been a while since I've looked into one of these racks but see if by pulling the module and maybe a fee adjacent if you can see a load wire on the terminal for the module space. (In line with another recent post TURN OFF THE POWER TO THE RACK before doing this.)

And "fee" should have been few as in a few adjacent dimmer modules.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

 

[Amiers]

Well it looks like they beat me to the punch. I think you are wired that way and you will need an electrician to come in and separate the home run to single dimmer, or whatever the setup is your looking for.

I am curious as to why there is no 12 and that one side starts at 13 and not 10 but I guess they are only numbers right.

 

[RickR]

One of your photos shows an ETC Paradigm processor which was invented around 2008! Both it and the dimmer rack have a sticker from the installing company I suggest you call them. Since they did that work they should be quite capable of changing things around, as far as possible. Explain your wishes and get an estimate to take to the administration.

 

[DavidNorth]

The distro strips are likely where the twofering has occurred. If so, then there is only one wire pair connection to the rack and not two. In fact, I hope it is only one as there is not room in that rack for two wires per lug and still get proper cooling. The rack is probably not rated for more than one wire per lug.

So, this means that any change to the circuiting in the strip would need to happen at the terminals in the end of that strip. I think it would be best to call the installer, ACG, and ask them for options for rewiring the terminal strip and labeling the changed outlets.

David

 

[RonHebbard]

The distro strips are likely where the twofering has occurred. If so, then there is only one wire pair connection to the rack and not two. In fact, I hope it is only one as there is not room in that rack for two wires per lug and still get proper cooling. The rack is probably not rated for more than one wire per lug.

So, this means that any change to the circuiting in the strip would need to happen at the terminals in the end of that strip. I think it would be best to call the installer, ACG, and ask them for options for rewiring the terminal strip and labeling the changed outlets.

David

David; We got lucky with a 1970 installation in downtown Hamilton, Ontario, Canada when we discovered every receptacle in the space was home ran to a 48 x 100 slide patch with all 2/4'ing occurring on the output breakers of the slide patch. A space in a neighboring town went dimmer per circuit freeing up their larger slide patch which easily went into the space in Hamilton allowing it have every circuit on an individual slider (and a few for future). In this case things worked out but you don't often get that lucky.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

Might be quicker to look in terminal box at feeder end of raceway on 1E to see if there is a spare pair - the missing cir 12.

Based on your comments, David North's plan makes a lot of sense. It's pretty basic electricity though and maybe the institutions electrician could take a peek and see what you're up against.

 

[JChenault]

Are we sure that this is an issue of circuits to dimmers, or could it be a case of strange channel to dimmer parching?

To the OP. Did you figure out your layout of dimmers on the first electric by running sliders on the console and seeing that slider 13 brought up two lights or can you see markings on the raceway that give you these numbers? It could be that the issue is one of how the console is patched - not how the connector strip is wired.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

Well, I guessed original circuit labels, sort of determined how the strip was wired.

 

[JimOC_1]

Your current assignments can be functional in many situations, a left and right for each zone if both are pointed at the same spot. Do you want individual control of each light because you are now programing? How many physical dimmers do you have?

 

[Stevens R. Miller]

To the OP. Did you figure out your layout of dimmers on the first electric by running sliders on the console and seeing that slider 13 brought up two lights or can you see markings on the raceway that give you these numbers? It could be that the issue is one of how the console is patched - not how the connector strip is wired.

The console (an Innovator 24/48) looks patched one-to-one, just as its manual says it would have been when first powered up. As there does not appear ever to have been any Effects or Groups programmed into it (the most I can find are old Cues and Submaster-to-Channel definitions), nor any use of profiles, I am guessing that whoever preceded me was able to figure out Cues and Submasters, but nothing else. As we only have 48 dimmers, I'm not sure there'd be any advantage to departing from one-to-one patching.

The numbers on the raceway match some of the dimmer/fader numbers, but it's not a perfect match. A few of the numbers do appear on the raceway twice, so I am thinking that confirms that they were hard-wired into common circuits.

("Raceway" is cool. I learned a new word! )

 

[Stevens R. Miller]

Your current assignments can be functional in many situations, a left and right for each zone if both are pointed at the same spot. Do you want individual control of each light because you are now programing? How many physical dimmers do you have?

Hey, that's a very good point about multiple lights aimed at the same zones. Wish I'd thought of that when we had the bar down where we could orient the instruments. Next time.

We have 48 dimmers (it may be 47, as a green LED on the bottom plug-in is out).

Our house has two electrics, with 15 luminaires on No. 1, and 18 on No. 2. I believe dimmer 12 is wired to No. 1, at what would be the third position towards the center coming from stage right, but that there is simply no lamp there at this time.

We also have three banks of tri-colored gels, one bank at stage right, one at stage left, and a big one along the cyc (well, it would be along the cyc if we had a cyc). After that, our house lights are actually assigned in groups to a total of nine dimmers (my wife figured out that each group is either over a seating section, or an aisle). We're actually doing a mildly dazzling effect with those nine groups for a number where the whole casts dances in the aisles.

So, if we keep the nine house light banks, and the nine sets of gels, that leaves 30 dimmers (or 29, if one is dead) to distribute among 34 (or 33, if we never get the missing one replace) lights. That would seem to mean that four of them have to share a dimmer with another instrument. I'd be inclined to have the sharing all done on No. 2, but I'd be glad to have input from this group. As our productions return mild profits for the school, I think our stock is pretty high with the administration right now. Asking for some extra attention from the school electricians to get this all sorted out might be something we could actually do.

 

[Stevens R. Miller]

By the way, this is a little off-topic, but I just got home from our first serious rehearsal with pre-programmed Cues, no breaks between the scenes, and my tech crew running the board.

Let me just say: WOW! That was a gas! My lighting techs (a couple of truly on-the-ball seventh-graders) kept up with everything, including all the lighting changes the director kept making, while the rehearsal went on. I only ever did this kind of work back when I was in college, and that was on a few plays with minimal sound cues. All I did was fast-forward a tape deck to spliced effects, and play them on command from the technical director. This is totally different. We had a Telex intercom, so I just mimicked what I remember the Tech. Dir. and the lighting guys doing, where I said, "Warning, lights fifteen," and my operator said that back while making sure fifteen was marked as "Next" on the Innovator. Close to the Cue, I said, "Stand-by, lights fifteen," and the operator repeated that back. As the Cue came up, I said, "Lights fifteen... GO!" and the operator just hits it. I have no idea if that's still current practice (and would be glad to know more about that, along with all the other great advice I'm getting here), but this kid picked it up fast and, by the end of the rehearsal, was sounding like she'd been doing it for years.

Totally awesome experience. Can't wait to go back and rehearse some more tomorrow!

 

[derekleffew]

... where I said, "Warning, lights fifteen," and my operator said that back while making sure fifteen was marked as "Next" on the Innovator. Close to the Cue, I said, "Stand-by, lights fifteen," and the operator repeated that back. As the Cue came up, I said, "Lights fifteen... GO!" and the operator just hits it. I have no idea if that's still current practice (and would be glad to know more about that,

Perfect; and absolutely still standard practice. https://www.controlbooth.com/threads/calling-cues.37864
Your next step is to remove yourself from the equation by drafting/recruiting/teaching a cue caller / stage manager.
What's that saying, "learn one, do one, teach one"?