Changing out transformer in EU fixtures

[Taylor Blais]

Recently, my pastor asked me to find a solution to the lighting we have at our church. For years we have owned around 20 Stairville 252 Led bars. Some have seen worse days as they sit in disrepair, but that is besides the fact. I have been told that I can simply swap out the 230v 50hz transformer for a 120v 60hz transformer so we won't need to rely on transformer boxes for them as well as eliminate most of the flicker that our cameras get while we use them during our events. I am having trouble finding the transformers I need for them. Anyone wanna give a hand? thanks so much.

 

[TJCornish]

I can't speak on the ramifications of a transformer change in that particular product, however I am VERY confident that changing from 50Hz to 60Hz will not solve your flicker issue. To truly be a flicker free LED, you need a PWM rate in the several hundred Hz range or even higher, and the PWM rate is determined by the driver circuit, not the power line frequency.

Sounds like it's time to send these down the line and get some modern fixtures.

 

[cbrandt]

Using a 50hz transformer in the US will give you some funny results, especially on cameras. I'm not sure simply swapping the ballast will solve that. I've only dealt with it on arc source fixtures, however. All the LED that I've played with has been autosensing, or US native. I wouldn't even begin to guess at what goes on down the line inside the logic and LED boards. For the amount of time and effort that goes into specifying, sourcing, installing, and troubleshooting something like that, I think you'd be able to find a new or used fixture that will be as good or better.

Is this spec sheet correct? If they're only 30 watts, and 6 years old you can't be getting a whole lot of light out of those.

 

[Taylor Blais]

Using a 50hz transformer in the US will give you some funny results, especially on cameras. I'm not sure simply swapping the ballast will solve that. I've only dealt with it on arc source fixtures, however. All the LED that I've played with has been autosensing, or US native. I wouldn't even begin to guess at what goes on down the line inside the logic and LED boards. For the amount of time and effort that goes into specifying, sourcing, installing, and troubleshooting something like that, I think you'd be able to find a new or used fixture that will be as good or better.

Is this spec sheet correct? If they're only 30 watts, and 6 years old you can't be getting a whole lot of light out of those.

Using a 50hz transformer in the US will give you some funny results, especially on cameras. I'm not sure simply swapping the ballast will solve that. I've only dealt with it on arc source fixtures, however. All the LED that I've played with has been autosensing, or US native. I wouldn't even begin to guess at what goes on down the line inside the logic and LED boards. For the amount of time and effort that goes into specifying, sourcing, installing, and troubleshooting something like that, I think you'd be able to find a new or used fixture that will be as good or better.

Is this spec sheet correct? If they're only 30 watts, and 6 years old you can't be getting a whole lot of light out of those.

Yes those are the specs of the fixtures. I have been using them for so many of our services and events I know fairly well how I can use them. They do have quite a bit of functionality...if they wanted to work for me. They are really good for punching color and doing some cool clipping effects with, but other than that there isn't anything too special. The strobe and some of the other color effects are pretty cool however! My only issue is that I need to come up with a solution/lighting package that is cost effective within two weeks. I am now looking for any LED fixture that is low enough in the price bracket, but looks really good on camera. Preferably no flickering and I know thats tough to ask for with LED fixtures

 

[TJCornish]

Using a 50hz transformer in the US will give you some funny results, especially on cameras. I'm not sure simply swapping the ballast will solve that. I've only dealt with it on arc source fixtures, however. All the LED that I've played with has been autosensing, or US native. I wouldn't even begin to guess at what goes on down the line inside the logic and LED boards. For the amount of time and effort that goes into specifying, sourcing, installing, and troubleshooting something like that, I think you'd be able to find a new or used fixture that will be as good or better.

Is this spec sheet correct? If they're only 30 watts, and 6 years old you can't be getting a whole lot of light out of those.

LEDs are very different than arc sources - the input power is immediately rectified to DC and the LEDs are driven via PWM drivers, whose frequency depends on the product design, not the input power.

 

[TJCornish]

Yes those are the specs of the fixtures. I have been using them for so many of our services and events I know fairly well how I can use them. They do have quite a bit of functionality...if they wanted to work for me. They are really good for punching color and doing some cool clipping effects with, but other than that there isn't anything too special. The strobe and some of the other color effects are pretty cool however! My only issue is that I need to come up with a solution/lighting package that is cost effective within two weeks. I am now looking for any LED fixture that is low enough in the price bracket, but looks really good on camera. Preferably no flickering and I know thats tough to ask for with LED fixtures

Most brand-name LED fixtures these days are camera-friendly, including lower-tier stuff like Blizzard, American DJ, and Chauvet. All bets are off on the off-brand Asian import stuff.

 

[JD]

Well, if your plugging it in a 60hz outlet, it is running at 60hz even if it is a 50hz transformer, so flicker is not line frequency related, and as has been mentioned, is rectified to DC anyhow with the LEDs being driven at a much higher frequency.

Tech note: Generally, a 50hz transformer will work on 60hz, but a 60hz may not work on 50hz. The reason being is that the lower the frequency, the bigger the transformer core has to be as to not saturate. The core size (among other things) sets the low frequency cutoff of the transformer. As we all know from the vacuum tube power amp days, high frequency cutoff is caused by rising induction and usually that is a number of octaves above the LFC.

 

[porkchop]

I'd contact someone in lighting at https://www.thomann.de. Some of the similar fixtures they have available now use a 90-240VAC power supply and you might just get lucky with it fitting into your fixtures.