Automated Fixtures Chauvet Legend 5000x Display Problems

[SHARYNF]

Running these on a dimmer pack set for full on is basically running them on bad power. The result you are seeing is a processor/memory error from corrupted data. these CANNOT be run on that power you are just asking for trouble, sure it will work some of the time but.....

Sharyn

 

[photoatdv]

I beg to differ... while I don't doubt that bad power could be causing problems, I do doubt that it would cause identical data corruption. That is unless there is some sort of 'mode' that it defaults into if it encounters the corrupted data...

 

[SHARYNF]

well we can agree to disagree, the likely hood of having the same exact failure at the same time on three units is not very probably. BUT the likely hood of having the power level cut on the three units at the same time so that the power supply supplying the processor/memory causing the processor to fail and currupt the data is IMO more likely

Basically I think you need to look at what is attached to the three units at the same time, it could be power OR

it could be something on the input dmx line that is causing the problem
The fact that it can be cleared by a reset tends to suggest it is a processor fault data corruption problem.

But then again that is just my guess

I do have a bunch of chauvet units that I have worked with, and the other thing that can cause this sort of problem is when the dmx wiring polarity is reversed but in my case this has corrected it self as soon as the correct polarity is restored.
Sharyn

 

[starksk]

On an associated note, both these units are ALSO running on dimmers parked at full - and they're also Sensor D20s..... suggestive of a wider issue.

My $.02:

It depends on which firing mode those D20s are operating. If they are operating in Normal or Non-Dim Mode, the power that is being output is still being regulated. However, if it is set to Switched or Always On Mode, the voltage regulation is turned off.

I cannot comment on the specific brands mentioned here, but in my past experience, most multi-parameter fixtures do not like to receive voltage regulated power.

From the ETCWiki:

If you're wondering why:
Setting a Sensor dimmer to full is not the same as a non-dimmed circuit. Dimming systems that have regulation limit the maximum RMS voltage to the level in which regulation was set. More specifically, you can feed a rack higher than 120V and each dimmer will make sure that the maximum is at 120V (or whatever is programmed to allow for 115V or 120V lamps to not get overvoltage). The side benefit of regulation is that it can keep outputs from changing when input feeds change due to power grid loading or unloading. The downside is if a dimmer is set to full and it is regulating, you may not get a full sine wave which some moving lights and other devices do not like.

 

[JD]

Glad to hear about the reset sequence. I knew it was some combo at turn on, but did not know what the exact combo was. Haven't had this problem, but it's nice to have in the back of them mind.

As for the "Failure", I still suspect that this is some form of programming mode that is used at the factory and that the reset moved it back to the "User" mode. (Have run into this type of problem on many different forms of electronic equipment in 25 years of service work.) The fact that the other units did reset and operate also indicates mode change as compared to component failure.

Now, as to why this happened to begin with, well.. Who knows! Since the units were connected to dimmers, and most 5000's go for years without problems, logic would say one had to do with the other. Of course, there are thousands of other variables we don't know about that may have been common to those three units. (such as a hidden DMX value combo that is used at the factory to change mode.) Still, I would power them directly off a breaker as compared to a channel that has been programmed to work as a switch or non dim. JMHO

 

[icewolf08]

My $.02:

It depends on which firing mode those D20s are operating. If they are operating in Normal or Non-Dim Mode, the power that is being output is still being regulated. However, if it is set to Switched or Always On Mode, the voltage regulation is turned off.

I cannot comment on the specific brands mentioned here, but in my past experience, most multi-parameter fixtures do not like to receive voltage regulated power.

Not to argue with the ETC specialist, but this is the first that I have ever heard that setting the firing mode to "Always on" or "Switched" turns off the voltage regulation. Is it actually possible to turn off/bypass the SSR on the module? It seems to me that this would be news to many many people.

In fact, I am pretty sure that this isn't the case. For about a week we were running our follow spots on dimmers (D20s) set to "Always on" and had issues with 1200W fixtures tripping 2.4kW dimmers. As soon as we got in the CC20 modules, everything worked fine. Also, I have tried using strobes on dimmers set to "always on" or "switched" and they couldn't pick up their timing (they rely on the 60Hz) thus not allowing me to get multiple bursts from them. When connected to A CC20 or R20, they worked normally. I am fairly convinced that setting the dimmers to Switched mode or Always on does not turn off the voltage regulation of the dimmers.

 

[DavidNorth]

Perhaps there are some mixed messages here.

On a CEM+ system: "Always On" and "Switched" are unregulated but that does not mean the SCR is bypassed it just means it is turned on and not PWM fired. However, as there are chokes in the dimmer module you are not going to get a 100% complete sinewave output and therefore should cautiously use these settings for movers, et al. Read that to be, do not do it; use R20s or CC20s. This would likely be why your strobes would not fire. Inductive kick-back from a power supply such as what might be in the 1200W fixutres, could cause a breaker trip but that's a guess.

On CEM systems (v3.x and greater): "Switched" is unregulated, "Non-Dim" is regulated, and "Always On" is a control function separate of the two. Basically, "Always On" is a choice you could make in the Threshold which defined where in control input percentage the dimmer is then allowed to start its dimming or switching function. Make sense? Threshold of 50 and Mode of Non-Dim means that once you reach 50% control, the dimmer regulates at the Scale Voltage setting. A Threshold of Always On and Mode of Switched would mean that the dimmer is set to full output all the time no matter what control levels are given. So many options......

Parked Dimmers: Everyone should be very careful in the use of the term Parked Dimmers. Many consoles have a Park feature in which the control output is set to a defined level each time the console is turned on. Parking a dimmer to full on a console is by far not the same as setting a dimmer to an unregulated output. When parking a dimmer to full on a console, the dimmer is then receiving a 100% on DMX (or sACN or ECMUX or whatever) but the dimmer is likely still dimming (ie regulating) to its top configured voltage output. Anytime one wishes to have full, unregulated output from a dimmer then this must be done as a dimmer function. Hopefully I haven't made things less clear.

Final word: Non-dimmable power supplied devices, whichmay include scrollers, moving lights, opto-splitters, strobes, scanners, LED fixtures, mirror ball motors, water-effect projectors, fog machines, video projectors, etc, should be on solid power which is either a relay or circuit breaker. A dimmer might work, but it might not.

 

[JD]

SCR, Triac, SSR, you cannot fire any of these with 0 volts across them, they will not latch on. You need to be into the waveform before you can give them the gate pulse. Because of this, even in "Switch" mode (or at 100%) you will still have a notch taken out of the waveform. It can of course be a very small notch, so as to it's effect, hard to say.

Someone also mentioned strobes on a dimmer. (might be another thread) In any case, this would not be my recommendation. High power strobes often work by firing the lamp directly across the AC line, effectively a short. In nature, this short would be much the same as a lamp arcing out. Each "short" is limited to 1/2 of one AC waveform, as such you would probably not damage the dimmer, just terrorize it a bit

Regarding regulation: Dimmers have only one trick up their sleeves for regulation- Chopping the waveform! (Excluding sine wave dimmers.)

 

[artisanrhodes]

Re: Chauvet Legend 5000x space progarm

I have 8 of the 5000sux units I have had all of these problems and more.we just got new power and chauvet set us 4 new units .after waiting more than 9 months I already have 1 unit that is not working at all and 1 unit that does not dim all the time .I have never had more than 4 units at a time working in 2 years .The only thing i want to know if i get get enough c-4 to blow them and the person who bought them in to space .it would be nice to get through more that a couple of shows that i dont have to go back and reprogram the show because one of the light went bad . the running joke is how many moving lights are working today.

 

[Royalking]

OK, I know this is an old thread, but I found it after searching a problem I had...

I had two oby-5 lights doing the same thing.

Fix is to hold the left and right arrow keys (menu keys) while turning on the fixture. You have to wait while the lamp strikes and then the unit starts to home (takes about 2 minutes - not much fun when you're standing on top of a ladder). This will perform a full factory reset on the light. This is what finally did it for me.... don't know how long they will last though.

On an associated note, both these units are ALSO running on dimmers parked at full - and they're also Sensor D20s..... suggestive of a wider issue.

This is at an install I supervised but did not handle all of, and I told them NOT to do this for moving lights as it means you can't absolutely guarantee the power coming to the light is steady 120v.

AJ

I had the same problem with OBY-5 (it is the same fixture) & I fixed it with your suggestion .. thanks to all of Controlboth members .. & special thanks to (bitbrat) for the solution .. bitbrat, YOU ARE THE MAN

 

[Stephen G. Brickles]

bitbrat - you are AWESOME !!
I had two Chauvet Legend 6000X's that I picked up on Craigslist for $80.00 each. The guy who was selling them had had them sitting in his basement after they stopped responding to DMX in his church.
I couldn't figure out for the life of me why everything would work except the DMX addressing display - just like the original poster described.
I took one of them apart and it's been sitting in pieces on my basement floor for the last year because I couldn't figure it out.
Finally tonight, decided to take another look and then went on Google and found this !! AWESOME - finally I have two fully working Legend 6000x fixtures for $160.00 !!
Now I can go to bed happy !!

Stephen

 

[Les]

bitbrat - you are AWESOME !!
I had two Chauvet Legend 6000X's that I picked up on Craigslist for $80.00 each. The guy who was selling them had had them sitting in his basement after they stopped responding to DMX in his church.
I couldn't figure out for the life of me why everything would work except the DMX addressing display - just like the original poster described.
I took one of them apart and it's been sitting in pieces on my basement floor for the last year because I couldn't figure it out.
Finally tonight, decided to take another look and then went on Google and found this !! AWESOME - finally I have two fully working Legend 6000x fixtures for $160.00 !!
Now I can go to bed happy !!

Stephen

Don't you just love it? Reminds me of that time I bought some Intellabeams for $50 each due to their non-working status. Got them home, opened them up, moved the jumper from 240 to 120 and they fired right up.

Also, welcome to the booth! By all means, stick around!

 

[Stephen G. Brickles]

Don't you just love it? Reminds me of that time I bought some Intellabeams for $50 each due to their non-working status. Got them home, opened them up, moved the jumper from 240 to 120 and they fired right up.

Also, welcome to the booth! By all means, stick around!

Thanks !! - I look forward to reading and participating in more posts !!

 

[Amiers]

Thanks !! - I look forward to reading and participating in more posts !!

Glad you got them working. I had long moved on from my post at that job By the time the reset thread came about. I would assume that the ended up bagged and tagged in the inventory room and left to die.