Control/Dimming Dimmer Lifespan

[tyler.martin]

What seems to be the average lifespan for Dimmer Racks? Ive seen venues with 1960's 6Kw Dimmers still running and functioning, but what is the expected life of more modern computer control dimmers. Logic would dictate the control modules seem to last the least out of all components, with the power cubes coming in a close second.

 

[derekleffew]

I agree re the control modules and then the SSR s. I don't think one can state an average life, as not too many are dead yet. Lots of 1980 Strand CD80 dimmers are still going strong, but the AMX control protocol has obsoleted them. ETC Sensor turns twenty this year, and will keep running until DMX512 is no longer available. Or until new features are developed. But what features do the consumers really want/need from their dimmers? Dimmer feedback (Advanced Features, recorded loads, remote voltage regulation/sensing, etc.) has not been widely accepted/demanded by the industry.

One should expect dimmers to last at least 20-30 years, but it's kind of a moot point as ALL dimmers may become obsolete by the time today's Sensor3 and C21 finally give up the ghost.

 

[JD]

Probably more to do with thermal cycles then age. Old analog dimmers didn't have a "control module", instead, each dimmer had it's own analog ramp generator and firing circuit, usually made out of discreet generic components, most still available today. The advent of controller chips made dimmers a lot smarter, but also put a lid on lifespan: If a chip fails, and it is no longer made, then that's that!

More dimmers get retired due to changes in the control stream then general failures. Often, venues may have a pile of dimmers laying there that may work, but are not compatible (or convenient) to use with new control systems.

 

[KGDJ]

Hey, you're in my neck of the woods.

First off, if you're going into this question thinking "is it a worthwhile investment," then yes, it is. There's no reason even a medium size shop shouldn't be able to support 72k of dimming (dimmers, cams, soca). It's universal, it's standard in 99% of all festival hangs, and being solid state, it's kept in working order with very little maintenance. I have two 12x2.4k and one 24x2.4k, and that gets me through all the house hangs I have to do. The fans do wear out (I'm outside, so dust+humidity=mud) and I replace them every few years. Blow the dust out and keep them cool, and they'll last years. I believe the ones we have are used and at least 10 years old at this point. All original modules.

 

[tyler.martin]

Hey, you're in my neck of the woods.

Yeah, I am right in Vancouver.

The big difference is my Dimmer Racks are permanently installed in a Climate controlled room. We've been offered the money next season to replace both racks, but I dont think they neccessarily need to be replaced. Sure having ETC racks would make it easier to get modules, and there is way better ETC support up here than Strand by miles, but is it really worth the investment when most CD80sv racks usually last 25-30 years?

So while CD80's are workhorses. Ive already gone through 2 processors per rack and I have spares, but those are only going to last me so long

 

[KGDJ]

There's actually good Strand support locally. CDM2 Lightworks is the main Strand distributor and is in Vancouver.

I'd give both CDM2 and Christie a call. They'll send out a techs to look at your current system and quote you a price on new stuff. I mean, if you're happy and figure you can get enough mileage out of your current system until the next time donor money comes in, then I'd look for another area that needs an upgrade first. If getting that kind of cash is a once-in-a-blue-moon deal, then I'd jump on it. You'll probably be able to sell the old stuff, too.

BTW, I'm at Pacific Audio Works in Victoria

 

[tjrobb]

We had CD80 units from 1983 that only died when a flood in 2008 took them out. Dimmer modules lasted longer than some of the LED indicators, too.

 

[tyler.martin]

There's actually good Strand support locally. CDM2 Lightworks is the main Strand distributor and is in Vancouver.

I'd give both CDM2 and Christie a call. They'll send out a techs to look at your current system and quote you a price on new stuff. I mean, if you're happy and figure you can get enough mileage out of your current system until the next time donor money comes in, then I'd look for another area that needs an upgrade first. If getting that kind of cash is a once-in-a-blue-moon deal, then I'd jump on it. You'll probably be able to sell the old stuff, too.

BTW, I'm at Pacific Audio Works in Victoria

I am kinda biased, in addition to my house gig I am a Christie Sales tech. Its not even donor money. we operate on a capital rotation plan, so that means it could be 10 years before the money is available again, If i dont spend it on dimmers or control systems i lose the money.

 

[KGDJ]

That's probably your answer then. New board, new dimmers. Chances are you'll need electrical work too.

 

[Footer]

All of our dimming is 1970's era Strand/Century 6k and 12k dimmers. They get trimmed bi-annually. They are still kicking just fine. Granted, the contractor we have working on them is the only one left that will do it. They have been slated for replacement for nearly 8 years... and there is no end in sight of that waiting game. So, there is still plenty of life there. I would throw a Johnson Controls retrofit in there at least if you decide not to pull it. I would say get new control, get a DMX distribution network put it, and get all of your raceways inspected... replace tails... all that fun stuff. If anything, see if you can add more dimmers... if you got the power and ability to run the circuiting. I would also look at your non-dim/moving light power in both 120v and 208v. Finally, if you have the cash to do all that then replace the dimmers. ....and send some of that "improvement money" my way!

 

[Aman121]

We have a colortran I96 rack in our main space at school. It is a little over 15 years old, and we are just starting to have issues with the control card and a few modules going out. The wiring, raceways, houselights, and many instruments are all 55 years old and original to the school. We have slowly been adding modern instruments and a bunch of colortran equipment was installed with the rack but mostly the rig is vintage 50s-70s gear. If we get any upgrade money it will probably go to replacing sound, as all of that is around 15 years old as well and has a nasty habit of thowing temper tantrums before big events. Besides, doing a proper lighting upgrade would require a huge chunk of change to tear out everything and start from scratch. It might actually happen next summer though, air conditioning is finally being installed in the school and minor renovations will be taking place around the auditorium to accommodate the condensers. Lighting replacement may get budgeted in with that project.

 

[tyler.martin]

We have an Ion and a fairly decent DMX network in the space, but it was only designed to support 1 universe. My plan would be to pull out the DMX and replace with ETCnet.

The strange thing is this venue is our flagship space, so it is kept is very good condition. none of the distribution is in need of repair, because we have the budget to do the maintenance. We don't have raceways, all of our power distro is Socapex ports with breakout splays and pipe mount boxes

 

[RickR]

You might look at the DMX wire.
If its all 5 conductor (2 pair) you are probably set for 2 universes with a few XLR-Y's.