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Done with DeWalt?

Discussion in 'General Advice' started by ship, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Long long story back to 1985' in use and buying the cordless. I prefer a pistol grip cordless powertool as per classically trained in use. 14.4V DeWalt has been my standard for - since they came out, because when it came time for me to be the buyer, they held a charge long enough and many more voltages were more popular for theft. 14.4v platiform had sufficient power and life to use them. DeWalt no longer supports most of the tools I have, and indeed when not doing something on the drill press, I want three to four drills to work with in pre-mounted bits.
    Totally over DeWalt as a brand in having bought the best 20V Lithium Ion hammer drill version I could get. Hate it’s chuck, this much less it is not pistol grip. Beyond that, it’s blade lock is of the gears holding motor verses bit tightened into clutch. Way too much movement in motor/gears slipping/stripping so as to get a in theory tight drill bit. Never felt the gears of a motor slipping between them before this drill. Chuck of a non-ratcheting design that will burn your hands before you get the bit tight enough if using your hands to tension a bit. I have rejected this drill in giving it to one of my assistants. TBA when gear teeth wear out or given the bad chuck are a problem also for him more modern than I in wanting to go 20V Lithium Ion.
    I hated the DeWalt, but my DeWalt 14.4v inventory is getting old - this especially for drills I constantly work with. The next upgrade is necessary, glad I fought such "modern" 18v and other "upgrades" this long in not having to deal with theft or heavier but not better tools.
    What brand / model to look into given I want hammer drill and impact drivers of the same battery once I switch? Money for the next tools is not an issue given I find one that will serve me for the next 20 years. Brand given I dislike the DeWalt also now open.

    Believe 20v Lithium Ion to be the next current standard that will hold for the next couple of years. Theft isn't a problem for now given personal vs. shop 14.4v tools especially after personal department staff tools in 14.4v are put into shop tool inventory.

    I want a good Pistol Grip tool, but recognize that age is probably gone. My guys are all T-handle drill. What's best for me will determine what the get. We do hammer drill but also the impact drill, so both platforms are necessary.

    Help here in choosing a product?
     
  2. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    If the 14.4 stuff had enough power for you then you might consider the 12v Bosch and Milwaukee 12v lines. They're nice and compact with enough power to take care of most jobs. Then you could have one of the bigger 18v-20v drills for the heavy duty stuff. I like Makita's line but the batteries are a deal breaker for me. They only use one of the cells to power the internal electronics and to monitor the battery charge level. So if your not using them all the time you run the risk of that single cell discharging below the threshold Makita set for it, and when it does that it trips a switch that permanently disables the battery pack.
     
  3. EdSavoie

    EdSavoie Well-Known Member

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    Your local Home Depot, if it's anything like the one I work at, likely has numerous cordless drills out on display that you can try out. You should consider stopping in and trying one, or asking one of the hardware & tool associates what they'd use. Alternatively you can ask them if you can try one that's not out for testing. After all, if you don't like it, you always have the 90 Day return policy to return it and buy something else.

    Obligatory disclosure: I simply work there, I am not paid to say any of this, my views do not represent those of The Home Depot, yadda yadda yadda...
     
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  4. np18358

    np18358 Active Member

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    Try out Festool. They are very expensive, but I worked at a scene shop that used them, and they were amazing.
     
  5. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Home Depot’ Employee... I used to work a Builder’s Square for many years - a predecessor in home owner sales staff advice. I even advanced to the service desk and mastered special orders and re-rigging horizontal blinds while there. With what I knew and to the best of my knowledge and reading and education, I at times had to bluff my way thru actual advice. At other times, I really did know what I was advising, but it was questionable if the advice given was over the head of who I was advising in not being able or ready to undersand the advice suffiently. But it was a really great “job”and I got to research, learn and order stuff like find tin ceilings and custom order doors or windows amongst other stuff while going to school to learn more. Even designed locks for sliding doors. This is a great place to work for in learning the basics of materials. Was a really great learning experience for me.

    On the other hand, I use these cordless powertools for a living, and use them every day for the most part. The sales person from Home Depot does not use this/each tool for hours each day and every day. We are talking use of the cordless tool which is bought to be used over a 20 year period until ready to go to the next generation of the powertool that I’m now looking toward. If a good sales person, he/she is well read into the specifications of what the home center offers and has a few minutes of personal use of it, but no similar background or experience in using them. If a really good sales person, they as I as a lamp buyer, have a chart not factory/store provided but personally compiled which can compare one drill to another amongst similar specifications and tests to them of all brands on the market - including the reports on Consumer Reports and woodworker magazine articles.

    I buy lamps for a living and can in detail from a chart tell you about any one lamp, and others, in theory others buy and use drills for a living, and have recently already compared all for choosing a next generation drill - no matter what the brand given the detais of all brands of drill and no budget or base of brand to start with.

    From that personally compared chart, in even if not testing all brands of drill, they than can at least come up with an assumption of what drill would be best. They can recommend a tool for the home owner needing a charged tool sufficient, that for a jobber that uses the tool frequently, and for the end user - but with foot note as to needs. I used to do one such chart in figuring out what drill to buy for work.

    I can do this in comparing drills’ but 20 years since I looked into power tools - thanks for the mention of the Festool... excited to look into it, because I use a cordless drill basically every day, and for hours on end and frequently. Literally used to toss some in the freezer to cool down - not as often these days because I have lots to switch to in stock. This is not a going to “Home Depot” sales person solution type of thing as I use the power tool every day for my living... and the sales person has what amount of experience with what is in stock and what they don’t sell in advice?
    Sorry, and been there in working for a home center, but I would do research over recommendation from any sales staff. Yes I normally am the one hearing than correcting the home center sales staff in advice to clients.

    Looking to upgrade my 14.4v cordless drills. Was in-impressed with the best DeWalt 20v Lithin Ion T-Handle for many reasons. Festool other user comments?
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  6. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    @ship Back in the mid sixties, during my IBEW apprenticeship and in a time prior to battery powered hand tools, I had the luxury of using a Festool pneumatic sabre saw and fell in love with it. All the motion was directly up and down. Minimal vibration and the world's best sawdust blower keeping the blade and layout lines clear since spent air exhausted directly around and in front of the blade while you were cutting. I was using a fine tooth metal cutting blade to cut a custom bracket from a scrap of 1/4" flat aluminum stock and I've never forgotten the feel and pleasure of using the small, light, impeccably balanced EXPENSIVE little Festool.
    I've never held any of their battery powered tools for fear I'd swoon and need to purchase before exiting the building.
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     
  7. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    Festool makes nice stuff. But their stuff is usually 3x the price of Dewalt, Milwaukee, etc. They're kind of like the Apple of power tools, their stuff is nice and it works well, but your paying a whole lot extra for bragging rights. They also have a very proprietary system and all of the accessories get even more expensive. It's one of those brands that your a lot more likely to see in a hobbyists workshop than in a real working shop. If you really want to be shopping at the high end then you want to be looking at Hilti.
     
  8. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    @techieman33 My lasers were Hilti's with zero regrets.
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     
  9. Jay Ashworth

    Jay Ashworth Well-Known Member

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    I don't make a living with my tools.

    That said, I've been quite happy with the Ryobi One+ line.

    I see that Ridgid has come out with a set of interchangeable battery stuff too, which I'd probably have gone with had it been available first.
     
  10. gafftapegreenia

    gafftapegreenia CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    Perhaps a Metabo or Hilti cordless drill would suit your needs?
     
  11. Dover

    Dover Member

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    Both Metabo and Hilti make a marvelous drill but they are usually in the 600 to 750 dollar range. They are certainly built better than a DeWalt or Milwaukee but it is hard to claim that they are built 4 times better. If I needed to take a drill to the space station or Alaskan bush I would pick a Hilti. However if I have ready access to a store, I can replace a DeWalt 3 times and still be ahead cost wise,
    If you want to buy once cry once then get a Hilti, it won't disappoint. But if you are OK with replacing it a few times, a Makita or Milwaukee may provide a better overall value.
     
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  12. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    I completely agree, but if he's interested in spending Festool kind of money he might as well get something that's worth it.
     
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  13. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    @Dover As a Hilti buyer / owner / user I have to agree with you as I own far more Makita's than Hilti's and have neither disappointments nor regrets. There's a phrase escaping my mind at the moment, basically the right tool for the application is the right choice.
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     
  14. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    You seem to like all the technical details so maybe this video and others on AVE's channel will help you out. He tears down a lot of tools and talks about the good and bad of all the components in them. It can be a little hard for some to understand all the Canadian slang, but you pick it up pretty quickly. This is the Hiliti video, he's also taken apart Dewalts, Makitas, Milwaukees, etc.
     
  15. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    @techieman33 Now you've done it! You've got me salivating. How am I going to get to sleep now?!
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     
  16. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    Your retired, you can be awake/sleep whenever you want.
     
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  17. bobgaggle

    bobgaggle Active Member

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    You must work at the best home depot ever. Every time I go in to ones near me, the drills are all missing batteries/broken. And the staff are all up at the customer service desk having a good time.

    We recently hired two guys who used to run their own contracting business, mostly decks and porches. They both swear by rigid, for whatever that's worth
     
  18. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I swore by Rigid in the days when I was cutting and threading 4" rigid steel Vs. aluminum conduit at 110 pounds per length and I still recall the annual Rigid wall calendars in our job shacks and trailers. I don't believe I've ever held or used any of their cordless tools but when they started showing up in Home Depot I recall thinking they were a step down from the Rigid tools of my trade. The tools Rigid offered for cutting, threading and reaming 4" steel conduit were definitely a quality level up from any of their items on display in Home Depot. [In my not so humble opinion.]
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     
  19. techieman33

    techieman33 Well-Known Member

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    They basically are separate companies. Emerson owns the Rigid brand and make the trade tools that your thinking of. The power tools and maybe some of the consumer grade hand tools are developed and sold by TTI (a Chinese company) under a licensing agreement with Rigid. TTI also owns Milwaukee and Ryobi. While I'm sure there is some overlap at the top and bottom end of each "brands" lineup Ryobi is the consumer grade line, Rigid is the prosumer grade stuff in the middle, and Milwaukee is the pro grade. And it's pretty much the same thing at Stanley Black and Decker with the Black and Decker stuff being at the low end, Craftsman and Porter Cable sitting in the middle, and Dewalt at the top. There really aren't that many tool companies left these days, a large majority of the tool companies from the past have been bought out by the big conglomerates and are just labels on the packaging.
     
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  20. RonHebbard

    RonHebbard Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    @techieman33 You've just told me many things / relationships I never knew or suspected.
    My Greenlee punches always served me well, Conduit series. round "radio series", square, D, double D and hydraulic drivers.
    In my trade days, Greenlee 4" benders and their hydraulic cutters that made short work of cutting lead jacketed 500 MCM 13.8 K cables were always solid, reliable, tools along with their 'tri-wheel' assemblies for pulling 13K8 and 27K6 3 conductor 500 and 750 MCM TEK jacketed cables around 90 degree bends in underground cable tunnels always felt like the real deals.
    In my automation shop days, Emerson AC servo's were our drives of choice from their baby drives up to their 6300 frame sizes. My Hilti and Milwaukee tools never let me down and anytime I met anything labelled Ryobi it always felt like garbage. I'd zero knowledge of the relationships you've passed along. Thank you.
    Toodleoo!
    Ron Hebbard.
     

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