The debate at the end of this recent thread has me wanting to once again remind everyone of a point that seems to get lost around here from time to time. We tend to become gear snobs around here. But the reality is every product has a target market. Just as AMDJ/Chauvet/Elation are not appropriate for a traveling Cirque show, Martin/HES/VL are not appropriate for a small church/club/DJ. Different target markets have different needs. While [user]Van[/user] has a well documented hatred and mistrust of NSI dimmers. A church that runs a half dozen PARs for an hour every Sunday can find themselves VERY happy with a couple of NSI packs and find them "reliable" for years. Then there is Pie4Weebl. When he was borrowing money to start his business last year I'm sure he would have loved to go all HOG... but a bunch of "lower end" gear was what he really need and in his price range. Then there are guys around here who don't touch anything but Martin or VL and haven't programmed anything but a Hog in 10 years. In the middle are all different levels of quality and price. Each has it's own target audience. While it's fair to say this product is better made than that one, it's not right to call one junk. Your junk may be someone else's dream product. If you play nice, some day Derek may tell you how he saved the lighting design of an international beauty pageant, at a large Vegas arena, by running home to get his personal Chauvet four pack dimmer. Everything has a place and a target market.