FCC might kill wireless mics

[mbenonis]

He replaced them with another Shure line that he said is going to be safe from the FCC. He also said, that he could have kept those for things that weren't in big cities beacuse there would not be much interference, but he said in big cities he didn't want to chance it.

I'd be really curious to know what bands his SLX operated in, and what bands his new mics operate in (as well as what line they are). I hope, really hope, that he didn't buy the X band (i.e., 950 MHz). That would be bad news for him...

Folks, STAY OUT OF 900/950 MHz! I can't say this enough! Broadcasters WILL go after you because this band is full of studio-transmitter links that are very fragile and susceptible to interference.

From the CGC Communicator (a newsletter for broadcast engineers; emphasis added):

FEEDBACK ON WIRELESS MICS IN THE 944-952 MHZ BAND

o The Society of Broadcast Engineers (SBE) has issued
a Statement of Policy Regarding Wireless Microphones Used
at 944-952 MHz. This elevates to the national level the
key wireless mic issues raised in recent CGC Communicator
newsletters:
Society Broadcast Engineers

o James Hobbs of Mountain Top Media looks toward the
need for dedicated UHF wireless mic spectrum, preferably for
analog mics because they sound best. His thoughts are posted
here:
http://earthsignals.com/add_CGC/Letters/Hobbs_FCC.html

o Another Communicator reader writes, "Check out the
frequencies for this "Shure Personal Monitor System" used
for in-ear monitors on stage." Keep in mind that only
broadcast stations are eligible to use the 950 MHz band
and then only on a licensed basis:
http://tinyurl.com/ShureAd

o And finally this edited comment: I am looking at the
Sennheiser Website and see nothing talking about the tight
licensing restrictions that apply to the 944-952 MHz band:
Sennheiser Worldwide: Microphones, Headphones and Wireless Systems

 

[FMEng]

Folks, STAY OUT OF 900/950 MHz! I can't say this enough! Broadcasters WILL go after you because this band is full of studio-transmitter links that are very fragile and susceptible to interference.

:

As a broadcaster with mission critical equipment operating in the 950 region, I completely agree with Mike. Interference is not tolerated. If I get interfered with, I will get out my spectrum analyzer and go hunting until I find the source. The result will be a visit from folks with badges (the FCC) and possibly a large fine. Every engineer I know would do the same thing. To put it another way, the unpublished phone number for the local FCC field office is on my speed dial.

I haven't had any interference to 950 equipment yet, but I have hunted down a few pirate radio stations. It's not hard to track stationary RF signals, and I find it a fun challenge.

 

[waynehoskins]

As a broadcaster with mission critical equipment operating in the 950 region, I completely agree with Mike. Interference is not tolerated. If I get interfered with, I will get out my spectrum analyzer and go hunting until I find the source. The result will be a visit from folks with badges (the FCC) and possibly a large fine. Every engineer I know would do the same thing. To put it another way, the unpublished phone number for the local FCC field office is on my speed dial.

I haven't had any interference to 950 equipment yet, but I have hunted down a few pirate radio stations. It's not hard to track stationary RF signals, and I find it a fun challenge.

And radio direction-finding is easier at VHF-plus than it is at shortwave, so at UHF it's a piece of cake. Good old RDF.

While I'd like to meet some of the guys at the local Field Office, I'd much prefer it be for something like a First Phone exam session than them knocking on my door -- that's why all my stuff (all one at the church and dozen at the high school) that operates in 700 megs is going off the air permanently on February 17, as I hope everybody's does.

Anybody got an ETA for the R&O?

 

[chriskreidler]

If they are going to get rid of wireless mics, why wouldn't they get rid of cellphones? I'm not sure if I quite believe the news about this.

 

[waynehoskins]

If they are going to get rid of wireless mics, why wouldn't they get rid of cellphones? I'm not sure if I quite believe the news about this.

It's all to do with the radio spectrum they operate in. Our wireless operate in the white spaces in television spectrum, the upper part of which (above 692 megs) has recently been sold to Google, Microsoft, AT&T, public safety, and the like. We're not a primary user anywhere, and if you read the fine print we're not even licensed to operate them where we do.

Read the NPRM .. the FCC's known about us for ages, but now that the PISC petition ("Public Interest", my ass) has brought all of that up to the forefront, the FCC will have to make some sort of ruling on where we can and cannot operate. But it's a given that 700 megs will go away, and since the new tenants there are pushing the landlord to clean out the cobwebs, if we keep operating up there we may get to know the Field Office staff in person.

It's not so much that "They might kill wireless mics", but the rules are undoubtedly going to change. We'll know when the R&O comes out what we'll have to do.

Cellular telephones are an entirely different radio service and wouldn't be affected by the 700-Meg Cleanup.

 

[chriskreidler]

Ok. So if the wireless mics die, will all of our other short range communication tools drop dead? Will our walkie talkies cease to function? And what about anything else that is wireless? Will our internet suffer cardiac arrest? OOO, and our wireless clear coms? Dead? Dead? Well gee wiz, its a good thing your giving us the heads up hear, I'm going to apply for a grant to get all wired communications in our Performing Arts Center. And I wont stop there, ooo no! We need to spread the word to other theatres! Let them know that come the 19 of February, they will be in troubbble! What if a performance is taking place, and everything cuts out!? Its a disaster! Call the press!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[waynehoskins]

Ok. So if the wireless mics die, will all of our other short range communication tools drop dead? Will our walkie talkies cease to function? And what about anything else that is wireless? Will our internet suffer cardiac arrest? OOO, and our wireless clear coms? Dead? Dead? Well gee wiz, its a good thing your giving us the heads up hear, I'm going to apply for a grant to get all wired communications in our Performing Arts Center. And I wont stop there, ooo no! We need to spread the word to other theatres! Let them know that come the 19 of February, they will be in troubbble! What if a performance is taking place, and everything cuts out!? Its a disaster! Call the press!!!!!!!!!!!!

You obviously don't know anything about where various radio services operate, or the scale of fines that the FCC levies against violators. And I will stop at that.

 

[bobbyt2012]

My high school just bought 24 new Audio-Technica pack mic systems last year. I called the FCC to ask about new regulations, but they asked me what FCC rules were listed on them. I haven't looked at one for a while, so I don't remember what they say. I think that they operate somewhere in the 160Mhz range, but I can't remember.
Do you think that it is possible to have wireless mics operate on SHF (Super High Frequencies) and not break FCC regulations?

 

[mbenonis]

My high school just bought 24 new Audio-Technica pack mic systems last year. I called the FCC to ask about new regulations, but they asked me what FCC rules were listed on them. I haven't looked at one for a while, so I don't remember what they say. I think that they operate somewhere in the 160Mhz range, but I can't remember.

THey say they're covered under Part 74, Subpart H of the FCC's rules, and require a license to use. That said, read the Wireless FAQ on this website. I find it unlikely that they operate at 160 MHz; very few systems operate there these days. Yours most likely operate between 512 and 698 MHz.

Do you think that it is possible to have wireless mics operate on SHF (Super High Frequencies) and not break FCC regulations?

Some companies have looked into SHF (3 GHz and up) frequencies for wireless mic use, but I don't believe anything has come out there. The big issues would be propagation (may be less than at UHF or VHF), antenna size (really small), and power consumption. I'm not sure what bands would be open, but 5.8 GHz is one option.

 

[chriskreidler]

Ok. So if the wireless mics die, will all of our other short range communication tools drop dead? Will our walkie talkies cease to function? And what about anything else that is wireless? Will our internet suffer cardiac arrest? OOO, and our wireless clear coms? Dead? Dead? Well gee wiz, its a good thing your giving us the heads up hear, I'm going to apply for a grant to get all wired communications in our Performing Arts Center. And I wont stop there, ooo no! We need to spread the word to other theatres! Let them know that come the 19 of February, they will be in troubbble! What if a performance is taking place, and everything cuts out!? Its a disaster! Call the press!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey sorry about that I left this page open and my friend wrote this. I'm not actually that stupid.

 

[LightStud]

... I left this page open and my friend wrote this. ...

If true, 'tis time for a new, more mature and better-educated, "friend."

 

[Chris15]

I'm not sure what bands would be open, but 5.8 GHz is one option.

5.8 gig is filling fast with consumer goods wanting to get away from the 2.4 gig nightmare... coax loss in the gigahertz range is much greater than what we use now. It also tends to be more fickle in small dead spots...

Just my thoughts...

 

[Pip]

I read a lot of this and skimmed the rest, but I still might bring something up someone already did. If so, sorry.

I wonder what Shure, Samson, Sennheiser actually
think about this. I was talking to my dad about it we decided it's possible they support the restriction... The reason is that it will push consumers into their high-end digital mics that run in the unlicensed microwave ranges (2G, 5G). You know?

Sennheiser brings it up here, although to do accurately talk about the cons of higher frequencies... (Being poor wave propagation and the need for much greater transmit power. Oh and interference from microwaves lol)

Sennheiser USA - About Alternative Technologies: 2.4 GHz Range

 

[mbenonis]

5.8 gig is filling fast with consumer goods wanting to get away from the 2.4 gig nightmare... coax loss in the gigahertz range is much greater than what we use now. It also tends to be more fickle in small dead spots...

Just my thoughts...

All very valid points here. Not to say we can't find a way around them, but designing a reliable system in the GHz range would be quite a challenge.

 

[NickVon]

Re: FCC might kill wireless mics BUMP

BUMP

and Update I came across in my travels

FCC orders wireless mic modifications - CNET News

Gist is new date is June.

 

[mbenonis]

Please see my other thread:
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/sound/17533-update-wireless-mics-united-states.html

Wireless mics are *not* going to be killed; in fact, the FCC has issued a waiver to allow them to operate until June 12th under Part 15 of the rules (it's more complicated than that, but it's a step).