Help me out - control rooms

[rwhealey]

That’s a puzzlement. How do you balance a stereo mix if you’re not on center ?.

If you have a poorly designed stereo system (like most), your "stereo" mix is only a good mix where you are sitting, and likely 2-3 seats in a straight line front-to-back from your mixing position. The rest of the seats will get a poor rendition of your mix, and some of the seats off to the sides of the auditorium will only get your right channel or your left channel. If you have a well designed stereo system, your mix would be good at most seats, even if you aren't mixing from the middle since each seat should have similar coverage. Note that in wide rooms, it's basically impossible to design a good stereo system without using tricks like L-R-L-R that are of questionable validity, at best.

My design philosophy is to provide a good center cluster or exploded mono system that has even coverage to each seat. If the budget allows and the space is used for drama, I think about adding L-R "effects speakers" that don't provide true stereo coverage but do let you hard-pan effects. Then, in a professional setting or an advanced educational setting, and budget allowing, I move to a true L-C-R where each cluster attempts to cover each seat at approximately the same level and the same time.

Sometimes clients demand a L-R mono "stereo" system. I don't think this is out of total ignorance since they are thinking about the expensive stereo at home, but it can be difficult to convince people that what works at home doesn't scale up to an auditorium.

 

[SteveB]

If you have a poorly designed stereo system (like most), your "stereo" mix is only a good mix where you are sitting, and likely 2-3 seats in a straight line front-to-back from your mixing position. The rest of the seats will get a poor rendition of your mix, and some of the seats off to the sides of the auditorium will only get your right channel or your left channel. If you have a well designed stereo system, your mix would be good at most seats, even if you aren't mixing from the middle since each seat should have similar coverage. Note that in wide rooms, it's basically impossible to design a good stereo system without using tricks like L-R-L-R that are of questionable validity, at best.

My design philosophy is to provide a good center cluster or exploded mono system that has even coverage to each seat. If the budget allows and the space is used for drama, I think about adding L-R "effects speakers" that don't provide true stereo coverage but do let you hard-pan effects. Then, in a professional setting or an advanced educational setting, and budget allowing, I move to a true L-C-R where each cluster attempts to cover each seat at approximately the same level and the same time.

Sometimes clients demand a L-R mono "stereo" system. I don't think this is out of total ignorance since they are thinking about the expensive stereo at home, but it can be difficult to convince people that what works at home doesn't scale up to an auditorium.

Always good to learn something, thx

 

[TimMc]

I have a similar project on the boards right now. We have a sound 'porch' and enclosed lighting. Seats right in front!! Fortunately the architect realizes the audience is looking the other way so isn't pushing symmetry on the booths.

Students will talk, panic and need help. One curious thing came up, real time translation for the audience. Someone nearby did it and the school loved it. So where to put someone who talks constantly?

You put simultaneous translation in a booth, and it doens't need to have line of site - a video feed will probably do. Give translators a correct script (cuts, repeats, etc), a decent dialog feed and at least 1 rehearsal before dress...

 

[TheaterEd]

I personally have the windows out during the design phase, and they get put in for the run of the show. Kid's whisper loudly... Also, the VAST majority of events in my auditorium are not traditional rehearsed shows, so when I'm busking for live events it's often helpful to be able to just talk to my board ops. We have three windows per desk, generally one is open and two are closed.

One other reason why I love my windows... the people who sit in the back of the aud for most things are the ones that are going to talk during the presentation, so being able to close the window so that I can still do my job is great. (I'm looking at you talent show dads.....) I used to work in a space with seats behind the sound desk and that was the worst for me. I can't stand having an audience behind me when I'm running sound. I'm sure @Amy Frank knows the struggle, but I can't speak to whether or not she shares my disdain.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

This has mostly been limited to sound and light ops, but does no one ever put the SM front of house? I found that common when active in production.

 

[Amy Frank]

I'm sure @Amy Frank knows the struggle, but I can't speak to whether or not she shares my disdain.

Disdain - you’re so polite. I hate it! Not only can people see me playing solitaire or trolling Facebook (which i rarely do!) but I just a creepy feeling to have people behind you.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

I appreciate the "creepy feeling" factor but especially with a balcony, it seems wrong to put the in house mix location under the balcony. (And sound system designers say don't do that.) And simply not putting seats in that section just means other seats are further away form the stage - I think a much worse consequence.

 

[soundtech193746]

Working on a private HS, new 450 seat theatre. I showed an enclosed lighting control room for two positions - lights and dm or whatever - and open for sound. Architect thinks both should be open because he doesn't like asymmetrical look.

Do you think lighting control should be enclosed?

Speaking from purely a skeptical mind, I would want the lights to be enclosed to prevent vandalism, after all, It's a high school Anyways, I always prefer open for both sound and lights. Open Lights booth is easier since communication is a tad bit easier. Sound always has to be open. Some high schools I've worked in have lights upstairs somewhat enclosed and sound at ground level in a booth normally. Hope this goes well!

 

[RonHebbard]

I appreciate the "creepy feeling" factor but especially with a balcony, it seems wrong to put the in house mix location under the balcony. (And sound system designers say don't do that.) And simply not putting seats in that section just means other seats are further away form the stage - I think a much worse consequence.

@BillConnerFASTC Speaking ONLY to the "creepy feeling" factor: I was often made to feel "creepy" while seated in my enclosed booth at the rear of the Stratford Shakespearean Festival's main stage balcony. Patron's seated in the last row of the balcony, especially during student matinees, would often "cuddle", (to be polite) then appear stunned when they stood at intermission only to find me seated in my booth immediately above and behind them. Looking down to the stage from my operating position I often felt like a voyeur while merely viewing the stage and trying not to snicker or be distracted.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

 

[jtweigandt]

I have a similar project on the boards right now. We have a sound 'porch' and enclosed lighting. Seats right in front!! Fortunately the architect realizes the audience is looking the other way so isn't pushing symmetry on the booths.

Students will talk, panic and need help. One curious thing came up, real time translation for the audience. Someone nearby did it and the school loved it. So where to put someone who talks constantly?

We have audio interp for the blind. Currently put the interp guy on a hi def video monitor in a loft off stage right.. he can see the video and he can see the stage from the side. They also make microphones that are like a fighter pilot mask for this purpose if they have to be somewhere more exposed.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

felt like a voyeur

???

 

[RonHebbard]

???

@BillConnerFASTC
The situation made me feel uncomfortable since I needed to keep an eye on the stage and the rear row cuddling couple were right there in front of me oblivious to anyone being behind and slightly above them until they stood up at interval to find themselves looking through the glass straight at me. That was decades ago, around 1977 - '78 when I first went to Stratford. As I recall, I believe the clearly embarrassed couple blushed, smiled and exchanged nods with me prior to departing.
Head of Sound is an IA 357 position. Resident voyeur is neither a staff nor IA position.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

@BillConnerFASTC
The situation made me feel uncomfortable since I needed to keep an eye on the stage and the rear row cuddling couple were right there in front of me oblivious to anyone being behind and slightly above them until they stood up at interval to find themselves looking through the glass straight at me. That was decades ago, around 1977 - '78 when I first went to Stratford. As I recall, I believe the clearly embarrassed couple blushed, smiled and exchanged nods with me prior to departing.
Head of Sound is an IA 357 position. Resident voyeur is neither a staff nor IA position.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

I was just questioning if you were just "feeling" like a voyeur or actually behaving like one.

 

[RonHebbard]

I was just questioning if you were just "feeling" like a voyeur or actually behaving like one.

@BillConnerFASTC Tough call, tough call indeed. In those years the LX operator had a separate window with the access stairs from the balcony lobby entering directly into his booth while my side was separated from Alec's side by a door. During pre-performance production weeks I'd close my door to keep the sounds of my producing open reel recordings from disturbing LX while setting LXQ's. Similarly, if I desired comparatively bright task lighting to do precise razor blade edits, splicing and labelling, I'd keep my door closed and window masked to minimize disruptive spill into his booth and / or the thrust auditorium. We'd each holler to the other if anything particularly "interesting" were to occur outside our windows if we thought the other may be otherwise occupied and / or if our window afforded a better perspective. Were we voyeurs? We never considered ourselves thus. Were we made to feel like voyeurs, possibly. 'There's never a good voyeur around when you need one' comes to mind. Booth brethren, booth bunnies, denizen's of the booths. Who know's what we're thinking and / or what we think. Welcome to our world of theatre brother Bill. @GreyWyvern What say you?
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

 

[NOM115]

@BillConnerFASTC This reply is probably too late but figure I'd post it anyway. I'm a volunteer parent at my daughter's HS and new to the forum. The auditorium there has a closed booth that has a good size sliding window that is also removable that opens it up a little during performances. Being at a HS the thing to keep in mind is that you will be dealing with HS Students that have the tendency to mess around with things, including the boards. We find the auditorium/house left unlocked a lot because of the number of people who use it. So, security for the booth would probably be a good thing, so that students will only have access while supervised.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

I get that. We always have an easy to use system to secure gear - at least keeping honest people honest.

My original post - we went to a wide and open sound control area center - on a mezzanine - flanked by two enclosed rooms. One may have amp rack. The other will be available for lighting and sm.