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HogiPC Question

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by thelightguy87, Dec 12, 2008.

  1. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    So i'm using the HogiPC more and more now, and although I've used the basics for even longer, I've been getting into more complex shows. I was trying to use scenes the other day, and using them as a virtual scene. I can activate them no problem, but I can't seem to release them independently. The only way I have managed to release a scene in the scene directory is by hitting Pig Release. which releases everything, not a good thing in a live show. I've read the manual back and forth. i haven't found an explanation for releasing scenes, only recording scenes and putting them into cues.

    Also, in palletes, I loaded my palletes i like from previous shows, but i'm using more fixtures than that previous show. therefore what i've found is i have to update every pallete with all the fixtures inorder for it to effect them all. is there an easier way? I rarely use the same plot twice. We have 12 robe wash 575AT and 2 Robe colorspot 700. plus conventionals. I use my overhead fresnels as LED fixtures for color mixing, same with my cyc. it works pretty well, but having to update my palletes or remake all my palletes is very time consuming and i rarely have that much time.

    just last night i cued a dance show with said lights and was given aprox 5 minutes per dance to cue. I only lucked out because i already had positions there from the previous show that was also a dance.

    I'm still learning the hog software, but any tips would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. soundman

    soundman Well-Known Member

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    There is a solution for everything but groups and position. If you make a color pallet with only one fixture of a certain type it will apply to all the fixtures of that type. Works the same for beam and intensity. Read up on the different types of pallets you can make, they are helpful.
     
  3. beltsvillecrucib

    beltsvillecrucib Member

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    As far as the virtual masters go...

    The best way to do it is by pulling up your List pages on the touch screens. Pull up all the VM's you're going to use on the show, but in between rows leave a one row space (essentially double spaced). Below each VM create a cue list with one cue that links to a macro which will release the respective cue list.

    Got it?
     
  4. derekleffew

    derekleffew Resident Curmudgeon Senior Team Premium Member

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    Not sure if it's different on the III, but on the II, one could just click and hold on the cuelist and then press <Release> on the console. Not sure if this works on the touchscreens, as I would always put the cuelist display on an external monitor.
     
  5. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    never worked with macros on the hog yet. the one time i tried to it said there were no macros implemented. is that because i haven't set them up or assigned them to anything? I just haven't worked with them yet.

    so on the list, i record my cuelist, and in the row below each cue, have a cue with a macro to release the cue above it? is that right? i think i get it, i'll try that next week.

    My show went well tonight and i guess to show how much i still think of myself as a noob on the console, is i just got the hang of the effect engine. And being able to make effects somewhat on the fly. Something thats very likely to happen again in the future for the concerts i design. I still tend to stay away from scenes until i understand them better.

    i just designed a dance recital. it was a student choreographed modern dance recital, lots of hip hop and such, for every dance i had a separate cuelist...it helps i have 2 additional playback wings...but instead of fading up the intensity after loading the cue, i'd like to be able to just hit play and not watch the lights move. I find mark cues are a waste in the beginning of the cuelist, when i might as well just record the preset. I've ventured with mixing the look on the fly like i would without automated lights on my express, by having everything i could separated on cuelist, top front side cyc multiple combinations of each in their own cuelist. but that just seems wasteful and hard to set everything really quickly between dances. I was given nearly 5-10 minutes per dance to cue, and then we ran the dance. it was hell.

    I'm working on getting pictures or video from the photographer/videographer, since my hands were full tonight to take my own pictures. i'll post what i can get on my portfolio and i'll link to it when i get em.

    um, for the palletes, so if i record a color pallete with say my robe wash 575, i can't use that pallete for my colorspot 700? is there a way to add fixtures to the pallete without rerecording it entirely?

    thanks
     
  6. beltsvillecrucib

    beltsvillecrucib Member

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    It sounds like you have it, but I just want to clear up the terminology:

    You will be in the cuelist display. For example lets say you have the virtual master lists that you want to use across the top row of one of the touchscreens. Below that row you are going to create cuelists that contain one cue. They will be empty cues, except you will use a comment macro to trigger the release of the cuelist above them. The comment macro will be:

    RL# where number is the number of the list you will release and it goes in the comments section of a cue.
     
  7. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    GOT IT! that makes sense, i'm gonna start looking into macros.

    thanks
     
  8. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    Another question i have is, Does Hog3 have any way to do a dimmer check? We have a standard plot, but when hanging specials we like to have the board op call out available dimmers. This works when using our Express, but I am pushing to use intelligent lights more often, which means either both express and Hog are used, or combining everything into the hog. I've managed to map out dimmers in the theater, and look at whats patched to find open dimmers. That takes too long for my LD's patience. So I'm just curious if anyone has found a way to do a dimmer check, without patching the dimmer.
     
  9. 1kfresnel

    1kfresnel Member

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    I don't know the Hog platform, but I would find it quite a surprise not to be able to dim check or "park" dimmers. Another option is to use a DMX combiner, with Highest Takes Priority (HTP), to utilize both boards at the same time on a given universe, if you feel your facility would benefit from this -- even if only for hanging the plot. No sense in adding another variable to the chain during a production if you're not actually utilizing it.

    It would also enable you to use the Express for simpler conventional stuff, training, etc without switching around the cabling too much. It really depends on how your theater is run, as each one is unique. Good luck!
     
  10. 1kfresnel

    1kfresnel Member

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    I decided to skim the manual, since curiosity got the better of me. It appears as though they want to force you into a workflow of using fixtures, and not allowing you to send a single value (0-255, 0-100%) to a single DMX address, for the most simple of dimmer checks. To a degree this is understandable when working with intelligent fixtures that have a plethora of control addresses, but it would personally drive me nuts on the occasion I just want to yell out, "dimmer 7 at half", etc.

    I'm sure some Hog guru will be more than happy to help.
     
  11. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    I've thought about different way of doing a dimmer check on the hog, you mentioned parking dimmers, you can do that, so i suppose you can park a single channel on and then just patch and unpatch the dimmers as needed into that channel. I've also found you can't proportionally patch a dimmer. Our theater has lights in all but a single entrance, so we hung an old 8x13 to light up the dark entrance. on the express we patch it with the house lights and patch it at 40% but on the hog I've had to patch it to a separate channel and then just set a cue for house lights with that additional channel at 40%. not the end of the world, but definitely makes teaching people how to use the hog in my theater more tedious.

    We have discussed purchasing a combiner, but its too expensive to justify for our needs. being a college, it would need to be a capital expense, and it doesn't pass requirements. seems as though they'd rather pay for another lighting technician to board op a show having conventionals and intelligent lights separate, then getting the device that minimizes the need for the additional console, and we could use our smartfade for things like house lights and dimmer check, and cue the show on the hog...oh well.

    I'm currently the only lighting tech who knows how to use the hog, or has used the hog at all in my theater, and before i leave this school i'm told i need to teach everyone how to use the console to the simplest task of updating positions of shows I've cued and will be used again. So i'm trying to find all the little tips and tricks, to not only help myself in cueing, but being able to show my other lighting techs how to use it.
     
  12. TimMiller

    TimMiller Well-Known Member

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    Ok, to anwer your questions....

    A. To release a single fader you push the choose button, then push release. As you found out pig + Release releases all cue lists

    B. Pallets, the way i set mine up is i mix all of the lights to green, then push "active" then "enter". Pushing active grabs a hold of all parameters in the programmer. I then push record then the pallete i want. This will store all of the fixtures as being green in the pallete. I also build pallets for position. You can then break down whatever fixtures from there. But when you record all of your fixtures into a preset pallete at once, you do not have to scroll through a bunch of greens based on whatever fixuture you want, you just enter in the fixture numbers then push green. Also in patch, have you looked at the magic auto menu button. After you are done patching your fixtures click on auto menus button in the patch menu. Then push generate auto menus. This will automatically generate groups, color, and beam pallets. They will need tweaking though, but it is a good start.

    C. Dimmer checks, yes the hog will do a dimmer check. The easiest way to do it is patch all of the dimmers 1 to 1. so i patch dimmers 1 thru 96 starting at user number 101. So i can make life easier when the electrician says pull up dimmer 32 i know its fixture number 132 on the console. Let me know if you do not know how to change user numbers, it makes life a whole lot easier and programming much faster rather then hitting group then 1+2, you can set what ever movers you are using at 1thru 32 based on what fixtures they are or where they are in the rig, then have your deskchannels as something different. So once you have your dimmers patched (lets say they are patched as 1-96) you just push high light 1, then you keep pushing next. They will then begin to jump through each dimmer one by one. If you want to backup just hold pig and push next. You can also go through your movers the same way, you will notice this once you have gone through all of your conventionals and hit or movers. You can also start part way by pushing high light 50 then push next.

    The way i program all of my shows on the hog is i put the entire show into one cue list, then i just push go. The console is a lot more reliable that way. I do leave things like foggers and the house lights on their own handles so i can take manual control over them.
     
  13. mdg

    mdg Member

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    There are playbacklists and scenes on a Hog 3.
    Normaly al cue's programmed will go into a playbacklist, can be find by pressing "open & list".
    You can also build scenes, which is a single cue/preset, containing numbers of channels with levels set, programmed with a fadetime.
    When pressing "open & scenes", you'll get a window with pallets where you can store these scenes in.
    The way it works is as follows; if the scenes-window is open, make sure "guard" is not active, chose the channels and levels, press record and touch a pallet. (handy if you name them), press scene and the number of the pallet, time #, enter. When touching the pallet the preset will fade in, touching the pallet again will NOT fade the preset out. (can't have them all), so build a second scene, with time, containing the same channels and a level 0.

    When you want to do a channel/dimmer check, go to patch, somewhere top right you can chose view by channels, this gives you a full list of patched numbers, ie unpatched numbers.
    Same for view by DP.
     
  14. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    thanks for the help, I've got cuelist down pretty good, and i'm getting into a habit now of recording all fixtures to colors and beam effects and such. With virtual list, someone said to use RL# # being list number to release, and put that into the comment sections, I tried that and it didn't work, but I put it into the Macro section and it worked, so i'm all set for that. I played a little with scenes today, and I guess I had been pressing it in the wrong order, but i was able to release a scene like a cue by pressing it and pressing release. Is there a way to have a scene load a macro to release another scene like cues can? i didn't see that option as the scene is only one look.

    slightly unrelated question, sometime in the next few weeks i'll be setting up ESP Vision with the Hog. My question towards that is, do I need to have a my theater drafted? or does it have a sample procenium arch like say, WYSIWYG does? for the shows I do, I only need a generic theater space and pipes for the lights. does ESP Vision and Vectorworks 2008 have something like that?

    And finally, what do I need to do in order to connect the Hog to the visualizer?

    Thanks
     
  15. photoatdv

    photoatdv Active Member

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    You were given time to cue? I always have to do it during the dance or write notes and do it after rehearsal. Once I had to do the entire show live. 3 different shows (with 112 dances total) and I only had a 7 hour rehearsal/ setup time. That show was hell! Though it did go pretty well and was fun at times.
     
  16. derekleffew

    derekleffew Resident Curmudgeon Senior Team Premium Member

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    Silly question, but you do know Comment Macros must be preceded by a ">", right?
     
  17. Jby007

    Jby007 Member

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    ESP Does not have anything pre built you can draft your theater into Vectorworks or draft in Vision i think VW is easer.

    To connect your console to vision you need a cat 5 cable and this Wholehog Visualizer Connecitivy Application.

    Visualizer Connectivity

    Hope it helps
    Jeffrey
     
  18. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    no i didn't
     
  19. thelightguy87

    thelightguy87 Active Member

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    Thanks, I do not know how to change fixture numbers, i'm playing with it now, and I can't seem to figure it out.

    Do you patch your conventionals 1 to 1 for your show and just name stuff from that? or do you repatch after focus? We use a standard plot that most of our LDs have our current patch memorized, so I really can't just change the patch, as i will not be the only one using the console.

    You also said you select your fixtures and press active, by active do you mean "enter"? I haven't seen anything labeled active.

    the time i spent cueing was the time the dancers and choreographers spent blocking the dance on the stage, as it was their first time on the stage. So the tech rehearsal was set in blocks of times for each group, about 20 of them. Each block was like 15 minutes. the first 5-10 were spent blocking and i took that time to cue, and then we ran the peice, which was restricted to being under 5 minutes for length of the show. It was stressful, but it went well. I've done a lot worse. I have had a show where I had to cue during the rehearsal, but it was not a recital it was a full length ballet, that i had never seen before and there was no SM. So i had the owner of the ballet on my back bugging the hell out of me expecting me to have lights hung circuited and focused without having time to do it....and my coworkers wonder why i love using movers for dances. We get a variety of dances, and i'm generally the LD for almost all of them. My PM has been letting me request a minimum of 5 minutes before running a peice or else they only get a static white look, which in some cases is fine with me. Although I try not to do that too often.


    Thanks for all the input on the Hog, I also just went to the High End Systems/Barco Open House in chicago this week, so i was able to get a lot of questions answered there as well. Now i'm going to upgrade to version 3 and be back where i started.
     
  20. jxgriffi

    jxgriffi Active Member

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    Actually Derek, that's only in Hog2 mode. Hog 3 you just type "GL123"...if you need to trigger more than one macro, separate by a colon "GL123:RL122:CP2:CM3" will "Go list 123," "release list 122," "change the page to Page 2" and "Choose Master 3"....all within the same "GO"
     

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