How bright is your LED compared to incandescent? Let's compare.

JChenault

Well-Known Member
My theatre recently purchased 32 ETC CS Jr’s ( deep blue) for a high-side light system.


One statement about LED fixtures is that they are not as bright as incandescent units in white and pastels, but are very bright in more saturated colors. I have always been curious about how true that was, so I did some tests that I thought I should share.


Procedure:
  • I have a CS-Jr and a S4 Incandescent ( 750) watts with an Apollo smart color scroller. In our current production they are within a foot or so of each other and focused to approximately the same location. The CS-Jr is set to 50 degrees. The S4 is a 50 degree fixture.
  • The CS-Jr is in Direct mode (individual control of all four emitters)
  • I put a white board on the set and compared the apparent intensity ( by my eye) of the CS Jr and the S4 . I then balanced the intensity so that the appeared equally bright and recorded those values
  • In some cased the color from the color picker was noticeably off IE it was way to blue. In those cases I created an ‘Adjusted’ color which matched the CS color closer to the gel color.



Here are the results:



Apollo ColorRosco EquivCS JrIncandescentNotes
NCNC
100​
100​
The 'Open White' for the CS is very blue. I tweaked it in the next comparison
NC AdjustedNC
100​
60​
6300 YellowR14
100​
70​
7150 SF AmberR16
100​
75​
The CS color was very blue. I tweaked it in the next comparison
7150 AdjustedR16
100​
70​
7650 Coral AmberR01
100​
70​
Again the CS color was very blue. Tweaked in the next comparison
7650 AdjustedR01
100​
60​
7600 OrangeR23
100​
60​
3250 LavenderR52
100​
90​
3700 GrapeR358
60​
100​
8450 PinkR34
100​
70​
4800 Ice BlueR63
85​
100​
4450 Heavenly BlueR69
80​
100​
4400 After Hours BlueR74
45​
100​
5960 Marg GreeneR88
100​
80​
5500 Blue GreenR95
80​
100​




Comments:

  • The color picker did not do a great job of picking colors in the amber end of the spectrum
  • The Amber colors did not look as rich in the CS unit as the incandescent unit.
  • The open white equivalent ( all emitters on full) is extremely blue )
  • We had some quality control issues with one of the CS-Jr units. The cooling fan wanted to run full on and after a couple of days it showed ‘Error’ on the LCD panel and would intermittently work. ETC replaced the unit under warranty in two weeks.
  • The units are plastic. They seem sturdy, but I would be hesitant about putting them in a position where they are banged around a lot.
  • The accessory holder is a new size ( IE your existing top hats will not fit)
  • There is a gobo slot, but no accessory slot ( IE for an Iris, or gobo rotator)
  • Running power and data and daisy chaining to each fixture is a paint in the posterior ( but since these are part of the rep plot, it is a one time problem)
  • The units do not leak light. IE our apron units are in the grid, exposed to the audience. When thy are on ( with a half hat) the audience does not see any glow from the ficture.



I am very happy with the purchase and what they allow us to do ( specifically move from one color to another smoothly). I would hesitate to use them for front light, but for side or back light I would recommend them.
 
Part of me isn't surprised that they read bluer but generally I feel like ETC has done the best at color accuracy in the color picker.
I'd be interested to see what the 3200k looks like on the 1 channel mode.
 
Having spent a lot of time color matching LEDs... Some quick thoughts:
  • I'd be curious what would happen if you used the 5 channel, or 3 channel modes.
  • Which Eos software version? Which CS firmware version? Both those things (as well as the mode) can change the accuracy of the color picker.
  • Got a chip chart, or some multi-colored fabric around? Would be nice to try the experiment again with that.
 
Having spent a lot of time color matching LEDs... Some quick thoughts:
  • I'd be curious what would happen if you used the 5 channel, or 3 channel modes.
  • Which Eos software version? Which CS firmware version? Both those things (as well as the mode) can change the accuracy of the color picker.
  • Got a chip chart, or some multi-colored fabric around? Would be nice to try the experiment again with that.
Nor sure how 3 or 5 color mode would have effected brightness. Might affect how the color picker works.
Not sure of the console release number but it is recent
not sure of fixture firmware. However the fixture is brand new so I expect it is recent
i totally agree re color chart or fabric. There was just not time.

thanks for the comments
 
The CS Jrs seem to be intended to replace 575w fixtures. I did a CS Spot (non-deep blue LED engine) install next to some S4-575 a few years ago. We also cleaned and relamped the incandescents. The LEDs were noticeably brighter in full white even when tuned to color match.
 
The color picker also has modes - Spectral, Brightest, Hybrid. Which mode you're in while clicking around changes how the colors are mixed. Which mode did you use?
I believe were set to spectral ( That is what my show file at home says, but it is possible I am incorrect. I am aware of the differences, but am not sure how the board is set up)
 

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