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ION is almost here!

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by gafftaper, Aug 9, 2007.

  1. gafftaper

    gafftaper Senior Team Senior Team Fight Leukemia

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    Here's the webpage.
     
  2. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    Well.... Since they put up the webpage, I guess I can talk about it more now. I was told that I couldn't really talk much about it before.

    What do you guys want to know? Orders will begin being taken as of Sept 16 for a Nov 17th Ship date. (Right before LDI)

    List price of the base desk is around 7 grand - but that does not include training and there will be factory training with the desk included (as I understand it) so the price will probably be a little more, but I really don't know how much. The fully tricked out version is around the 13 grand range, but the same provisions apply.

    Other questions?

    Jeff
     
  3. gafftaper

    gafftaper Senior Team Senior Team Fight Leukemia

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    Yeah I just got the new 2007-2008 ETC catalog in the mail today and there's ION. So I ran over and searched the website and there it was. They still don't have the link up on the console page but it's searchable so they aren't trying too hide it.

    So does it have the same basic software as EOS? Just less channels, universes, and high end bells and whistles? Or is it completely different?
     
  4. Pie4Weebl

    Pie4Weebl Well-Known Member Fight Leukemia

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    so from reading the description I have a quick question, can the expansion wings give me channel faders like the insight?
     
  5. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    Gaff: Same basic software as the Eos, which means it is a tracking console by default.

    Pie4Weebl: As I understand it, the expansion wings are submaster wings. You can set your channels and subs 1-to-1 and that would accomplish what you want.
     
  6. SteveB

    SteveB Well-Known Member

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    I assume you mean using the playbacks with an individual channel assigned ?. With Insight a sub is still a sub, but maybe with a single channel assigned, which essentially makes it a channel fader as on the Express.

    The Eos manual and data sheet states that the 10 on-board motorized faders, and I assume the 40 on the playback wing, can be faders/playbacks, submasters, masters and grand masters. The manual states that a submaster can control channels, incluiung individual channels.

    I going to assume that this is going to carry over to the Ion, which has the ability for upwards of 240 submasters via the playback wings. I'm assuning that the playback faders are just that, not simply a sub.

    I'm looking forward to the release.

    Steve Bailey
    Brooklyn College
     
  7. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    I don't know that all those features are going to carry over. The faders on the multiple styles of wings are not motoroized, for one. And as I was told, the faders are only submasters (at this time.) It may be possible in the future that that feature will change, but as I understand it, the fader wings will only be subs. There will be 3 different configurations of fader wings

    a 2 x 10 - 2 rows of 10 faders each (looks a lot like a half fader wing from a congo jr)
    a 2 x 20 - 2 rows of 20 faders each (looks a lot like the full fader wing from a congo Jr)

    and the final 1 x 20 - this is designed to be attached to the top of the console to provide a row of subs at that location.

    Also as I understand it, you can attach a total of 6 fader wings to the console. That would provide a total of 240 physical submasters on one console. I do not know if there are going to be multiple pages of those submasters.

    Does that make sense?
     
  8. Grog12

    Grog12 CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    Yeah it makes sense.....but its a little unfortunate that they become just subs.

    Its a sign I read too many comic books when I come in here thinking isn't he Parallex now? (Green stars to whoever gets that reference.)
     
  9. Jezza

    Jezza Active Member

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    Yes, I think that limiting the functionality of these faders as simply subs and not playbacks for different cue stacks is going to be one of the consoles major drawbacks.

    Sure, people have been using the Expression 3 with only 2 "playback" faders and several other subs forever, but no one ever tried to to run a serious amount of MLs or effects of an Expression 3, it's just too time consuming. It seems as though ETC would like end users to use more MLs and LED units with the ION due to the onboard effects package, greater DMX channels, and the capablity for 2 outboard touch screens. However, without the ability to create multiple cue stacks and the ability to use multiple playbacks, the console becomse very limited to fully pre-programed theater, dance, etc as opposed to being able to work in the concert world as well where its all about busking a show.

    Given that, I would be MORE than happy to spec this console for my next theatrical or corporate gig, however, I would be reticent to bring it in for any concert. But I guess that's where they want you to be using the EOS and not the ION. Still, its a great move on ETCs part to bring in the world a console that imitates the functionality and protocol of the EOS. It will allow a seemless integreation of ION to EOS. Kudos ETC -- now just get one out to Poughkeepsie NY so I can demo one!
     
  10. SteveB

    SteveB Well-Known Member

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    I cannot imagine any of the faders NOT having playback capability, as there seemingly are no actual playbacks on the desk. That would be somewhat pointless, especially as the Congo Jr. playback wings are just that - playback wings. Limiting the faders to subs makes no sense, but I admit that we (I) am creating an issue without any hard data.

    I can tell you that when I saw the news this morning, and a thanks to gafftaper for the post, I was (am) extremely excited. I guessing the sales for this console iare going to HUGE.

    SB
     
  11. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    There is a main playback pair on the desk. I do know that for sure.

    As for more playbacks, i don't know exactly how that is going to work. I may be mistaken, but i could have sworn that I was told, that the fader wings were just subs.
     
  12. Grog12

    Grog12 CBMod CB Mods Premium Member

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    With the Expression line....it wasn't really two separate playbacks was it? It was more of two playbacks playing one list.
     
  13. Jezza

    Jezza Active Member

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    true true -- but that is where subroutines came into play -- I guess you could say they faked multiple cue stack effects on one cue stack.
     
  14. SteveB

    SteveB Well-Known Member

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    Well, they allowed you to put a cue stack (subroutine) on a sub (note that this only with the Emphasis console), but the "stack" still gets over-ridden when you play another sub w/ subroutine on it, or if you run a cue on the fader pairs. Even with Emphasis, the console does not allow multiple cuestacks on independent time-lines to run simultaneously, the way you can on Congo or supposadly on Eos.

    Which is why I'm going to have faith in ETC and assume that any add-on fader wings to Ion is going to allow assorted playbacks.

    SB
     
  15. gafftaper

    gafftaper Senior Team Senior Team Fight Leukemia

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    To those who are upset about the possibility that the subs are just subs...

    This console is designed and priced to fit into (and rumor has it replace) the Express end of the ETC product line, not the Obsession end. So it's not really meant for people who do ton's of movers. They already have that in Congo, Jr, and EOS. This is the community theater, school, and church part of the new ETC product line. Users who might regularly use a gobo rotator or an I-cue but are unlikely to own much more than that... playing back cue stacks is not a priority for that part of the market.
     
  16. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    True, Gaff, true. Only one correction. Express is staying. You can still buy one if you want to. Now, why you would want to is beyond me, but you still can....

    :)

    Also - Let me be clear in one thing here. The opinion's express here are mine, all mine. You can share them if you like, but they don't necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer or any manufacturer my employer may represent.

    Not that anyone is holding ETC to anything I say, but I just want to make sure that is out there and on the record. Thanks!

    Jeff
     
  17. DarSax

    DarSax Active Member

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    Wow, that thing is puny. I mean, granted it's pretty much all the programming/playback buttons and encoders of a fairly powerful board without faders, and it's designed to be cheap, but I can't help looking at it and thinking it's almost uncomfortably small.
     
  18. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    It is the same form factor as the Congo Jr. (by the by, does anyone remember the old microvision FX console that they loved so dearly? Does any console or two look similar these days?)

    I assure you, it is very well built. It does feel very good under your fingers and will hold up to touring rather well I would imagine.
     
  19. gafftaper

    gafftaper Senior Team Senior Team Fight Leukemia

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    Well if it's the same size as Jr. it's a decent size. My only complaint is that it's a bit of a let down in it's appearance. Congo and Jr. both look like they are made in the Bat Cave. Eos looks like you get to run lights from Mr. Spock's personal console. Ion looks like something very functional they would use in the real space program... which isn't nearly as sexy as the fictional world.
     
  20. jmabray

    jmabray Active Member

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    Oh - neat little feature that I need to mention here..

    The Phone Remote.

    If you have a congo or a congo jr, you know what I am talking about. This is a feature that is standard to the console that allows you to go down to wally world and pick up a 10 dollar cordless phone and plug it into the console. With that you get a limited wireless remote control. You don't get every feature available to the desk, but definitely those ones that you need when you have to go up to the catwalks and do some touch up focus when you are by your self.....

    Its neat little feature, just thought i would share.
     

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