Light fixture safety cables

TBH never had one vibrate open on me but we are always changing the plot depending on the show. Still better than a non protected clip IMO.

I HAVE found one hung and open and not just because someone forgot to close it when it was hung. That one, was enough for me to prefer something I can mouse, OR I'll tighten these down hard, which people don't like on the out, so its easy to go with a mouseable option like a shackle. Terrifying to see something held just with gravity and the fact that the gate wasn't open far enough at the time for it to slip free.
 
I HAVE found one hung and open and not just because someone forgot to close it when it was hung. That one, was enough for me to prefer something I can mouse, OR I'll tighten these down hard, which people don't like on the out, so its easy to go with a mouseable option like a shackle. Terrifying to see something held just with gravity and the fact that the gate wasn't open far enough at the time for it to slip free.

I've found SEVERAL Quicklinks open after installation in my time. Always "upside down".
 
I have seen safety cables being used to suspend for example da lite fast fold screens or chandeliers up to 200lbs. Acceptable to use safeties to actually hold the weight?

Whether a safety cable is technically capable of holding X weight is not the question you should ask yourself in this situation. The question you should be asking is "what happens when someone uses a piece of equipment in a way for which is has not been certified and/or approved by the manufacturer?"

The options are either "nothing" or "something." If "something" happens you now have two more options: "something small" (i.e., no one was hurt and nothing was damaged) and "something big" (someone WAS hurt and/or something was damaged). If something big happened and someone was hurt, how would you feel about that shortcut? How would the person injured (and only injured, hopefully) feel? How would their lawyer feel about it?

The form factor of the lighting safety is supper handy, but -- for Safety's sake -- go to your local rigging supply/safety shop and buy half-a-dozen 18", RATED stingers and shackles and set them aside for this purpose. best wishes, mike

PS - In the world of job site safety, if you add up enough "something smalls" they will eventually turn into "something big." Always. m
 
....I don't loop through yoke but cinch around the eye on the fixture (or around the pipe) and clip to itself (or to the eye). The yoke to pipe doesn't protect from what I think is the most common failure point - the yoke bolt. And IIRC the mouse requires all accessories - color frames, top hats, etc. -to also be saftied.....

^^^^ This is the correct way. Everyone read this, please. Wrapping the safety around the batten and the yoke only keeps the yoke from falling (and only momentarily, at that, bacuse sooner or later it will roll out of the safety). You have to cinch around the batten and clip to the body of the fixture....I am still amazed by how often I see it done the wrong way. m
 
I totally agree with that main use of a lighting safety and only use it for that purpose but to debate
" rules that are acceptable to be broken "

I read tests have shown that lighting safetys on a straight pull will break ~ 1500lbs (5:1 ~300lbs)
and in basket it breaks at ~2900lbs (5:1 ~590lbs)

So if the object to be hung is within those numbers can it be argued that it is okay to to hang of safetys.


My issue with your testing is not how you tested it. It is that you tested one from Brand "A" and that the next guy is using one assembled by Brand "F". There are few safety cables with tags on them stating date and source of assembly. We have no idea who made YOUR assembly and how they made it. Nor do we know the source of the snap hook or if it is rated for any load at all. It may be rated to be a snap hook with no load rating. These things exist.

Safety cables, even from reputable assemblers like Fehr, ETC, Altman, Versales, etc are all rated to catch a falling lighting instrument. They don't give you a working load otherwise. Purposely.

For overhead, I don't trust snaps like that one as they can be opened in use by the cable wrapping around it.

Just saying.

T
 
Shockload force = ?
LOAD = 150lbs (CM motor 125' chain ~150lb)

Free fall distance = 80'
Stopping distance= ??? ( it fell 80'and came to a stop- so how to find value for that??)

Also back to LOAD: use only the weight that fell? Which is 80'of chain , idk maybe ~40 lbs or use the entire weight of rhe motor?

And where is the shock load applied to ? I am thinking it is applied to the shackle on top ( which is making the connection to gacflex)

@egilson1 @TheaterEd @RonHebbard @RonaldBeal @porkchop @What Rigger?
@JAC
@bobgaggle
@BillConnerFASTC
Etc


Based on information i looked up i found that 5/16 " load chain is 0.9 lb/ ft.

Load= 0.9x 80ft = 72 lbs

Information i have found on
Stopping distance ( = stretch)

Elastic Stretch = weight x G factor/ d of rope square
G factor = 0.0000140
D of rope 5/16 square = 0.0977

Elastic Stretch= 72 lbs x 0.0000140 / 0.0977
Elastic Stretch= 0.010317

Stretch = elastic stretch/ 100 x lenght of chain in inches

Length = 80' = 960"

Stretch= (0.010317/ 100) x 960
=0.0995 inches

Force= weight × (distance/stopping distance)+1
Force = 72 lbs x (80/0.0995)+1
=
57961.45 lbs (?????)

I dont think this can be correct . Isnt that way to high of a shockload. (?)
 
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As far as not paying attention to your rigging going the right way, etc....we had a touring Broadway show in our house a year or two ago and one of their people didnt pay attention to which way their shackles were going when they were raising up the ENTIRE dimmer cart to hang suspended (by motors) for the show a little ways onstage of the rail. My husband is a rigger and noticed a....2500+lb cart shimmying and managed to push our theatre's TD out of the way with inches to spare before it came crashing down, putting holes through the floor and denting the metal on the rail. The whole 100+ workers on stage came to a compelte halt and silence.
So ya, id rather make sure anything going in the air is fixed correctly.

Ive also gone into a college and found the DJ bar LEDs used for cyc lights hung with TIE LINE....only tie line. In a shoelace bow. I came in after the college did a performance to run a special event, wondered why their cyc lights were hanging crooked....much to my surprise, there were no clamps nor safety cables attached. I called my boss and when he told me it wasnt our responsibility, I told him if he wasnt going to pay my coworker and I for the 2hrs we had to spend attempting to figure out a way to properly hang them, screw him. But that I knew about it and was NOT going to allow it to stay that way....especially since the following week was the 2nd-8th graders summer camp that would use the stage.

I tell my crews the only time they will ever hear me yell at them is if they are doing something unsafe/for safety reasons. Mistakes can be fixed, slacking on safety takes lives, and you never hear of anything falling up.
 
As far as not paying attention to your rigging going the right way, etc....we had a touring Broadway show in our house a year or two ago and one of their people didnt pay attention to which way their shackles were going when they were raising up the ENTIRE dimmer cart to hang suspended (by motors) for the show a little ways onstage of the rail. My husband is a rigger and noticed a....2500+lb cart shimmying and managed to push our theatre's TD out of the way with inches to spare before it came crashing down, putting holes through the floor and denting the metal on the rail. The whole 100+ workers on stage came to a compelte halt and silence.
So ya, id rather make sure anything going in the air is fixed correctly.

Ive also gone into a college and found the DJ bar LEDs used for cyc lights hung with TIE LINE....only tie line. In a shoelace bow. I came in after the college did a performance to run a special event, wondered why their cyc lights were hanging crooked....much to my surprise, there were no clamps nor safety cables attached. I called my boss and when he told me it wasnt our responsibility, I told him if he wasnt going to pay my coworker and I for the 2hrs we had to spend attempting to figure out a way to properly hang them, screw him. But that I knew about it and was NOT going to allow it to stay that way....especially since the following week was the 2nd-8th graders summer camp that would use the stage.

I tell my crews the only time they will ever hear me yell at them is if they are doing something unsafe/for safety reasons. Mistakes can be fixed, slacking on safety takes lives, and you never hear of anything falling up.
@Kittin In 1990, I was with a Canadian / American co-pro of "Buddy Holly The Musical" in Broadway's Shubert when a fire erupted in the 'Music Box' or 'Jewel Box' (if memory serves) around the corner where a tour of 'Lettice and Lovage' was parked with Maggie Smith and Maggie Tyzack.

48 slot / 96 x 2.4 Kw racks were flown from the grid by Load Stars basketed to the grid with Spansets. The NYFD were NOT favorably impressed by dimmer racks plummeting down through the dense smoke when the Spansets melted due to the intense heat at grid height. I believe this was the fire that resulted in the development of GACFlex fire tated Slings.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard
 
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@Kittin In 1990, I was with a Canadian / American co-pro of "Buddy Holly The Musical" in Broadway's Shubert when a fire erupted in the 'Music Box' or 'Jewel Box' (if memory serves) around the corner where a tour of 'Lettice and Lovage' was parked with Maggie Smith and Maggie Tyzack.

48 slot / 96 x 2.4 Kw racks were flown from the grid by Load Stars basketed to the grid with Spansets. The NYFD were NOT favorably impressed by dimmer racks plummeting down through the dense smoke when the Spansets melted due to the intense heat at grid height. I believe this was the fire that resulted in the development of GACFlex fire tated Slings.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard

Oh, it was a large cart....like larger than a set cart....one that held all the dimmer racks, pretty much it was all of dimmer beach/LX's work arwa on a cart so it could fly and stay airborne, allowing show LX to take care of whatever was needed by climbing up. So not at all close to the grid height, plenty of air flow around it. The had at least 4 motors, I wish I could remember if they used gak or what. Id ask my husband if he were in town right now.
They flew them to give room enough on stage for a pretty large production (23+ trucks maybe? As a hint...prior to the productions stop, the house had to have a new I-beam put in to carry weight of a somewhat notorious chandalier). Another one that was less weight but equally as large was automation's cross stage flying cart which I believe was actually the stage/show spot for one of the automation guys. Not my side of the stage and I only checked power and paid attention to my guys, so I wasnt paying much attention to their guys in the air after noting that everything was leashed. I saw a couple of them up there a lot though.

It wasnt the first production that has flown a large portion of a department for the show. We have a decent amount of backstage work area, but so many big shows need a heck of a lot more than we have. We honestly removed every bit of house gear that we would not be using including shell ceilings, meat racks, and anything else we could to make room enough for their production to have just about what they required in space. Took 3 days of prehang, and we dont keep a house plot hung or etc, so none of that was removing lights and cabling other than removing them from the ceiling of the shell. Was 4 days of load in, I believe, and after the matinee show 2 weeks later (4pm maybe?), we worked until about 11am the next morning on the load out. Then came back the following day for restore. So, although I dont recall the exact number of trucks, it was a lot of gear brought in.

I wish I could give the exact way the cart was flown, from my limited memory of it, I think the deduction was that someone didnt pay attention to how the shackles were attached, making it slip and kaboom. I know it was done correctly the second time, when they got it up, and we had no more problems after that, or on the second one that flew. Honestly, the most vivid memories were of watching my husband and the TD walking by the rail, under it and one of my dept guys being on the upstage side near the rail when it came crashing down. Then the complete silence until I saw my husband and the trembling TD standing about a foot away from where it crashed, and my guy on the other side trying to hold it together. Once I took a breath, I ended up breaking the complete silence by yelling at my husband for always trying to terrify me...jokingly. I'm scared of heights, so bad that when I started back again about 5 years ago after a small hiatus in marketing, I could go 2 steps up a ladder and started freaking out....the first time I climbed the ladder to the pin rail, I was so terrified that I destroyed my back so bad I couldn't lift my arms straight out even halfway to making a line with my shoulders. Now I'm a lot better, even have my own harness and have done some rock climbing gym stuff. I dont freak out anymore, but id never want to do what my husband does, and he was a lot cockier about what he was willing to do before he lost 3 rigger friends in one year to accidents and saw his best friend ride a genie lift down from 30' to deck when someone decided a cable was okay to run over when the lift was in the air. Not to say i dont trust my husband to do his job, but he's the type of guy who will put himself in a dangerous position that HES comfortable with if it might help/save a colleague. And by the grace of God, he was able to push our TD fast enough (TD is about 6" taller and has 75lbs on him) when he noticed the shimmy, since no one else noticed and it was incredibly sudden, the TD didnt know what was going on other than being pushed and told to move, move, move... Then it crashed down.
It was user error, not a failure of gear or under rated materials being used. Just lucky that everyone got out. I spent about an hour after the accident fielding "are you okay" queries from everyone, since I went right back to work (I was just like, hello, now we're going to be running behind since show crew all had to fix their cart). TD needed a bit before he came out of his office after that. I let my luckily-not-flattened elec take a minute to smoke and reflect on his decision to move out of the way instead of trying to save a piece of gear, and my husband went to explain the whole thing to the steward (no idea after that).

I am *not* a huge fan of flying something that large and heavy above my head for the entirety of a show. But needs must. If I could simply build a giant vending machine for everything into the wall, I would. But not entirely practical. Nor are conveyer belts or sitting everything outside and hoping to avoid rain. So until I figure someting else out, I'm completely sans inspiration to avoid large heavy things hovering above my head 😸
 
OK guys, now we've beaten to death the safety cable issue for the safety cable holding the instrument yoke to the hanging pipe. What about the need for a safety cable holding the instrument to the yoke?? How about another one holding the lamp cap to the rest of the instrument? And, OMG, what about the gel frame??? (Where do we stop with this?)

In 50 years I and my crews have hung instruments "down," "out" and "up" and never had a C clamp break or yoke bolt break or come undone. (Or, for that matter, seen a safety cable.) If your equipment is properly maintained and properly installed this is all moot. And if it isn't, you have serious crew training issues.
 
In 50 years I and my crews have hung instruments "down," "out" and "up" and never had a C clamp break or yoke bolt break or come undone. (Or, for that matter, seen a safety cable.) If your equipment is properly maintained and properly installed this is all moot. And if it isn't, you have serious crew training issues.
Just to clarify--you haven't seen a safety cable in your 50 years of hanging instruments?

I'm going to go ahead and stay on this side of the continental divide :)
 
Yoke have two bolts holding the body. My understanding is that that built in redundancy relieves us of body safeties. And that yokes are not prone to sudden failure!
 
My experience was one stripped and fell out, the other side snapped with impact laid. But long ago with much less well designed fixtures.
 
I've seen exactly one c-clamp fail, and it was due to an instrument being struck by a passing flown scenic piece.

We don't just have to account for the shock load of a falling instrument, but also try to allow for the potential force from an object dragging the instrument with it. Obviously we work to avoid situations like the one I mentioned, but I'm sure we all have examples of a flyspace so packed that breasting lines and special cues to help dodge obstacles have been necessary.

I'm of two minds on the clips on safety cables: One, I'd prefer that they have a definitive open/close, not just a pear clip that can open accidentally. Two, they still have to be easy enough to operate that they don't get forgotten or skipped, and they need to be able to be operated one handed for the times we have weird hang positions.

I've seen dog clips and snap clips used, and I hate it. Also, I hate when they're swaged with pointy bits of wire sticking out. That can pass muster on cables attached to scenery or battens, but not on a device that we have to touch every time we move an instrument. If you've ever been stabbed bloody by one, think of all the nasty grime floating around the places we work. It's not sanitary, and it's asking for an infection and a workplace injury claim. If you're making cables for any reason, try to not leave booby traps for your co-workers and future you.

Has anyone found the holy grail of safety cables: rated, good clip, not stabby, affordable?

Quick story and I'll end my PSA:

I knew a guy who worked the seasonal department at a big box hardware store with a blue logo. He got a paper cut from a cardboard box of cheap Christmas crap from overseas. He thought nothing of it, it's a paper cut after all. It got infected with some virulent bacteria from the country of origin, and he wound up having half a finger on a dominate hand amputated. Having not filed an accident report, the corporation tried to weasel out of paying for it.
Take your injuries seriously, and work to prevent them, no matter how small. I carry e-tape for lighting hangs, and wrap over any safety cable stabbers I find.
 
Also, I hate when they're swaged with pointy bits of wire sticking out. That can pass muster on cables attached to scenery or battens, but not on a device that we have to touch every time we move an instrument. If you've ever been stabbed bloody by one, think of all the nasty grime floating around the places we work. It's not sanitary, and it's asking for an infection and a workplace injury claim. If you're making cables for any reason, try to not leave booby traps for your co-workers and future you.
...
Take your injuries seriously, and work to prevent them, no matter how small. I carry e-tape for lighting hangs, and wrap over any safety cable stabbers I find.
I'm sure @What Rigger? @egilson1 @Ted jones et al will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe best practice when swaging is to leave a minimum length of wire rope, equal to the cable's diameter, sticking out of the swage upon completion of crimping. Another good reason for not making one's own cables.
 
I'm sure @What Rigger? @egilson1 @Ted jones et al will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe best practice when swaging is to leave a minimum length of wire rope, equal to the cable's diameter, sticking out of the swage upon completion of crimping. Another good reason for not making one's own cables.
I'd love to know the actual answer to that, because it's entirely possible that my training in college was incomplete. We were told no excess sticking out.

Whatever the answer, if excess is necessary in a situation, I wrap that up with e-tape, or I shrink tube the end of the cable if I know it'll be exposed.
 

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