Macs or no macs? thats is the question.

davidrth

Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2005
Location
Middlesburgh, Guisborough
Hey guys,

Am looking at moving heads for my new theatre studio space am wondering if anybody got any ideas. Am looking at something alone the lines of 2 mac600s and 2 mac 250s but becasue my studio is small and is the rig is above the stalls like about 4 meters away. Ave worked with martin lights b4 and always had then in theatre mode. Am worried about nosie of the fans and motors when in full swing, Is studio mode the thing or you know of any other way around it :?: I would be gratefull for some feedback.

Cheers. david t.

Theatre tech.
 

jonhirsh

Active Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2004
Location
Toronto, Ontario and Valencia, California
They have motors and fans in them there going to make noise no matter what mode or what brand you use it doesnt matter. but the martin mac 250 kryptons are extremly quiet but are still noisy. if you have a large move and want to reduce the noise factor set a long transition time for the mark cue other then that you will have very audible fan noise and servo motor noise and anyone who tells you you wont is full of crap i went to see dirty rotten scoundrals on broadway they had like 3 or 4 VL over the audiance no one else really cared but every time they changed gobos or moved i looked up and heard it.


hope it all works out

J Hirsh

ps whats this whole studio theatre mode? do you mean regular and etended mode?
 

len

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2004
Location
Chicagoland
I'm not familiar with "theatre" mode either. Perhaps its a buried setting allowing for lower fan speed/noise but lower lamp output is the consequence. I've heard (no pun intended) the new 250 wash is supposed to be way quiet.
 

sound_nerd

Active Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2004
Location
Toronto Ontario
I've used mac250's in a musical (Seussical) before and had no problems what so ever with noise, even in full swing with gobo/colour wheels going, and pan/tilt going. They should be fine.
 

jonhirsh

Active Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2004
Location
Toronto, Ontario and Valencia, California
Sound neard what you may be missing is he is talking about a sace where it is a tirteen foot celling from his 4 meter guestimation that is not allot of height especialy since he is doing theatre not musicals like was stated earliar. i have a space that is exactly 13' high 50' long we have many troubles with moving fixtures for a movement to become "un noticeable" we have to put a mark cue of about 30 to 40 seconds with mac kryptons if we want to have a noticeable move then its fine. i would never say dont get movers but i would say never think that they will be silent

silet and queiet are two seperate thngs and if a sales person or anyone tells you that they have a silent fixture turn around and run as fast as you can.


JH
 

sound_nerd

Active Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2004
Location
Toronto Ontario
jonhirsh said:
Sound neard what you may be missing is he is talking about a sace where it is a tirteen foot celling from his 4 meter guestimation that is not allot of height especialy since he is doing theatre not musicals like was stated earliar. i have a space that is exactly 13' high 50' long we have many troubles with moving fixtures for a movement to become "un noticeable" we have to put a mark cue of about 30 to 40 seconds with mac kryptons if we want to have a noticeable move then its fine. i would never say dont get movers but i would say never think that they will be silent

silet and queiet are two seperate thngs and if a sales person or anyone tells you that they have a silent fixture turn around and run as fast as you can.


JH
John, you're right, I missed what he said about ceiling height. At thirteen feet, I can see the 250's being a slight issue when at full operation. I was speaking of the last time I used 250's ....but they were at least 30ft above the audience. At the same show, I was also using some Rosco I-Cue mirrors. There were two of them about ten feet above where I was running lights. I was moving them at full speed pan/tilt, and never heard it once. The I-Cue's are quiet. Very quiet. I would reccomend them at the height you specified. The Mac250's would probably be a bit noisy at that trim height. Good luck.
Make sure to demo a lot of fixtures, at the height you need them at.
 

ship

Senior Team Emeritus
Premium Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2003
Location
Illinois
You might also consider the High End Systems Studio Spot or Studio Color 575 and 250 lines. They are often recommended for theater use due to a lack of fans and comperable for different reasons in what they do but in the same respect as the Martin line of fixture.
 

zackw250

Active Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2004
Location
Bellingham, WA, USA
I have 4 high end studio spots 575 and 4 studio color 575s, quit as a button. They are only 20 feet above our congregation, and you can't hear them at all. Silent is so...... nice.
 

soundman1024

Active Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Location
Denver
Keep the dimmer (pretty sure it is a dimmer, but it may be a shutter) on your studio color lubricated. You can hear ours everytime it moves now. Something should probably be done about that.
 

zackw250

Active Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2004
Location
Bellingham, WA, USA
Are you running 575 colors? How old? Did you lube yours? I am about to pull all of our intellegents down for cleaning & maintanance. I just changed all the lamps... MSr 575/2... rated for max life of 600 hours, my fixtures were all 1300 hours.. not good at all. Stupid me. So everyone, go check your fixture hours right now!
 

tadawson

Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2005
Location
Lewisville, Texas USA
soundman1024 said:
Keep the dimmer (pretty sure it is a dimmer, but it may be a shutter) on your studio color lubricated. You can hear ours everytime it moves now. Something should probably be done about that.
The Studio Color uses an iris to dim, with the strobe shutter providing the final cutoff. I have some older units as well, and the irises (and it IS he iris . . . . . ) do get a bit noisy. HES support indicated to lube them with dry graphite, and while it has helped, they could stil be better. If you find a better way to quiet the irises down, please let me know. Other than that, as others have said, totally silent in operation other than a few minor hums and faint clicks when things are moving . . . .

- Tim
 

avkid

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Fight Leukemia
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Feb 17, 2004
Location
Lakewood, NJ
Find a dealer with showroom and test one out, for extra assurance bring a sound guy with a decibel level meter with you!
 

ship

Senior Team Emeritus
Premium Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2003
Location
Illinois
zackw250 said:
Are you running 575 colors? How old? Did you lube yours? I am about to pull all of our intellegents down for cleaning & maintanance. I just changed all the lamps... MSr 575/2... rated for max life of 600 hours, my fixtures were all 1300 hours.. not good at all. Stupid me. So everyone, go check your fixture hours right now!
If currently using a MSR 575/2 that was made after 2003, it's rated for 1,000 hours and that's before - I forget which out of 100 lamps 10% or 50% failed. The actual and current by Philips replace this lamp before this amount of time "Danger Will Robinson" time is also now listed often as much more.

Many companies have improved their moving light lamp life to 4,000 or more hours TBA in the long life lamp series types.

If using a MSD 575 - a better lamp but one that's more expensive, Philips currently rates it at 3,000 hours instead of 2,000 hours. I'm sending spare MSD 575 lamps out on tour that have just under 800 hours at this point unusual to me in normally shipping brand new lamps as spares. Given a shelf full of probably 50 lamps up to 1,100 hours, in being used, I just can't see buying more but new lamps. This given the MSR 575/2 lamp using fixtures even at 1,000 hours always get a new lamp for a spare.

Otherwise on a Mac 2K, while on a long tour, as similar to in a theater where you use it at times until it's dead, the 750 hour Osram HMI 1200w/S lamp have been known to go well beyond 1,500 hours in still functioning. Probably not putting out much light, but not exploding or being so noticable that they needed to change due to output.

While you should service your gear constantly and at such points in time note the lamp hours, than replace before, lamps have gotten much better in the past couple of years (more expensive also.) The normal rating on a lamp for expected life, or change before - as different figures now, is much better.
 

ship

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Premium Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2003
Location
Illinois
tadawson said:
soundman1024 said:
The Studio Color ...do get a bit noisy. HES support indicated to lube them with dry graphite, and while it has helped, they could stil be better. If you find a better way to quiet the irises down, please let me know. Other than that, as others have said, totally silent in operation other than a few minor hums and faint clicks when things are moving . . . .

- Tim

Graphite powder, that's what they recommend?

I use at least on follow spots and lekos either spray graphite in a heavy coating than wipe off the extra once the vehicle evaporates, or teflon lube on Irises that again has a vehicle that in this case needs to smoke off before it gets down to work. Spray graphite - "dry lube", mmm. good stuff for irises. Given I don't tech moving lights, I also give a good look at the individual blades of the iris and either sand them down with chrocus cloth where less than desirable, or replace them when showing damage.

Mind you that it's not just the shutter itself that might make noise. In the case of a gear or pivot, has it's grease or lube expired? On a pivot point, graphite will be useless.
 

tadawson

Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2005
Location
Lewisville, Texas USA
Well, now that you mention it, I went back and looked, and they did not say dry - I guess I just assumed it, since I am leery of anything solvent based or liquid in that environment - but that would be a heck of a lot easier to get between the leaves . . . .

This is the specific excerpt from the message I got from support when asking about noisy dim
iirises . . . . .

Anyway, as for the iris leaves, you can try running a little bit of
graphite through the leaves like you would on a leko. As for the pan/tilt . . .
- Tim
 

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