Not as confusing as setting the joystick to control the second derivitave would be - but that might make for an interesting hidden camera scenario.Nice. Throw calculus in and confuse everybody.
Moving Light as Follow Spot
- Thread starterjgrimes
- Start date
Max Warasila
Member
I probably would set it to the first derivative. Velocity control would make more sense.
Jay Ashworth
Well-Known Member
Lessee:
Direct control means the joystick az and el control the fixture az and el: springs would recenter the fixture to its static aim.
First derivative means the joystick as and el control the *position* of the static aimpoint; springs make the fixture stop moving *where it's aimed* when you let go of the joystick, and the amount of deflection determines how fast it changes the aimpoint in the direction you're pushing (the approach we suggest).
So what is second derivative? Acceleration? (I really didn't take calculus; I've been spitballing from context...)
Yes, the second derivative of position with respect to time is acceleration.
@Max Warasila I thought "hidden camera scenario" was enough clue that my comment was meant as a joke.
Max Warasila
Member
Oops...
@Jay Ashworth I didn't take calculus either.... but I had to learn it for AP Physics C, so I got most of the important bits.
Jay Ashworth
Well-Known Member
Hrvoje
Member
In this system Web camera is mounted beside the moving light at some angle towards the stage.
I have try to mount a camera on a moving light and it is very hard to track the performer that way. Technically system works but to track a dancer on stage... No.
I was my first idea to mount a camera on moving light, it avoids field of view problem.
It is mandatory to have a fixed placed camera.
Anyway, i have been asked to implement a "start from dark" function. Performer position will be as a preset or memory or...Ex. Button 1 preset position 1.
Regards,
H
I have try to mount a camera on a moving light and it is very hard to track the performer that way. Technically system works but to track a dancer on stage... No.
I was my first idea to mount a camera on moving light, it avoids field of view problem.
It is mandatory to have a fixed placed camera.
Anyway, i have been asked to implement a "start from dark" function. Performer position will be as a preset or memory or...Ex. Button 1 preset position 1.
Regards,
H
Easy peasy....Mount a camera looking through a spot light sighting tool...
http://www.productionadvantageonline.com/Products/telrad-followspot-sight.aspx
Hey guys, I'm a senior in high school this year and have used this forum for a lot of great ideas and have had an idea myself for a while but need some feedback.
I know that most everywhere followspots are normally manually operated, however at my school we don't have any crew members to spare to have someone operate it. So I was thinking of using some of our moving lights as followspots but aren't sure how practical it would be. In the end I would love to be able to program a few of our fixtures to to follow the path of the actor.... I realize that this could go wrong in many ways (the actor isn't in the right spot, moves faster than the fixture is programmed to move, etc)
Really I want to know what your take is and if any of you have done this before or know the most affective way I can accomplish this.
I know that most everywhere followspots are normally manually operated, however at my school we don't have any crew members to spare to have someone operate it. So I was thinking of using some of our moving lights as followspots but aren't sure how practical it would be. In the end I would love to be able to program a few of our fixtures to to follow the path of the actor.... I realize that this could go wrong in many ways (the actor isn't in the right spot, moves faster than the fixture is programmed to move, etc)
Really I want to know what your take is and if any of you have done this before or know the most affective way I can accomplish this.
This thread covers most of the issues.
http://www.controlbooth.com/threads/moving-light-as-follow-spot.36180
In a high school, the most effective way to solve this is to spend a little time recruiting and training operators rather than investing a lot of time and money in an automated solution. YMMV
http://www.controlbooth.com/threads/moving-light-as-follow-spot.36180
In a high school, the most effective way to solve this is to spend a little time recruiting and training operators rather than investing a lot of time and money in an automated solution. YMMV
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
techieman33
Well-Known Member
Les
Well-Known Member
I hate to sound like such a purist, but I think that would look very robotic. Nothing like having the human touch.
And lets not forget about how hard it can be for actors to hit even a stationary special. Heck, it's even in the Bible!
Job 24:13
"There are those who rebel against the light, who do not know its ways or stay in its paths."
I also recommend stepping up recruiting efforts. From what little I remember of high school, we would have a lot of kids audition or want to be on crew for a musical (the most common use for followspots) and sometimes we would struggle to find jobs for everyone. Most people, when asked nicely and properly trained, would be perfectly happy and do well at operating a spot. Takes a while to get the feel but surely isn't rocket science - I have seen complete newbies get it down in no time.
Last edited:
Hrvoje
Member
It is all about the play, if play request for a followspot operator and there is a enough space for it. Use a followspot operator. Otherwise some other solution needs to be implemented.
I agree with the Les, human touch will never be replaced with automated system. But in situations where followspot must be replaced with a moving light alternative solution must be provided.
Street festivals, small theatres, community theatres, dancing studios.... They all do not have a place dedicated for a follow spot.
Therefore, moving light remotely controlled as followspot must be alternative solution to standalone followspot.
Followspot operator sitting by the light desk and controlling the moving light is alternative solution that combines human touch and remote control moving lights on the topic of moving lights as followspots.
System that uses web camera and pc for remote control is much more usefull compared to systems that uses sensors, dedicated hardware, setup time in hours.....
Well, anyway that is what I think.
Best regards,
H
I agree with the Les, human touch will never be replaced with automated system. But in situations where followspot must be replaced with a moving light alternative solution must be provided.
Street festivals, small theatres, community theatres, dancing studios.... They all do not have a place dedicated for a follow spot.
Therefore, moving light remotely controlled as followspot must be alternative solution to standalone followspot.
Followspot operator sitting by the light desk and controlling the moving light is alternative solution that combines human touch and remote control moving lights on the topic of moving lights as followspots.
System that uses web camera and pc for remote control is much more usefull compared to systems that uses sensors, dedicated hardware, setup time in hours.....
Well, anyway that is what I think.
Best regards,
H
BillConnerFASTC
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure I'd be so confident to say human touch will never be replaced by automation in all things. What's being done today in rigging really exceeds what a whole bunch of humans can do. I suspect it is only time and money preventing the automated follow spot from existing today. If every home and office needed one, it would be developed by now.
Hrvoje
Member
The question here is about the approach to the problem of using moving lights as followspots.
Automated systems needs sensors, sensors have their range and accuracy. Therefore skilled technician or a engineer is needed for a system setup. Sensor net is needed to cover the stage. If those sensors are wireless you have to take care of the that too. In this type of the system performer has to wear transmitter. Small, but still a transmitter with a battery. So in the case of Strictly come dancing for example 8 couples means 16 transmitters.
So, you need at least two people taking care of the transmitters and a single setup technician, in total 3 persons before and during the show.
Other systems, like video analytics is just simply to slow for 30ms refresh rate. Video analytics is now on HD, tomorrow will also be slow, why, because it will have to deal with 4k.
On top of everything there is a setup time problem and cost of the system.
Those are the reasons in my opinion why automated followspot is not in use today, and will not be used tomorrow.
I think that this are the reason why we don't have automated systems on stage, or automated fruit harvesting machines and etc.
Regards,
H
Automated systems needs sensors, sensors have their range and accuracy. Therefore skilled technician or a engineer is needed for a system setup. Sensor net is needed to cover the stage. If those sensors are wireless you have to take care of the that too. In this type of the system performer has to wear transmitter. Small, but still a transmitter with a battery. So in the case of Strictly come dancing for example 8 couples means 16 transmitters.
So, you need at least two people taking care of the transmitters and a single setup technician, in total 3 persons before and during the show.
Other systems, like video analytics is just simply to slow for 30ms refresh rate. Video analytics is now on HD, tomorrow will also be slow, why, because it will have to deal with 4k.
On top of everything there is a setup time problem and cost of the system.
Those are the reasons in my opinion why automated followspot is not in use today, and will not be used tomorrow.
I think that this are the reason why we don't have automated systems on stage, or automated fruit harvesting machines and etc.
Regards,
H
BillConnerFASTC
Well-Known Member
Today or tomorrow - OK. Never? Well, I remember when the Dick Tracy two way wrist video communicator would never happen and 64k was all you'd ever need. I do believe automated follow spots could be successful today but doubt anyone would pay for it.
Amiers
Renting to Corporate One Fixture at a Time.
Wyborn has a great automated solution, I hope that someday someone picks it up and makes it more available price wise for the everyday user.
And I agree with Bill, never say never about something. It is just a matter of time before someone comes along and builds something.
My thoughts are they will use something pre existing ( gps tracking, laser tracker, IR tracking, matrix mapping) making a user friendly program. After that it's just a profile of the mover and a DMX out ( which already exists as well)
The pieces are there someone just hasn't told us they are putting it together or not done it yet. My money is on its still in RnD and nobody is talking about it yet.
And I agree with Bill, never say never about something. It is just a matter of time before someone comes along and builds something.
My thoughts are they will use something pre existing ( gps tracking, laser tracker, IR tracking, matrix mapping) making a user friendly program. After that it's just a profile of the mover and a DMX out ( which already exists as well)
The pieces are there someone just hasn't told us they are putting it together or not done it yet. My money is on its still in RnD and nobody is talking about it yet.
Similar threads
