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My Fair Lady's PAR cans

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by Radman, Apr 11, 2004.

  1. Radman

    Radman Well-Known Member

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    As you may or may not know, I am doing My Fair Lady at school. I was wondering if there would be any good use for about 6 PAR 64's. I have 2 dimmers left, I have no idea what beam the lamp is, but they are coming from the roof support beams in a gym, possibly 40' high. The dimmers have no labelling, but it is a 12 module wall mount thing with 2 dimmers per module. Each dimmer has a 15amp circuit breaker. It is ETC, but not sensor. I have no idea the watts. If hung, they would be about 12' high, above the stage. The stage is 40' wide x 16' deep. At 16' back there is a centered wall 26' wide with 3 arches and 2 window deals. 3' behind that is a thing which I don't feel like explaining, so I will call it a backdrop. Any ideas? :?:
     
  2. Mayhem

    Mayhem Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Par 64's are great for washes and if I was you I would fire them up and have a play with them. They will most likely be loaded with 1000W lamps or 500W ray lamp kits.

    You have plenty of dimmer modules available, so no problems in that department.

    Have fun.
     
  3. Nephilim

    Nephilim Active Member

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    It's the other ETC dimmer line, Unison. Meant for applications where you need architectural control (i.e. wall buttons) as well as standard DMX. My previous HS had three such racks. Remember, each module is two dimmers. Well, usually.
     
  4. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    500w Raylight Kits?

    Raylights come in 300w, 600w, and 800w - at least with 120v lamps. They will look like an aluminum reflector with a exposed little lamp stuck in the center as opposed to the encased inner capsule or filament with reflector/lens assembly around it.

    On the other hand, 500w and 1,000w lamps are common in theater (there are other wattages) - 500w being more useful in theater If 500w. Lamps, you can install three per 15amp dimmer, if 1,000w, than it’s one per dimmer. Be very careful about ensuring what lamp is in the fixture. If you stock both types of lamp, it’s a good idea to mark both Wattages each with their own color of spray paint dot or take a paint marker to the back of the lamp in marking it’s wattage. The writing on them otherwise tends to fade and can only be at best seen from an angle given the proper lighting angle to it and darn good eyes.

    Should the Wattage and description wear off a multi-meter with Ohm’s in setting can tell you the wattage. Most simple way of doing this is to meter the lamp - something like 8 Ohms resistance if I remember right on a 500w lamp, but I’m probably way off. In any case, after you meter the lamp, than meter a lamp with a known wattage - either another PAR lamp or even a Leko lamp. The higher the resistance, the lower the wattage. Thus if you meter a HPL 575w lamp as the control lamp, a PAR 64 with a higher Ohm’s reading will be the 500w lamp. One with much less resistance is going to be the 1,000w lamp. Resistance will fluxuate dependant upon the lamp's rated voltage, manufacturer and age.

    As for the lamps, a lamp with a clear finish to it’s lens is either most likely a low voltage lamp or a very narrow spot. I somewhat doubt you have ACL lamps in stock however and they have screw terminals instead of Mogul Extended End Prong lamp bases - GX-16d or MOEP. The spot will have a pebble finish to the lens, the MFL will have larger about 1" long rectangles on the face of the lens, verses the wide lenses will be about 3/4" long. The more of them little rectangles, the wider the dispersion.

    Should you need the actual beam angles of the lamps that can be given, but you are better off getting a feel for what the lamps you have will do for you in their given beam angles. Just like a 6x9 or 36 degree Leko, the beam angle is nice on paper, but actual experience in knowing what the beam will look like in your mental picture given a certain range is much more useful. Given a 12' throw, the mental picture of what a 6x9 verses 6x12 will do for me is completely ingrained into my brain and has more of an effect than design spec. Very useful to just get those mental pictures of your beam outputs. Play test the fixtures after you figure out the wattages, get to know the output for that wattage also.

    Of note also is on the lamp base to the PAR 64. That lamp base needs to have a strong enough tension on the pins of the lamp that it can pick up the lamp all by itself. Should you attempt to lift a lamp by the lamp base and it falls, you need to replace that lamp base - it’s electrical contact is not sufficient and will cause electrical and heat problems. That and it’s wiring are the primary concerns to check before you attempt to use the fixture. No wire nuts, or brittle and burned up wires.
     
  5. Mayhem

    Mayhem Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    I'll have to check on the ray light kits but I thought that we did a 500W version. Probably wrong on that one though.

    I am glad that I didn't comment on the amp loadings as I would have probably given Australian ratings without thinking about it. So use to having 2400W = 10A and 3200W = 15A. I guess it isn't so bad for us to get confused with 120V, but much more serious when the other way around.

    Guess this is where P=VxI comes into play!

    Mind you, it allows us to double up on the few 120V fixtures that we use!
     
  6. Radman

    Radman Well-Known Member

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    The dimmera are before unison. They are like d54 or something. There are two racks. The first has 6 slots, and each dimmer module has 4 15amp breakers. The second also has 6 slots, but 2 20amp breakers per module.
     
  7. dj_illusions

    dj_illusions Active Member

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    Your right Mayhem, we have them here.

    It is very rare to find a 300w par 64 out here too, unless you have been too cheap to replace with 500 or 1K lamps. 300W's are generally 56's.

    We also have both, 110v and 240v Raycans here, 110v ones are value for money because you get two cans for the price of one as they come patched together to bring the voltage up =)
     
  8. Radman

    Radman Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah I know for sure the second rack is 2.4kw
     
  9. Mayhem

    Mayhem Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Thanks Jeremy - it is good to know that I am not going mad. I have never used Ray lamp kits but was under the impression that they were 240V and were used as an alternative to the standard 110V lamps to avoid the need for twofering them.

    I picked up 8 unloaded 64's not long ago that had been fitted with ray kits and all cans had a standard 10A plug on them. As you know, all our 110V plugs are (or should be) fitted with round earth pins.

    Cheers,
     
  10. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    300w Mayhem and dj_illusions, you will never go mad as long as you have each other plus more. In many ways you are right, It was me that forgot to accommodate for your own home grown lamps. That is given you also have a 300w version of the ray light lamp, but not a 800w version yet - so far. Just wait, it’s probably coming. For note, the 300w PAR lamp is normally a PAR 56 here also. It’s just that in the Ray Lights - them aluminum reflector lamps you advised, with the stick in GY9.5 or GZ 9.5 baselamp, for 120v or in your case, for 120v it is the above wattages. Hmm, a hunt, given a GY or GZ 9.5 base and 36.5mm LCL (Lamp Center Length,) your appropriate ray light lamps would be the :
    JCD230v-300wC Ushio #1000912 CL, Quartz 300w/230v G-24mm 2cc-8 LCL 36.5mm GY9.5 (GY 9.5, 16x21 Base) 3,150°K 7,050 Lum 75hr




    FSX Osram #54897 (#93592) CL, Quartz, Proximity Reflector 400w/230v T-6 10x7x12.2 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Base Down ±90° 3,200°K N/A 75hr
    FSY Osram #54898 (#93591) CL, Quartz, Proximity Reflector 400w/240v T-6 10x7x12.2 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Base Down ±90° 3,200°K N/A 75hr

    EMG Osram/Sylvania #54828 CL, Quartz 500w/220v T-6 LCL 36.5mm GZ 9.5 Projector Lamp, Base Down to Horz 3,200°K N/A 60hr

    EMG Philips #923879243200 (#5968) (A1/254), CL, Quartz Prox. Reflect. 500w/230v T-22mm Bi-Plane LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 (Filmt. Reflector 9x10mm) Base Down ±90° 3,200°K 11,550 Lum 50hr

    #64680 Osram (A1/233) CL, Quartz 500w/230v T-22mm 10x10mm LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Universal Burn Pos. 3,200°K 14,500 Lum 50hr
    A1/244 G.E. #39643 (?disc.) (A1/244) CL, Quartz 500w/220-230v c-13 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Monoplane Grid Filmt. Base Down to Horz 13,000 Lum 75hr

    A1/244 (240v) G.E. #39644 (?disc.) (A1/244) CL, Quartz 500w/240v c-13 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Monoplane Grid Filmt. Base Down to Horz 13,000 Lum 75hr

    FGP/EMG Philips #923879245700 (#5968) (A1/254) CL, Quartz Prox. Reflect. 500w/240v T-22mm Bi-Plane LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 (Filmt. Reflector 9x10mm) Base Down ±90° 3,200°K 11,550 Lum 50hr

    QT Thorn (M-40) CL, Quartz 500w/240v GY 9.5 (Sym to Osram & Philips M40) CRG 1A 2,950°K 10,000 Lum 2,000hr
    JCD240v-500wC Ushio #1000914 CL, Qaurtz 500w/240v G-24mm 2cc-8 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Base Down to Horz. 3,200°K 12,500 Lum 50hr
    JCS240v-500wC Ushio (?Disc.) CL, Quartz 500w/240v T-22mm c-13 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 (GY 9.5, 16x28 Base) 3,200°K 12,500 Lum 75hr

    DYR (220v) G.E. #33248 (A1/233) (?Disc. See 230v) CL, Quartz 650w/220v G-7 2cc-8 LCL 1.7/16" GY 9.5 (2-Pin Pf) Any Burn Pos., Ray Light Lamp 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr
    DYR (220v) Ushio #1000249 CL, Quartz 650w/220v G-24mm 2cc-8 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Base Down to Horz. 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr
    DYR (220v) Wiko CL, Quartz 650w/220v G-7 2CC-8 LCL 36.5mm GZ 9.5 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr
    JCD/DYR(220v) PEC CL, Quartz 650w/220v 25mm 2cc-8 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 3,200°K 3,200 Lum 50hr

    DYR (230v) G.E. #33248 (?disc.) (A1/223) CL, Quartz 650w/230v 2cc-8 LCL 37mm GZ 9.5 (11.4x1.4mm Filmt.) Any Burn Pos. Prot. Fr. Moist. 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr
    DYR (230v) Osram #54839 (#64686) CL, Quartz 650w/230v 10x10mm LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Any Burn Pos. 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr

    DYR (240v) G.E. #33250 (A1/233) CL, Quartz 650w/240v G-7 2cc-8 LCL 1.7/16" GY 9.5 (11.4x1.4mm Filmt.) Any Burn Pos. Prot. Fr. Moist. 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr
    DYR (240v) Ushio #1000250 CL, Quartz 650w/240v G-24mm 2cc-8 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 (GY 9.5, 16x21 Base) Base Down to Horz 3,200°K 16,500 Lum 50hr

    JCS240v-650wC Ushio (?Disc.) CL, Quartz 650w/240v T-22mm c-13 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 (GY 9.5, 16x28 Base) 3,200°K 16,250 Lum 75hr
    A1/247 (240v) G.E. #39650 (?disc.) (A1/247) CL, Quartz 650w/240v c-13 LCL 36.5mm GY 9.5 Monoplane Grid Filmt. Base Down to Horz 17,750 Lum 75hr



    Shal we start on 230/240v PAR 64 lamps? Or just say you have a wattage range of as you say, 500w to 800w, to 1Kw. There is no need to twofer your 120v lamps, just buy the proper ones for your voltage. Sorry but you don’t have any 600w or 1.2Kw lamps at this time, but you do have a good selection of 230v lamps you don’t have to twofer/run in series.
     
  11. tenor_singer

    tenor_singer Active Member

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    I just wrapped up My Fair Lady and I have 8 PAR 56's.

    I used them as front scrim lighting. When Eliza sings "Just You Wait" I had the scrim fly in and the chorus acted out what she was singing as if it were a "day dreaming" sequence. While my crew was clearing the set from behind the scrim, I used my PAR's to keep it opaque until the "dreaming" began. I then turned them off and like magic, Eliza's mental image came to life before the audience's eyes.

    I hope this helps... It was a very cool, and yet simple effect.

    Yours in theater.

    Tenor
     
  12. Radman

    Radman Well-Known Member

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    If only we could fly...
    We open in less than 2 weeks and I only have one dimmer, and no cables left, plus this saturday is dry tech, I am scrapping the Idea. Too much work, not to mention the scrim is never moving from it's spot tween the stage and backstage. This is going to be interesting...
     
  13. tenor_singer

    tenor_singer Active Member

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    I may have mislead you when I used the term "fly". I don't have fly space (my ceiling tops out at 13' above the stage floor. If this is the case for you, you can try what I do. I buy links of 4" PVC pipe and 2" PVC pipe. I mount scenes or scrims with the 2" pipe at the top to the ceiling and the 4" pipe slides in a pocket at the bottom. You can rig ropes in such a way that will "roll" the scene or scrim up as you pull the ropes through a series of pullies from off stage. If you need to know the trick for this, I will happily explain further. If you do know, It does work, but for really large drops you may need a farily bulky stage crew member (I had a 40' wide drop for my last show that probably weighed 150 pounds after all of the paint was applied to it. I had a football lineman assigned to the task of unrolling and rerolling it... alas... I don't have a counterweight system... I have a Bart (6'5" 320# tackle who benches close to 350# :) ) )
     
  14. Radman

    Radman Well-Known Member

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    If it were up to me I would but the director wants it fixed behind the flat-track so when they pull out the flats they will see the scrim.
     

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