Need a Proposal Form for Tendering a New soundsystem for Theater

Hi Guys,
Our theater needs to upgrade our theater audio system. The current system is an old altec 9844a so its more than overdue.
Our Gm is big on forms to keep organized and detailed, so he can take it to our board of directors and start the tendering process.
My question is as we are taking measurements, figuring out possible hanging point and collecting other technical data is there any document or forms out there that we can use as a template, to plug all of that data into ensure that is organized, professional and complete, so we can then give that package to various audio companies to start the tendering phase and see what they would recommend in terms of gear. Also with a type of form it will ensure were not leaving anything out.
I want to be consistent, so that every potential sound company has the same information, to give us a true comparison of price and equipment for the same space.
At this point right now, were just looking at our main speakers and possible digital snake and console. Any band type of events that use a monitor rig we sub contact out.
I just need some sort form or guide to formulate the data were gathering about our venue.
Any help is greatly appreciated,
Thanks,
soundguy
 
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I usually just use a simple excel form for gear. Everything should have a line item and quotes should be in the same line item order. For anything need drawings or installation you open yourself up to a lot more paperwork and proper contracts and such. That is a bit beyond what you should be doing if you don't know how to properly write a contract.

Here is what it really comes down to... do you want to design the system yourself or do you want a consultant to design the system? Whats is your proposed budget?

What each audio company will give you will be vastly different if you don't hand them a design to bid to. You won't get apples to apples. My opinion is this...

Get a system designer you trust. If you are working in a government center most will allow you to higher a designer without going through a bid process. Let that person figure out what you need, produce drawings, and then you can take those drawings to bid. That person can write a scope of work as well. If that person happens to also own an audio company let them know that you will not be using them for the installation, only for the design.

Either way, you want to take a unified package to get bids on. You don't want a company A to give you all D&B gear while company B gives you all QSC. You'll end up with whatever bid is cheapest and you'll lose it because you won't get the gear you really need.
 
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If you've never put a specification document together for a tender then you should engage a consultant to do so for you.
They will ask you all the questions about what you want, what you need, and your budget, and a lot of other things you've not considered, in order to write something that companies can successfully tender to. This is a massive time & money saving exercise for you & the venue!!!!

Before this step you need to gather your own information as to:
What are the problems with your current system? Things like clarity, coverage, volume, maintenance, appearance etc.
What do you want the new system to be able to do?

Make sure to ask audience members, hirers and in house operators for their valuable opinions.

You should consider breaking the project down into sections: Speakers & rigging, amps & cabling, console & networking, in order to make it easier.


Make sure to trial some systems in your venue (if possible) as that's the best way to ensure you get a quality result, and not rely on computer generated diagrams!
 
Thanks guys for the replies,
Unfortunately Based on where we are the consultant thing, is not really an option for us. But Rick your comments about breaking down the project into areas is exactly what were looking into and trying to formulate,
I was just wondering if there was any documents or templates that would organize that data and help keep us on track, so its clear for the potential companies when we open it up for tendering.
Our GM is just getting to the various types of tendering process, and suggested to search for a template or form to follow to stay on track.
As for the operator, that would be me. I have made note of some of the things I would like to see and accomplish with the new system for the type of events we have. I also have made note of key concerns that will need to addressed by any of the potential sound companys.
So I am looking for some sort of form or template, that would not only organize the technical data but also these concerns it a nice package.
Thanks,
soundguy
 
OK, from what it looks like you want to write what I would call an RFP (request for proposal). I've never heard of "tendering" before... but from what I gather its the same process but slightly more goverment oriented. Google RFP template, there are tons of them out there.... one here: https://www.pandadoc.com/request-for-proposal-template

You will want a person who knows what the final product should look like when writing the RFP. It does need to be rather specific if you care about competitive bids. In it you setup your parameters for final performance the the contractor has to hit those.

Once again, I urge you if this is going to be more then a 50k project to get a consultant on board. Don't let a sound company just come in and install whatever they think you need. You can't get apples to apples quotes unless you are getting quotes on the same install, same gear, and same installation quality.

Is this for a government owned venue? You might have a whole heap of other issues there... it is pretty common in that situation to require bid documents that are separate from the design. Where I work we specifically can not accept construction/install bids from any company that participated in the design of the project. So, if we want the best audio company in town to design our system... we can't have them install it.
 
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Thanks guys for the replies,
Unfortunately Based on where we are the consultant thing, is not really an option for us. But Rick your comments about breaking down the project into areas is exactly what were looking into and trying to formulate,
I was just wondering if there was any documents or templates that would organize that data and help keep us on track, so its clear for the potential companies when we open it up for tendering.
Our GM is just getting to the various types of tendering process, and suggested to search for a template or form to follow to stay on track.
As for the operator, that would be me. I have made note of some of the things I would like to see and accomplish with the new system for the type of events we have. I also have made note of key concerns that will need to addressed by any of the potential sound companys.
So I am looking for some sort of form or template, that would not only organize the technical data but also these concerns it a nice package.
Thanks,
soundguy
Hello!
You're getting great advice so far and I'd like to write a few lines expanding upon it.
Kyle's correct, you want to create a request for proposals.
Be sure to put hard dates and times on things:
When do you need to receive proposals.
When can work commence?
When can work not occur.
When does work need to be complete by.
When does testing need to be complete by.
Specifically list how cleanup and removal of garbage is to be handled.
Do you want things reasonably cleaned up daily, weekly, monthly.
Do you have recycling and dumpsters on site which contractors are free to use or specifically CAN NOT use.
Do you have any bookings in place which MUST be accommodated.
Spell out ALL of your needs and concerns up front.
If you have specific brands you want, or DON'T want, say so up front.
Specify performance in real, measurable / testable / verifiable numbers.
Specify coverage areas as well as areas where you do not want coverage.
Proposals may come from design / build contractors.
You don't want any contractor's first project.
You REALLY don't want any contractor's first theatre.
So many general contractors view theatres as 'Just a big building with a large void in the middle so how complicated can it be?' You DON'T want those contractors.
Ask for references. Call references and ask questions. Meet with the people and view the work in person. A few hours driving may be a few hours well invested. You're more likely to get a better feel / more honest opinion face to face than on the phone viewing photos.
Everyone, most everyone, is thrilled with their NEW theatre / system / what have you. They WANT to like it. It's NEW and what they've waited for. Place less value on more recent references and greater value on references from people who have lived with their new spaces / systems for a year or more, long enough to know how well their needs have been met overall.
Optimistically you have many friends and associates who've already been through this process multiple times. Call upon them for their experiences, both good and bad, and their expertise. If you don't already personally know a number of people in this boat, ask here on CB. A lot of us here have have gone through this multiple times, from several perspectives, over multiple decades. No one here wants to do ALL of your work for you for free but if you get off your duff and start getting your 'ducks lined up' many of us here will be pleased to chime in and aid you with your 'duck alignment meetings'.
Begin with an RFP, request for proposals.
Be willing to accept, read, and consider CCN's, Contemplated Change Notices.
If a CN, change notice, is accepted it becomes a CN with a number along with ALL details of the change and the date it goes into effect. You won't believe how CCN's and CN's can ripple through a project and how many contractors will use them to maximize profits, gouge you to the limit and beyond.
Realize you're going to 'push a lot of paper', whether or not much actual paper is involved, and ride heard on a lot of details, aspects and people.
Sorry to have droned on. More than enough said.
Edited to add: Be sure to spell out ALL aspects of proof of performance and ALL aspects of insurance too!
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.
 
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Hello!
You're getting great advice so far and I'd like to write a few lines expanding upon it.
Kyle's correct, you want to create a request for proposals.
Be sure to put hard dates and times on things:
When do you need to receive proposals.
When can work commence?
When can work not occur.
When does work need to be complete by.
When does testing need to be complete by.
Specifically list how cleanup and removal of garbage is to be handled.
Do you want things reasonably cleaned up daily, weekly, monthly.
Do you have recycling and dumpsters on site which contractors are free to use or specifically CAN NOT use.
Do you have any bookings in place which MUST be accommodated.
Spell out ALL of your needs and concerns up front.
If you have specific brands you want, or DON'T want, say so up front.
Specify performance in real, measurable / testable / verifiable numbers.
Specify coverage areas as well as areas where you do not want coverage.
Proposals may come from design / build contractors.
You don't want any contractor's first project.
You REALLY don't want any contractor's first theatre.
So many general contractors view theatres as 'Just a big building with a large void in the middle so how complicated can it be?' You DON'T want those contractors.
Ask for references. Call references and ask questions. Meet with the people and view the work in person. A few hours driving may be a few hours well invested. You're more likely to get a better feel / more honest opinion face to face than on the phone viewing photos.
Everyone, most everyone, is thrilled with their NEW theatre / system / what have you. They WANT to like it. It's NEW and what they've waited for. Place less value on more recent references and greater value on references from people who have lived with their new spaces / systems for a year or more, long enough to know how well their needs have been met overall.
Optimistically you have many friends and associates who've already been through this process multiple times. Call upon them for their experiences, both good and bad, and their expertise. If you don't already personally know a number of people in this boat, ask here on CB. A lot of us here have have gone through this multiple times, from several perspectives, over multiple decades. No one here wants to do ALL of your work for you for free but if you get off your duff and start getting your 'ducks lined up' many of us here will be pleased to chime in and aid you with your 'duck alignment meetings'.
Begin with an RFP, request for proposals.
Be willing to accept, read, and consider CCN's, Contemplated Change Notices.
If a CN, change notice, is accepted it becomes a CN with a number along with ALL details of the change and the date it goes into effect. You won't believe how CCN's and CN's can ripple through a project and how many contractors will use them to maximize profits, gouge you to the limit and beyond.
Realize you're going to 'push a lot of paper', whether or not much actual paper is involved, and ride heard on a lot of details, aspects and people.
Sorry to have droned on. More than enough said.
Edited to add: Be sure to spell out ALL aspects of proof of performance and ALL aspects of insurance too!
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard.

Thats kind of the big deal here. When you get into installation, you also get into contract law. The contract has to spell out a ton of stuff that does not pertain to the projects outcome but how the project will be carried out. Last year we did a million dollar job to replace our entire rigging system. The project manual was 300 pages. 6 of those pages dealt with the actual system installed. The rest covered workman like manor practices, firestop, and how change orders are dealt with. The contract was also devided into different trades (construction and electrcial) in this case.

Once again, if you have never done this before you need some help. There is no boilerplate template out there for this... each organization is different and requires different things. The "strings attached" part of the contract is just as if not more important then the "what we need" part.
 
Thanks guys,
Footer, Thanks for that, at least you gave me something to search with. I think the link that you posted, is in the right direction,but I feel that I would still need to attach a technical document to that, to complete the project document.
The technical document, which is where were at now, would include the room measurements, capacity, room configurations (ie pit seating vs no pit seating), (Half House vs full house), hang points locations, acoustic issues, type of events ect.
Were trying to keep it basic but provide enough information for a sound company to recommend a system. I have been searching for template for us to use for hat technical data, I just haven`t found one yet.
Once that is done, we then can attach that to a Request for Proposal document listing other things such as expectations, and submit that to various company to start the "tendering process"
On a side we are funded in partial by the government, however were not subject to the red tape and restrictions like you mentioned. So we have allot more freedom to organize the process in what ever manor we choose.
Thanks again,
Soundguy99
 
I have been searching for template for us to use for hat technical data, I just haven`t found one yet.

You are not going to find one more than a traditional tech specs for a theatre... and that won't really be any help here. They are really going to want to see full building "as built" drawings. If you don't have these things get much harder and your quotes are going to be very high. Unless you have rated hanging points with PE stamped drawings no contractor in their right mind will take your word for it. They will have to do verification and get those stamped drawings which can cost serious money. Same thing goes for acoustic issues....

Once again, if you have never designed a PA install learning while doing one is not the way to go. If you were just swapping out consoles or monitors you can do that yourself without much issue. Installing speakers is another matter. Don't let the people who are doing the selling of gear also do the design. You won't get a good product in the end.

Now, if you are just looking to spend 50k on some QSC boxes that you are going to spray and pray with... then just write up an RFQ and be done with it.

If you don't have any procurement restrictions, call each contractor you are thinking of going with, ask them about the work they have done, and get references. Call those references and see how things worked out for them. Pick your favorite. Have them do you design and give you the RFP to send out. They can bid on it themselves but let them know that you will be seeking other bids as well. Two phases here. Pay for a designer. Pay for an installer. Don't just pay once.

To give you an idea of what an RFP looks like: https://nyspro.ogs.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2005-Tm40_268.pdf

Thats 145 pages to install a chain link fence.
 
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