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New Energy Bill

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by DarSax, Dec 21, 2007.

  1. DarSax

    DarSax Active Member

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    Compliments of Reuters, here.

    I don't know if theatrical bulbs (lamps) are exempt under the bill, not having researched it further, but I figured I'd might as well post it for general information (I know that there was a lot of discussion on this topic in the California energy/bulb bill a while ago, linked here).

    What I thought was most interesting was this:
    Phillips just acquired Color Kinetics, right, and with it a lot of patents and technology for LED technology? Call my cynical, but I find it an interesting coincidence...trying to develop a stronger demand for LED tech now that they hold more of the cards?

    just my declining 2 cents
     
  2. gafftapegreenia

    gafftapegreenia CBMod CB Mods

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    This light bulb ban thing is really starting to annoy me, and I'm a crazy liberal. CFL's are not a magic bullet, they are simply once piece of the solution. LED's, CFL's and yes the standard standard A-lamp all do certain things very well, and others not so. This is all just tactics to make the basic citizen feel like progress is being made. It's a well constructed ruse. Why not some actual reforms where the power comes from for these lamps? Why not actually do something about the larger sources of pollution than some homeowner who uses an 60W A-lamp in a table lamp? There's all these new coal fired power plants, and little willingness to actually invest in a substantial renewable energy infrastructure.

    Those old enough,(not me) remember the last light bulb reform, with all the "watt-miser" and such items. Overall, how effective was that?

    I'm sorry, I could rant more, but I think it'd be mostly preaching to the choir. Point is this "light bulb ban" is but a baby step towards a solution for much bigger problems.
     
  3. Jezza

    Jezza Active Member

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    I am happy to see this bill passed. I only hope it is actually going to have a serious impact and significant executive backing to ensure these new standards are met, unlike previous measures under other administrations -- this administration certainly does not have a good track record either.

    I think that the theatrical industry falls under a different umbrella of sorts than most consumers, as do other small industries, but I would not be surprised if you see a significant decrease in tungsten fixtures in our industry in the next 10 years. With LEDs becoming so common place, and their wattage ever increasing, manufactures like Philips are taking every advantage possible to further that part of the industry.

    While Philips might be reaping the profits from this new energy bill as a result of their recent purchase of CK, I don't think their motives are purely economic. I have seen, and do see, a conscious effort on the part of Philips to improve efficiency and decrease the environmental impact of their products. They are in the energy business, and regardless of their politics or opinions, they recognize this is where they must steer the industry for not only the future of their company, but to go with the trends we see evolving in energy usage and consumption.

    If you were not aware, Philips also recently purchase Genlyte (makers of VL, Strand, etc). I'm curious to see how Philips will have an impact on these companies from an energy efficiency standpoint. Perhaps a brighter, lower wattage VL3500 is in our future. Given the recent acquiring of the patents that CK held, I would not be surprised to see a serious effort put forth by Philips to create a competitive LED based ML. The issues are large with such a fixture, but I hope they'll try hard to make it a reality.

    Edit: Just read gaffatapegreenia's comments and wanted to echo them. I am as well a crazy liberal and do feel that this new bill is not going to be the saving grace. It was just another political ploy to give the appearance that the government is behind the grassroots movement towards better efficiency and sustainable energy sources, where the only true impact is being made. CFLs and LEDs are excellent, they are much more efficient than any tungsten source could dream to be. But our energy is still being supplied by coal, oil, gas, etc. Its not until we move away from this legacy and love affair with oil and our SUVs that we will ever be able to start salvaging what's left of our environment. I encourage you all, especially those on this forum still in their younger years, to make a conscious effort to do what you can towards decreasing our impact as an industry. RANT OVER!
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2007
  4. avkid

    avkid Not a New User Fight Leukemia

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    Yet again with the wattage thing.
    Wattage is irrelevant in this argument.
    Lumens

    The watt is the SI derived unit of power, equal to one joule of energy per second.

    The lumen is the SI unit of luminous flux, a measure of the perceived power of light.
     
  5. JD

    JD Well-Known Member

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    Call me a cynic, but in my opinion, it's all a game. The conversion to CFL's will reduce greenhouse gas emissions by .03%. We need to do things that will make a 20% or 50% difference!

    GE, one of the bigger manufacturers of "alternative" light sources, also owns rights to billions of dollars of "carbon credits", which only become of value for them to resell if certain legislation is passed (this being one.) They are also the parent company of NBC, which just ran a full week promoting alternative lighting under the guise of "green week."

    I am a die-hard conservationist, but this is 99.9% about money & profit, and .1% about the planet.

    Oh, by the way, guess who funded most of the lobbying effort on getting the current bill passed?

    GEeeee, I don't know!
     
  6. Jezza

    Jezza Active Member

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    Totally agree JD. I knew the NBC week was too good to be true. Its unfortunate you know, I see this stuff on the news and I hear it on the radio about all these people and companies who seem to be heading in the right direction, its uplifting almost. Sometimes its hard to come to my senses and realize how much of it really is just about profit, and how corrupt and depressing that idea is. How immoral.

    Anyways, so ok we need to make a 50% difference, we know that isn't going to come from the government or corporations. It needs to start with people like us making our own decisions about increasingly efficiency, using more sustainable energy sources, and changing our attitudes about energy usage.

    So I pose this question to rest of CB, what can we do throughout our industry to decrease our impact? I'm talking in manufacturing and fixtures and such, but also in our day to day practices, our methods, our behavior. What are you doing already? What could you be doing better? Whose stopping you and why?
     
  7. Charc

    Charc Well-Known Member

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    Don't "preheat", cut all intensities in half, and get rid of half your inventory. I can provide a "recycling center" here in Philly, just include lamps. ;)
     
  8. gafftapegreenia

    gafftapegreenia CBMod CB Mods

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    Ban the FEL!
     
  9. Charc

    Charc Well-Known Member

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    ...but... I have like 25 in the air!
     
  10. icewolf08

    icewolf08 CBMod CB Mods

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    A small aside here, but for those who didn't know the NBC "chimes" that you hear before the news, and when they pop up the full screen NBC logos and such are what notes?

    G E C

    Why?

    General Electric Corp.
     
  11. JD

    JD Well-Known Member

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    CFLs have another dirty side that no one is talking about. People are trained to throw away light bulbs when they die. You can’t do that with a CFL. They contain several neurotoxins such as mercury that should not end up in landfills. Of course, we all know that because we deal with these types of lamps everyday, but how about the average homeowner? And when was the last time you dropped a light bulb at home? Big deal, just get out a dust pan and broom. Well, with CFLs you now have a mini toxic waste spill! Those chemicals tend to stay around a long time. Is the dog eating something off the floor? How about your toddler? Is he/she crawling around where a CFL broke 3 years ago? We are talking about hundreds of millions of these things out there!

    There are so many ways for us to conserve electricity without bringing toxins into the home. How about just getting people to turn off a light when they leave the room? How about appliance manufacturers building appliances that actually TURN OFF when you turn off the power switch, instead of going into some “low energy” state!

    In the theater lighting biz, there are a lot of things we can do.

    1) Dimmer packs usually have an idle set. Even when the board is off, the dimmer may still be passing power. We can add a true shut down protocol to our end-of-night routine.
    2) Fixtures vary greatly in efficiency. Tell your manager how “green” it would be to change out some of those old lekos for Source 4’s ;)
    3) House lights? We all want them to dim, but how about installing a second flood system that uses HPS or MH lights to get the place lit up when there is no audience there! Cleaning crews don’t care if they are getting a “theatrical” effect.
    4) Preheating? I know, it’s a big debate, but make sure your preheat routine is as minimalistic as needed to get the job done.

    I’m sure I forgot a lot of things, so lets keep this thread alive with other suggestions!

    EDIT:
    “soft off” started in the 80’s when appliances started using microprocessors. Well folks, we now live in an age where there is nonvolatile RAM. So, why do so many appliances still use it? It’s cheaper to build something where you keep the main power supply going and just fake an off state. Otherwise, you would have to add some parts, like a relay and a small backup power supply (think 1 watt) to trip the relay on. Instead, we now have appliances that suck up 20 times that in the “off” state!
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2007
  12. SteveB

    SteveB Well-Known Member

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    Unless NBC changed the chimes, they have (had) been using the same chime for decades, long before they became part of GE.

    SB
     
  13. SteveB

    SteveB Well-Known Member

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    As to light bulbs.

    My main 2400 seat rental hall uses tons of incandescants
    - 5 rows of 80-90 some odd across @ 40w A lamps ea., 440 or so total, plus 220 or so recessed dual socket down light fixtures that use 200w PS lamps (another 400 lamps). Huge load for house lighting. We wanted to upgrade when we renovated in the early 2000's, but when we were researching, LED's were very new and very expensive. Thue we ended up with about 50 Sensor dimmers just for house lighting.

    My big concern is that as the rest of the works stops using lamps we use in bulk, the cost per bulb will go way up, which when combined with the labor to change bulbs will finally drive the powers-that-be to consoder a green upgrade.

    Steve B.
     
  14. JD

    JD Well-Known Member

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    I think there are some good "green" alternatives in the near future. As stated earlier, a dual system would eliminate firing up all those incandescents just so the floors can be swept, or any of 100 other tasks that are outside of the hour leading up to curtain, where you really want things to look nice.

    I just think that every time legislation forces a change, it usually turns into a mess or lines someone's pockets. There is a "perceived" savings on using a CFL that is 15 watts to replace a 60 watt light bulb, but is that for real? I'm not talking about consumption, but the energy used in manufacturing it which is very intense. The last article I read indicated that as much energy is used building one as it will consume over its rated lifespan! So, we are up to 30 watts? Still a good thing, right? Well, hold the phone- Most all are coming out of China, which is using the dirtiest form of coal plants to produce that energy, and has an environmental record that makes me want to puke! And of course there is the disposal issue.

    So, what can we do? Well, the fact that the new law is causing us all to talk about energy usage is the best benefit I see. But before you jump in your 200 horsepower SUV to drive down to the store to pick some up, remember, turning the key is like lighting up a 150,000 watt light bulb! (750 watts per horsepower.)

    I don't think regular light bulbs are going to become scarce anytime soon. By the time they do, we will have moved on to something else, not because of any law but because it will be cheaper and more practical to use.
     

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