No more GrandMasters on ETC consoles

Les

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Feb 24, 2004
Location
DFW, Tx.
@Les the GM function still exists on modern boards. What doesn't exist is a dedicated hardware location for the GM. Every fader on the console could be assigned the job.
Yeah, it just means more prep.

(I may or may not still be bitter about how hard it is to busk with LEDs and taking it out on the GM).
 
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chausman

Chase
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Spokane, WA
Personally, I never have events where a blackout from a GM is ever really a good response. I'd much rather have a panic button on a magic sheet that triggered a controlled fade to a decent look on stage. And for ease of training or quick action, you could very easily use the contact closure inputs, a cable with a DB15 connector, a decent inexpensive pushbutton, and an enclosure to create a very easy to use physical panic button. It's inexpensive, and infinitely more flexible than just fading everything out. And since there are 4 inputs, you can actually have up to 4 different actions with different pushbuttons.
 

RonHebbard

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Jun 12, 2004
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Waterdown, ON, CA
Yeah, it just means more prep.

(I may or may not still be bitter about how hard it is to busk with LEDs and taking it out on the GM).
@Les Tell us how your REALLY feel; LED's = Lousy Effin' Devices. RGB's = Really Gross Bulbs, is that what you're saying?
O.K. @derekleffew I'll say it for you: Bulbs go in the ground LAMPS have Bases and insert in SOCKETS. Socket toomie and let's press on.
Toodleoo!
Ron (from north of Donnie's walls) Hebbard
 

Les

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Joined
Feb 24, 2004
Location
DFW, Tx.
Personally, I never have events where a blackout from a GM is ever really a good response.
The kind of event I'm talking about, while rare, is the type where we have the mayor or someone like that speaking before the show. Maybe they want to show a quick video, and this is the only night it's happening. The cue stack is set, the LD has left the building, etc etc. I can program a cue, but then I need to remember to delete it later. Oh and we just found out this afternoon :). It's super easy to simply tell the board op to duck the GM during this video. And it doesn't require training, which is great, because I'm busy setting up the D&^^N projector and running the video.

It's not a huge issue (and I'll admit to being overdramatic), but it is losing one more tool that very occasionally makes life a little easier.
 
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SteveB

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Mar 20, 2004
Location
Brooklyn, NY
The kind of event I'm talking about, while rare, is the type where we have the mayor or someone like that speaking before the show. Maybe they want to show a quick video, and this is the only night it's happening. The cue stack is set, the LD has left the building, etc etc. I can program a cue, but then I need to remember to delete it later. Oh and we just found out this afternoon :). It's super easy to simply tell the board op to duck the GM during this video. And it doesn't require training, which is great, because I'm busy setting up the D&^^N projector and running the video.

It's not a huge issue (and I'll admit to being overdramatic), but it is losing one more tool that very occasionally makes life a little easier.
Of the 4 different consoles in the Eos line (not Element), there’s the Eos Ti, Gio, Gio @5, Ion XE with faders and Ion XE without. The first 4, having faders, are super easy to have a fader set as a GM. On the no fader Ion, I’d bet 90% of the time it’s going to have a fader wing sitting next to it.

If you work a space that has events that are occasionally less than well planned out, it’s really very easy to configure a GM. I’m reasonably certain that this is what the thinking was at ETC when they went this route.
 

DavidJones

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Jun 7, 2017
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Touring
So... What I'm hearing from Steve and Jay is that they are so angry about having no dedicated grandmaster, that they will both refuse to assign it to somewhere else on the board, even though they know there is a good possibility that they will need it, and the show will probably be ruined because of this. Guys, please PM me your resumes; those are some winning attitudes right there.
 

SteveB

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Joined
Mar 20, 2004
Location
Brooklyn, NY
So... What I'm hearing from Steve and Jay is that they are so angry about having no dedicated grandmaster, that they will both refuse to assign it to somewhere else on the board, even though they know there is a good possibility that they will need it, and the show will probably be ruined because of this. Guys, please PM me your resumes; those are some winning attitudes right there.
David, Trying not to get confrontational on this but here's a statement you made that is offensive;

"Please don't be offended by this, but "events" being unpredictable and NEEDING a GM is an excuse for not being prepared and not programing a proper show "

Jay and I have both indicated in numerous posts that the situations we find ourselves in as professionals (43 year in my case) sometimes requires a GM be available and it has nothing to do with being prepared and is not about adequately programming. We just sometimes aren't give the time for either, yet apply every bit of our skills to making an event as perfect a possible.

My statement on my last post was seemingly missed, as I stated "super easy to have a fader set as a GM". I've no real concern either way as I've 6 Ions that all have GM's and I was perfectly happy to move to a Gio @5 that didn't. I knew it had 5 faders and I could set up one as GM and/or use one of the countless fader wings I've got around.

I recall one event that I lit was Ray Charles and he told me it was "TOO BRIGHT" (this is the truth). Rather than fix a gazillion cues I dropped the GM and left it there the rest of the show. I stopped updating my resume after that as I realized my career was toast, so have nothing to send you.
 

Jay Ashworth

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Joined
Feb 7, 2014
Location
St Pete FL USA
So... What I'm hearing from Steve and Jay is that they are so angry about having no dedicated grandmaster, that they will both refuse to assign it to somewhere else on the board, even though they know there is a good possibility that they will need it, and the show will probably be ruined because of this. Guys, please PM me your resumes; those are some winning attitudes right there.
What SteveB said, and also, no, David, that's *not* what I said; please dont mischaracterize my points.

What I *said* was that being able to assign the GM to a random, installation-dependent fader on a wing (if you have one) solves only one of the 3 or 4 problems solved by haveing a dedicated GM in a fixed spot on the main facepanel.

This is a question of UI design, and it's separate from whether you need the damn fader in the first place; that's a red herring in this part of the conversation -- we've already taken as read that that answer is "yes" by the time we get here.

Any other of my points you'd like to mischaracterize? :)
 

MNicolai

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There's still time before the New Year to get in one last "11 WAYS YOU COULD BE LABELING AND SORTING GEL BETTER" thread before an entire wave of college students have no idea what gel is and next year's rehash becomes "12 WAYS..." where the twelfth way is sorting gel into the nearest recycle bin.
 

ElGusto

Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2013
Location
Southwestern Virginia
This might be a little unpopular but the Blackout and GM have always seemed to be such heavy-handed ways to do that. If I need to dark in a panic, theres always [select active][out] or [selective active] @ 0 [Sneak]. But if we are talking faders, the manual time fader is my favorite thing these days.
 

Les

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Joined
Feb 24, 2004
Location
DFW, Tx.
Unfortunately, sometimes things just need to be ID10-T proof.
 
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