Non-Profit Community Theater + Outdated Dimmers

[Edrick]

For all of you who work in non-profit community based theater what has been your methods for getting new(er) equipment for free or cheap. Do companies such as ETC have discounts for non-profits, or do you scrounge the local area for places that might be getting rid of systems?

The reason I ask is because a local community theater I just started helping out at, has an ancient dimming system. They have multiple packs that are stored on storage shelfs. I'm not sure about the specifics as I just did a quick look but I believe they were 6 Channel dimmers that were about 2-3 feet wide and a foot or 2 high. With the front being where you patch the stage pin cables into. They were perhaps a green/aqua in color.

So back to the original subject, I think it'd be great to see if I can locate them a rack dimming system that would be perhaps more modern.

 

[derekleffew]

...The reason I ask is because a local community theater I just started helping out at, has an ancient dimming system. They have multiple packs that are stored on storage shelfs. I'm not sure about the specifics as I just did a quick look but I believe they were 6 Channel dimmers that were about 2-3 feet wide and a foot or 2 high. With the front being where you patch the stage pin cables into. They were perhaps a green/aqua in color.

Did they look like these?

Are they like these?

If so, I would be glad to take them off your hands, as we can always use more parts.

Yup. I have 6 or 8 of them. If you want them, come get them!

TTI--Theatre Techniques, Inc. Not bad dimmers, and repairing them, and possibly adding a DAC, is very likely less than buying new. Chances are any available funds would be better spent on fixtures, distribution, or control rather than dimmers.

Manufacturers don't generally offer significant discounts to non-profit or educational institutions, hence the reason these markets were traditionally served by Electro Controls rather than Kliegl or Strand-Century.

It's usually written that "contractor to remove and dispose of existing dimming system prior to installation of new one." So most contractors end up with something they have no idea the worth/value of, and thus is sold for scrap, I'm guessing. Here's another way where making friends with your friendly local dealer can pay off. If they've sold a new dimming system to Theatre A, and they know you are looking for a system, they can tip you off, and possibly make some money helping with the re-installation. Or a liquidator can post the system on an auction site, where it will sit, becoming less wanted with each passing year.

On the other hand, when I posted an item as "free to good home, you pay shipping" on CB Classifieds, the item was spoken for within 20 minutes, and I had two subsequent inquiries. So watch that space. (But note that begging, or asking for donations, is against the rules.)

 

[mstaylor]

TTI are a good analog dimmer that many of the older guys have used many times. Most were 1.2 and 2.4K dimmers. They used a Sinse-Jones(sp) plug for control that could be twofered to double your dimmer size. The plug is a ten pin connector that only used seven of the pins.

 

[Les]

They used a Cinch-Jones plug for control that could be twofered to double your dimmer size. The plug is a ten pin connector that only used seven of the pins.

Corrected that spelling for ya


Something tells me that anything you get for free (or close to it) will be at least as bad (if not worse) than what they already have. Keep in mind also, that such purchases, donations and subsequent installations may be subject to approval by the theatre's board of directors, municipal arts council, etc (if applicable). They may be restricted from applying used equipment to a permanent installation, and anything new is going to cost a boat-load of money.

Can you give us details as to why you feel like the theatre's current dimmers are substandard? Are they dangerous or unreliable/non-functioning, or is it just because they're old? Do they simply need more dimmers? I understand you need a closer look. Let us know!

In the mean time, you might encourage the theatre to start writing grants for upgrades. Grants are a community theatre's best friend.

 

[Footer]

I ended up giving away those TTI dimmer on Twitter in June. So, follow me on twitter... you might get free crap. They are now happy in Vermont at the Weston Playhouse (They like good cheese in case you are wondering).

I work for a non-profit community theatre. I gave those dimmers to a professional equity theatre. I got rid of them because I did not have the power to run them, not because they did not work.

As far as discounts ETC, Strand, and every other theatre manufacture make at least half if not more more of their income off of community theatres and schools. For every legitimate professional theatre out there, there are 20 community arts centers and school auditoriums. They don't give discounts to the little guys because they would go broke. No one in this industry has money to burn. Outside of Broadway, very few theatres are for profit. Even the largest regional houses, such as the Guthrie, are non-profit.

Community theatre/non profits are all about keeping the gear you have running. Its also about letting people know whats broken. Odds are your theatre has a board. To get on the board, you have to give money. Many board members will fund projects if they see/know the need. So far, I have gotten a new sound system and a scaffold out of just presenting the need for it. I am looking at doing a serious lighting upgrade in the coming year. I don't have the money to do it right now, but I am trying to find it. Through donors, matching funds, etc I hope to scrap together 10-15k.

You also have to maintain the gear you have now. I have 48 EDI dimmers. The theatre has owned them for 20 years. I recently replaced 7 power cubes in them so they all work. I spent 400 dollars on that, but now I have the whole rack again. The theatre bought a 24 dimmer sensor rack a few years ago. Its still running flawlessly. I don't believe in buying junk gear when I have money. When I have money, I repair whats broken that can be repaired and replace the gear that can't be fixed with top of the line stuff. When you have money, spend it like it has to last for 20 years. My new sound system is a yamaha digital board, EAW speakers, crown amps, everything fairly top of the line. I want to replace some 30 year old altman 360 fixtures with Source 4's. There is no point in not going Source Four. I know they will last and will be around for a long time.

So, pick up gear when you can. Keep the gear you have running. If you need money, ask for it. Write up proposals with exactly what you need and why. If you do get money to buy gear, don't buy crap.

 

[David Ashton]

There are many advantages to using old dimmers, the main one is that they used discreet components, which are, and will continue to be available, unlike the programmed chips in modern dimmers, so they will always be repairable, easily.I maintain many 40 year old Strand dimmers, which tend to have a failure rate of around 2-3% per annum, and these have outlived 2 generations of modern dmx dimmers, of course they take up more space but are often free or very low cost, as people "update".
Modern dimmers have 40 menu functions, none of which I have ever seen used in any school, church, or amdram environement.

 

[avkid]

I now have 5 of those dimmers available for sale or parts.
Alternatively I can clean and refurbish any you already have.
There are also spare Heinemann breakers somewhere in my work shop.

If the theatre is near Boston I probably know what production company they came from.

 

[Edrick]

I believe that's them but I'll do a double check next time I'm there. As to the reasoning behind my question it was just an idea that I had in general. I wasn't sure how reliable / safe these older systems are.

 

[avkid]

Calling them bulletproof would be an understatement.

 

[meatpopsicle]

Calling them bulletproof would be an understatement.

Ill pass that on to my father, who co-founded TTI and was the co-designer of the dimmer! He will be pleased. thanks.

 

[DragonHeart]

Hi, I am the A/V tech at my local church and they want to do a production in a couple of months. They have a lighting system that looks like the pics in this thread. TTI? It looks like maybe a couple of the modules have gone bad. If I want to replace them, where would I look and how much are they? I think someone here mentioned they had 5?

 

[derekleffew]

... TTI? It looks like maybe a couple of the modules have gone bad. If I want to replace them, where would I look and how much are they? ...

TTI modules are usually easily and relatively inexpensively repaired. Lite-Trol Service, Inc. or any of the vendors listed at Service and Repair Vendors - ControlBooth .

 

[mstaylor]

The bad dimmers, what are they doing or not doing? There are a few things that can be fixed without replacing.

 

[JChenault]

Odds are your theatre has a board. To get on the board, you have to give money. Many board members will fund projects if they see/know the need. So far, I have gotten a new sound system and a scaffold out of just presenting the need for it.

A minor quibble. My experience is that getting on the board of an arts org is more about willingness to work for the institution. This may be by giving money, or calling potential donors, or serving on committies. I am on the board of a mid size community theatre ( annual budget about 1.2 M) and we have some members who give large amounts of money, and others who give large amounts of expertise or time.

Don't assume that just because you can't make a substantial cash contribution you should not consider getting on the board and help guide the organization.