Power distribution howto

It's quite interesting looking at the old posts. Course then again this is the only forum I know of that prohibits rigging and electrical advice. Or, enforces it-- don't spend enough time there to know if it's in the rules or not, just that people talk about it.
 
The TOS was implemented several years ago (exactly when, I don't remember). This is a VERY old discussion, and it does currently violate our TOS.

Even back then, one of the mods posted a warning:
wolf825 said:
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ATTENTION STUDENTS
NEVER TRY TYING IN POWER EVER--it is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS and should be LEFT TO EXPERIENCED PROFESSIONALS AND TRAINED ELECTRICIANS! NEVER EVER CONSIDER TYING INTO A LIVE PANEL EVER!!!! The information provided here is for INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY and is NOT a TURTORIAL or LESSON on HOW to tie in high voltage power!!! There is WAAAY Much more to consider and KNOW before tieing in power--and that is NOT covered here. Leave it to the Professionals, PLEASE. Its YOUR LIFE.
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The site was still young and we were still feeling our way into how CB fit in the online community.
 
Re: Power distribution how to

ship;2059 On school tie ins said:
safety[/autolink] hole in the pit. What is getting electrocuted any less dangerous than throwing a live hand grenade? Refuse but do it diplomatically is the wisest course of action. Someone tells me to tie in, I still ask permission from the house electrician, and only than if the most qualified, and the person properly trained for it do I attempt it given it’s within my honest ability. Sidestep any part of this and you, your company could kill someone including you, if not do other things bad. You are wise.

Gloves if “Hot Gloves” are smart, A hot mat is also wise, proper tools etc. but without the proper supervision and training that’s all Nintendo over Artari game systems. Safety is what you are being supervised and trained in. Good for them if they have all that and proper instruction. Go for it while supervised and trained in it. If you do not feel comfortable, talk and train with the instructor than if better try again. It’s good training if kept within perspective - but only something to do once honestly ready for it.

Since this thread is alive and kicking, my final comments. 2010 and in the film world, independent and non-union, we're still doing the occasional tie-in. It has nothing to do receiving a grade, but it does factor into making a living. Often it is the deciding factor between being hired or not. The more of them you do, the more adept you get at it. I've always used a rubber mat, but have never bought H.V gloves. Actually in this application, its considered "low tension", under 600 volts. It's not the $75, it's because they give can you a false sense of protection (told to me by many industrial electricians) and unless tested every 6 months, as mandated by OSHA, they're unreliable. I don't have an employer who is going to test and replace them at their expense. Although leather is skin and skin will conduct a current, a clean pair of leather gloves over a double layer of nitrile disposables has provided my secondary layer of protection for a number of years.
 
Re: Power distribution how to

Although I have been doing tie-ins for years, I would never walk into someone else's venue and tap power without them telling me it was OK. I certainly wouldn't appreciate someone doing it in my building and I differ to the house electrician in other's houses. I work in a few places that just tell me to do my own taps. You don't need to be an electrician to do it but you certainly need training.
 
When I was in school many years ago my electrical teacher taught me a few wise words:

"Always respect and fear what electricity can do to you if you screw up. There might not be a second chance to get it right."

In the two years I was in his class I was never shocked once, and never in 15 years since then doing hundred of tie-ins have I ever been bitten, because I am slow, careful, and always fear what will happen if I don't pay attention to what I am doing.

The bottom line is that you should never even get near an open panel unless you're certain of what you're doing and have the proper respect for what can go wrong if you misjudge your abilities and touch the wrong thing. Hell if not for your own safety than for the safety of others that will come into contact with what you just put power to.
 
Okay everyone is discussing how careful, ect. to be when tying in live, how about avoid tying in live if at all possible. Frankly I don't see why ANY panel (except for something such as in a hospital or other 24/7/365 type situation) would be tied in live. Seriously there should be a breaker next to the panel... if not the venue should have a licensed electrician install one. It's a lot cheaper than someone being killed or disfigured!

Now I'll admit I've got no problem bench work live when necessary, or metering, ect given an appropriate situation to do so... but that's a whole different ball game from tying in a 400A panel.
 
Okay everyone is discussing how careful, ect. to be when tying in live, how about avoid tying in live if at all possible. Frankly I don't see why ANY panel (except for something such as in a hospital or other 24/7/365 type situation) would be tied in live. Seriously there should be a breaker next to the panel... if not the venue should have a licensed electrician install one. It's a lot cheaper than someone being killed or disfigured!

Now I'll admit I've got no problem bench work live when necessary, or metering, ect given an appropriate situation to do so... but that's a whole different ball game from tying in a 400A panel.

Often it's not practical to kill the power to the entire building which also happens to be the site of a temporary event where it's also not practical to put in a permanent sub-panel for that one job.

Sometimes you've got to do what you've got to do. And those are the times when you get someone who knows what they're doing and what not to touch.
 
True-- in a venue that doesn't regularly have events it may now be practical to have a sub-panel. However as far as I'm concerned anywhere regularly hosting events which require a power distro/ tie-in should have a breaker/sub-panel.

I know many techs that are perfectly happy to tie-in live, cams/ bare wire/ whatever and I know techs that wouldn't go near dead cams. However most of the good, responsible techs I know will do the tie in if necessary (some only if cams), and will do it live if there is no practical way to kill power and they are the most qualified person onsite (many only for cams).
 
Often it's not practical to kill the power to the entire building which also happens to be the site of a temporary event where it's also not practical to put in a permanent sub-panel for that one job.

The engineer in me suggests that these are often places without enough capacity to handle a tie in either...

You may also wish to check what your insurer says about working live...

I'd also consider anything that involves opening of a switchboard to be something that is "real" electrical work and thus requires the services of a competent and licenced electrician.
 
I know many techs that are perfectly happy to tie-in live, cams/ bare wire/ whatever and I know techs that wouldn't go near dead cams. However most of the good, responsible techs I know will do the tie in if necessary (some only if cams), and will do it live if there is no practical way to kill power and they are the most qualified person onsite (many only for cams).

While I am willing to do live tie ins, I don't like to and I will not touch a live panel without the proper PPE.
 
Chris and Cdub, am I safe to assume you guys are talking about bare wire or lugs or something similar, not cams? Btw my only experience is with cams in dedicated performance spaces.
 
Chris and Cdub, am I safe to assume you guys are talking about bare wire or lugs or something similar, not cams? Btw my only experience is with cams in dedicated performance spaces.

You're on the right track here. What I'm referring to would be something on the lines of tying 4/0 cam tails into an electrical panel where for one reason or another it is either impossible or impractical to shut down the feed to that panel. Given my preference, I would not tie in to one of these, however sometimes there is no other viable choice. Fortunately, I have not had to do a live tie-in for several years.
 
I would still contend that doing any work that involved connecting an uninsulated conductor, dead or otherwise, is the domain of a licenced electrical contractor.

Basically:
If you have to open the distribution board to do it, it's an electrician's job. Period.
If you are connecting to a supplied interconnect facility, ie. installed sockets - Powerlock style or otherwise and are competent to do so, that's something that can be done by non licenced personnel.

If in doubt, contact your insurers.:mrgreen:
 

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