SM or LD's decision /

[SteveB]

I've had this issue before;

I'm the Lighting Director at our facility. I design the lighting for events that don't have one and play head electrician all the time. I run the console usually and especially for one-off's that I'm scheduled for, or have (assistant) console operators.

We also have a house SM, with similar type functions, calls cues and moves for shows that are one-off's, or no SM, acts as crew chief (at all times) and house liaison for events that have an actual SM.

In one situation needing clarifying, our Managing Director goes out to say Hi to the audience at top of show, says don't take flash photo's, etc.... and recently does a little thing where he tugs a 20ft. paper "chain" representing fund raising goals out onto the apron. He told our SM he doesn't want a follow spot to P/U until he's ready to actually begin talking, so instead we throw on some overhead N/C wash at 50% (SM's request and solution) to get a view that he's out there.

Today, the MD didn't actually walk under the N/C so I called the follow spot on to pick him up as it looked awful without it.

The SM wants to ream me a new one as she say's it's her call and that that's what the MD wants.

My opinion is I'm the designer and it looks bad and it's my job to make it look right, in my role as designer. At no time have I had an opportunity to explain to the MD that he looks lost and needs the spot to focus the audiences attention to him so they can see what he's doing as he drags this chain out on the apron. The overhead N/C doesn't do it.

This is not the first time this bit of conflict with the SM (or someone in a similar role) and my console op's have similar issues with the SM over a bit of micro-managing when they are told to do something they don't agree with, as they attempt to play LD on similar one-off type events.

Not sure where I stand here, so any advise is helpful

 

[productionmanagerleah]

Are you in a position where you can meet with the MD and advise him of your opinion of how it looks as the LD? That is what I would suggest to do. I wouldn't go behind the SM's back to do it, I'd inlude the SM in the conversation so there is no misunderstanding.

It's a fine line you walk with the SM in a situation like this so I'd always confront the issue and get it solved.

As far as if the SM is right in that it is their call or not, I think that depends on the 'rules' of the house and how your MD has things laid out. If the MD relies on the SM solely to carry out his 'command', then I'd think it is their call and your solution would be to bring up the issue after the show and not take action on your own.

In our house, our MD relies on both myself (PM) and our LD and he goes to both of us with his notes and we confer with each other and him if something doesn't feel or look right. But if our LD decides to change something on his own for a look, then its on him and he's accountable if the MD doesn't like it. And I understand that and therefore have no problem or issue if he changes something without my 'permission'.

Hope this helped.

 

[venuetech]

I often am in a similar situation. usually playing the role of desk operator to the stage managers calls during one offs. but when i see something i don't like i make the necessary changes calling them as i make them. If the SM has a problem with that I say it was the Lighting Designers decision. That puts a different perspective on the matter and she rides with it.

 

[Footer]

Its the house LD's job to light the stage. Especially for one offs when anything can happen, its should be on the house LD. The only thing the PSM should call is houselight cues and any show specific cues that have been laid out before.

 

[Drmafreek]

I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer here. Though, I would suggest more communication between all parties. Theatre is such a collaborative environment, and to be honest, this is something that the Designers, Managing Director and Stage Manager should hash out prior to it actually happening.

Now, in my theatre, the designer is never running the board, and in that situation, the board op should be going off of the SM's calls. On the other hand, if the designer is running the board, then there really is no need for the SM to call cues for the designer. So I guess, what I'm really saying is that there are multiple ways to handle the situation, but in the long run, communication between all parties will avoid these types of situations.

 

[SteveB]

"Are you in a position where you can meet with the MD and advise him of your opinion of how it looks as the LD? That is what I would suggest to do. I wouldn't go behind the SM's back to do it, I'd inlude the SM in the conversation so there is no misunderstanding."

Not this week for the MD and I'm certain I'm due for a conversation first thing in the AM, so it'll get discussed for sure, but maybe not resolved.

"As far as if the SM is right in that it is their call or not, I think that depends on the 'rules' of the house and how your MD has things laid out. If the MD relies on the SM solely to carry out his 'command', then I'd think it is their call and your solution would be to bring up the issue after the show and not take action on your own."

Ain't no "rules", ain't no notes and as drama freak helpfully added, there's no "Cues" and beceause of the time frame, no "collaborative environment". It's live, it's NOW.

The SM - IMO, sometimes seemingly forgets that the console operator is also the designer. Most time the SM has little to say or no need for input to what the LD does. Sometimes the SM is telling the LD/operator that an artist is absolutely wanting something, and I (as LD) am of the opinion that it is going to look like crap, but to make the SM's job easier, I do not argue and I do what they want. In this instance I over-rode the SM call and had the spot op. do a P/U. Now the SM's pissed 'cause I went against what the SM discussed with the managing director (but not with me). Rant over.

This has occured before. Many years ago when I was using carbon arc follow spots, I had a show with one-act comedians, one after another. One was a real old timer, semi-blind and OLD. I had a conversation with him prior to show about lighting as he had requested ONLY a follow spot, no other lighting. I mentioned to him and got him to understand that a "little lighting" on the stage would allow him to see where he was walking, to which he agreed.

Prior to his segment, my spot op. tells me the machine is getting flaky and might go out at any moment.

As old timer is about to go on the SM (a different SM at the time) tells me to kill ALL stage lighting. I inform the SM about the flaky spot light issue and that I had discussed with the artist that there would be a bit of light on for his benefit and that he had agreed. The SM essentially told me to do what he told me to do and I in return told him I was the LD and to piss up a rope. The SM would not send the artist on until I killed all stage lighting, which I did, informing the SM it was his call and problem. In my mind, the SM made no effort to remind the artist about my discussion and made a bad call. Had the spot failed, I'm the one looking stupid with no light on-stage. I was royally pissed and blew a gasket and never had another problem, like this.

Rant over.

 

[shiben]

Been in this situation several times. In my view, its the Lighting Designer's job to decide how the stage gets lit, if it was the Stage Managers we would call them the Lighting and Stage manager or something to that effect. Worst thats happened to me is the SM refused to write any cues in the prompt book without first asking the director about every single one. So our dinner to get cues into his book turned into dinner, period. However, it was fun when the director said something to the effect of I have no idea, ask the lighting designer, isnt that what tech is for. Hooray for inexperienced SMs. Anyhow, I would say call the change, tell the SM to shove it, and explain to the managing director why you made the call when you see him next. If you let him know he looks dumb without a spot, in my experience they usually allow you to make whatever call you want. As for the SM, I feel if the LD is running the board, they can change the cue if they so desire, its their job as an LD to make the cues in the first place, and the SM's job to make sure the vision of the Director, LD and other designers is effectively carried out on stage. Just how I was taught, tho.

 

[SteveB]

A thanks for the advice and confirmation of the true roles of LD vs. SM.

I will be having a conversation with the Managing Director this week to let him know of the desire to change the spot P/U. I'm certain he'll agree and I'll then inform the SM of the change.

Thank's again

SB

 

[TimmyP1955]

If the SM is calling the lighting cues, the SM is the boss. UNLESS: If someone who needs to be illuminated is off his mark such as he's in the dark, and the SM does not call an alternate cue to correct the situation, it is the light op's duty to take over for that moment and make it right (to compensate for the failures of both the talent and the SM).

 

[shiben]

If the SM is calling the lighting cues, the SM is the boss. UNLESS: If someone who needs to be illuminated is off his mark such as he's in the dark, and the SM does not call an alternate cue to correct the situation, it is the light op's duty to take over for that moment and make it right (to compensate for the failures of both the talent and the SM).

Slightly different situation than a standard board op/SM deal. The Lighting Designer is also running the board in the OP's situation. In that situation, the LD would have the call on if the light (they being the ones that designed it) needed to be edited.

 

[DuckJordan]

If the SM is calling the lighting cues, the SM is the boss. UNLESS: If someone who needs to be illuminated is off his mark such as he's in the dark, and the SM does not call an alternate cue to correct the situation, it is the light op's duty to take over for that moment and make it right (to compensate for the failures of both the talent and the SM).

As shiben said, its a very diffrent story with a LD and SM rather than board op and SM because its the LD's job specificly to design the lighting he is more on the scale of director than SM, if there was a job tier it would go

Director

Tech Director/Lighting Designer/Sound Designer/Choreographer/any other designer

Stage Manager/House Manager

Assistant Stage Manger

Stage Hands/Board Ops/Actors

 

[Syphilis]

I concur with the general feeling that in situations pertaining to the design of the lights in which jurisdiction is unclear, it is the light designer's call. Between the LD, who is entrusted with the quality of the lighting, and the SM, who is entrusted with organization, the LD should make the call because he/she is better trained in the area, and because it is officially his/her area of expertise as recognized by the MD.

However, the MD is in charge of everything, and it seems to me as if he specifically asked not to be spotlit until he was done with his silly fundraising thing. The SM wasn't making a call, but rather trying to enforce an order from a higher authority.

So there's my two cents.