Thank you to everyone for you help. I think i have found the solution to the snow. The company i work for already has snow machines, they are homemade out of the blue 5 gal water cooler tanks, with a auger on a motor down the middle to cause the snow to fall. But since I'm new i needed to find a place to get snow for them. They don't use any of the chemicals, so there is no worries of falling.
Snow?
- Thread starterjwl868
- Start date
We actually did this at my theater once. It was during the middle of a scene, and the stage screw cleaned it up for the next scene in about 2 minutes, and we were set again. I should be at my theater tomorrow, I will take pictures.
We have snow machines that use a special fluid that is filtered thought a fine netting material. It falls like real snow, and then after about a minute it evaporates. I use the "DRY" mixture, it doesnt clump up on the floor into a foam mess, and it evaporates quickly. My machines are the Little Blizzard (quiet version, with the DMX interface). They are actually much quieter than the normal snow machine. They are not very expensive to rent, i know there are quite a few companies here in houston besides me who have them, but i think i am the only one with the DMX version which makes running from a console much easier than messing with relay packs, or running control cable down to where the stage manager can push a button. Also the flake size, and output can be controlled. It takes a little playing with to get it right, but not much (maybe 5-10 min)
Making its debut at LDI'08, the City Theatrical DMX Snow Machine™.
DMX Snow Machine™
We built these machines for the new Broadway production of "Billy Eliot." This 4' long rotating drum has smooth and quiet DMX control for a wide range of speeds to produce a variety of snow effects on your productions. Have a Nutcracker or Christmas Carol coming up? This machine is for you!
Watch City Theatrical's site for more information.
DMX Snow Machine™
We built these machines for the new Broadway production of "Billy Eliot." This 4' long rotating drum has smooth and quiet DMX control for a wide range of speeds to produce a variety of snow effects on your productions. Have a Nutcracker or Christmas Carol coming up? This machine is for you!
Watch City Theatrical's site for more information.
porkchop
Well-Known Member
On a show I was just helping out on we used 4 Le Maitre Silent Storm snow machines, they are of the soap based variety. I know they are probably not the cheapest variety but they do make a very nice snow effect that we control completely from the board through 2 channels of DMX (fan speed and flow control). One pair is on alone for something like a minute and then we start blowing all 4 for like another minute and a half to two minutes. The four of them cover full ice (roughly 70' x 120') pretty well. There are plenty of jumps in the rest of the show and the soapy residue doesn't seem to bother the skaters much, but zamboni drivers and the guys that take care of the ice tend to not like the amount of soap that we put down on the ice (we also have bubble machines to add to this). Just some info for you. For the dancers I've worked with you would have to find a dry mixture, but the cleanup time makes me cringe when I think about it.
I use an extra dry formula, and we had it dropping down onto a dance floor and did not have any problems.
elite1trek
Active Member
Please tell me that took place upstage behind a curtain, I can't imagine a 2 minute scene change.........
See, and I thought that's what modern dance was for.
I’m tacking onto this thread because I’m trying to make it snow for Waltz of the Snowflakes in The Nutcracker, and I am struggling.
First my limitations: I am severely limited in what I can spend (the largest cost will be the snow itself). I only have one batten to work with, so I don’t think I can use a traditional snow cradle. Because of cost (and also because of limited access to the venue prior to the show), I can’t use a snow machine. All of this is volunteer/part time for me which limits when I can work on it.
Recognizing the limitations, I’m looking for a short duration and relatively short coverage/length. (The studio’s been doing Nutcracker for 20 or so years now, and the owner would like it to snow year….)
I’ve been through the suggestions on the this thread and an earlier thread, and I’ve been using materials that I have on hand to make a couple prototypes. Specifically, I used a 5-inch diameter x 4 feet long cardboard tube. (Heavy duty cardboard, like on a carpet roll.)
I first tried drilling a line of ¾-inch diameter holes down the length, I suspended this horizontally from the ceiling with the holes oriented upward (2 o’clock) and attached a cord to a point beneath the holes. I ran the cord up around the back side of the tube and over a pulley so that when the cord is pulled, the tube pivots and the holes face downward. I can “rock” the tube back and forth this way. (And when I stop pulling, the holes face up to stop any flow.) But when I tried it, the snow binded and clogged the holes.
The second version had a series of 2-inch x 2-inch slots down the length, at a spacing of ¾-inch side-to-side. I used the same hanging arrangement described above. This worked better, but I don’t seem to have a lot of control – its either all or nothing.
A couple issues:
1. I’m still waiting to receive some “theatrical snow” from Norcosto (as suggested in Derek’s post). But the snow I am using appears to be the same type of flake. I’ll know in a few days. Maybe that’s half the battle. (I came across another type of fake snow at a craft store that was more fibrous and doesn’t flow at all.)
2. Maybe I’m missing a concept: When I read the descriptions of the snow cradle, I imagined the snow “overflowing” the slots, such as like cereal being poured from a box. That is, tip the box forward, and the cereal flows over the lip of the box. However, with the snow, the snow clings to itself and as the tube is tipped, instead of the top particles rolling off, the large sheet of particles slides off. Should I try the series of holes (though larger diameter) and then inverting the holes to a bottom position and shaking/rocking the tube? I’ve also thought of placing a long dowel in the tube the would roll back and forth like a sifter to break up the mass of the snow.
Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.
Joe
First my limitations: I am severely limited in what I can spend (the largest cost will be the snow itself). I only have one batten to work with, so I don’t think I can use a traditional snow cradle. Because of cost (and also because of limited access to the venue prior to the show), I can’t use a snow machine. All of this is volunteer/part time for me which limits when I can work on it.
Recognizing the limitations, I’m looking for a short duration and relatively short coverage/length. (The studio’s been doing Nutcracker for 20 or so years now, and the owner would like it to snow year….)
I’ve been through the suggestions on the this thread and an earlier thread, and I’ve been using materials that I have on hand to make a couple prototypes. Specifically, I used a 5-inch diameter x 4 feet long cardboard tube. (Heavy duty cardboard, like on a carpet roll.)
I first tried drilling a line of ¾-inch diameter holes down the length, I suspended this horizontally from the ceiling with the holes oriented upward (2 o’clock) and attached a cord to a point beneath the holes. I ran the cord up around the back side of the tube and over a pulley so that when the cord is pulled, the tube pivots and the holes face downward. I can “rock” the tube back and forth this way. (And when I stop pulling, the holes face up to stop any flow.) But when I tried it, the snow binded and clogged the holes.
The second version had a series of 2-inch x 2-inch slots down the length, at a spacing of ¾-inch side-to-side. I used the same hanging arrangement described above. This worked better, but I don’t seem to have a lot of control – its either all or nothing.
A couple issues:
1. I’m still waiting to receive some “theatrical snow” from Norcosto (as suggested in Derek’s post). But the snow I am using appears to be the same type of flake. I’ll know in a few days. Maybe that’s half the battle. (I came across another type of fake snow at a craft store that was more fibrous and doesn’t flow at all.)
2. Maybe I’m missing a concept: When I read the descriptions of the snow cradle, I imagined the snow “overflowing” the slots, such as like cereal being poured from a box. That is, tip the box forward, and the cereal flows over the lip of the box. However, with the snow, the snow clings to itself and as the tube is tipped, instead of the top particles rolling off, the large sheet of particles slides off. Should I try the series of holes (though larger diameter) and then inverting the holes to a bottom position and shaking/rocking the tube? I’ve also thought of placing a long dowel in the tube the would roll back and forth like a sifter to break up the mass of the snow.
Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.
Joe
You can do a snow cradle that has holes cut in the top 1/3 of the moving
side of the cradle.
The other side of the cradle is tied to the 1 batten with ties like a drop.
The moving side has a piece of 1 inch thin wall conduit running through the hem pocket with 3/8 inch rope pickups every 10 feet with pullies.
The snow drops out of the holes. We actually cut 2 foot long by 6 inch
cut outs and sewed drop netting in.
We use paper snow, (Flame retardent treated by manufacturer).
Traditional Japanese theater (Kabuke) uses a lot of snow.
side of the cradle.
The other side of the cradle is tied to the 1 batten with ties like a drop.
The moving side has a piece of 1 inch thin wall conduit running through the hem pocket with 3/8 inch rope pickups every 10 feet with pullies.
The snow drops out of the holes. We actually cut 2 foot long by 6 inch
cut outs and sewed drop netting in.
We use paper snow, (Flame retardent treated by manufacturer).
Traditional Japanese theater (Kabuke) uses a lot of snow.
kiwitechgirl
Well-Known Member
A snow bag will work with only one batten - I did this a few years ago for a production of The Wizard of Oz. From memory we just used calico, got Wardrobe to sew a pocket in each side and ran conduit through the pockets. We cut holes in the pocket for pickups - so you could get to the conduit - and just used short chains and shackles to attach them to the batten - I can't go into any more detail than that due to CB's TOS about rigging! To operate the bag we just got the flyman to grab hold of the ends of the conduit and push and pull them in opposite directions and it worked like a charm - I think we had the slashes in the bag to about 2/3 of the way up it, and the whole thing was about a foot deep. In terms of the snow itself, I've had really good success with potato flakes - it falls beautifully and isn't too difficult to pick up although you do have to make sure you get it all cleared up before mopping the stage or else you end up with mashed potato!
We have a home made snow machine at my school. It required two battens. We took some fabric about 4 feet tall and the width of the stage and cut slits perpendicular to the battens and filled it with small 1cmx1cm square paper pieces. Attached one side to one batten and one side to the other then flew them up at the same time. When it's time to snow, we just raised one batten up and down and the slits allowed a steady stream of snow to fall and fan out across the stage. It worked really well.
masterelectrician2112
Active Member
mfhettig said:
So basically a homemade snow bag? Nice use of resources!
Re: Quiet snow machines?
Depending on how long the fall is you can use a blower motor many feet away from the drop and use either dryer vent tube or other 4" -6" tube/PVC pipe and blow the snow. Control the gall by having the blower on a dimmer to adjust output.
Old school is just to hand drop it if you can and there is a cat walk?
Also you can sound proof anything with current technology, foam sound deadening etc. Build a wooden box around what you have use 4" -6" styrofoam and or egg carton foam.
I boxed a VERY LOUD blower fan with this method and if you stood next to it you never heard it.
Depending on how long the fall is you can use a blower motor many feet away from the drop and use either dryer vent tube or other 4" -6" tube/PVC pipe and blow the snow. Control the gall by having the blower on a dimmer to adjust output.
Old school is just to hand drop it if you can and there is a cat walk?
Also you can sound proof anything with current technology, foam sound deadening etc. Build a wooden box around what you have use 4" -6" styrofoam and or egg carton foam.
I boxed a VERY LOUD blower fan with this method and if you stood next to it you never heard it.
MPowers
Well-Known Member
Re: Quiet snow machines?
Pardon if I'm a bit obtuse, but what kind of snow machines are you using now? A chemical machine that makes snow from a fluid, a rotating drum that drops plastic snow or....? Absolute quietest is a manual operated fabric snow cradle, next is a manual rotating drum/cage, next is a motor driven rotating drum/cage. Fluid based machines are the least quiet. I haven't used one in a couple of years so I'm not sure who is quietest in this category.
least expensive, manual cradles and drums, most expensive, fluid base blower machines. Fluid base snow, nothing to sweep up. plastic or paper snow, can be re used many times.
Is the snow on stage with dancers/actors, behind a window, downstage or upstage of all the talent?
What I'm trying to say is, what does the snow need to "DO" ??? Answer that question and maybe the snow you're using now is the best/worst for the situation. Quiet isn't always the best/worst answer.
Pardon if I'm a bit obtuse, but what kind of snow machines are you using now? A chemical machine that makes snow from a fluid, a rotating drum that drops plastic snow or....? Absolute quietest is a manual operated fabric snow cradle, next is a manual rotating drum/cage, next is a motor driven rotating drum/cage. Fluid based machines are the least quiet. I haven't used one in a couple of years so I'm not sure who is quietest in this category.
least expensive, manual cradles and drums, most expensive, fluid base blower machines. Fluid base snow, nothing to sweep up. plastic or paper snow, can be re used many times.
Is the snow on stage with dancers/actors, behind a window, downstage or upstage of all the talent?
What I'm trying to say is, what does the snow need to "DO" ??? Answer that question and maybe the snow you're using now is the best/worst for the situation. Quiet isn't always the best/worst answer.
garyvp
Active Member
Re: Quiet snow machines?
In our community theater I make snow drums made from 8" cardboard tubes used for concrete footings (Home Depot or Lowes) mounted on a light frame and powered by inexpensive 3 rpm mirror ball motors. They make no sound at all. I have used them with commercial plastic snow (recommended on CB) and for petals (Enchanted April). I April, the final monologue requires total quiet and it was fabulous. You can control flow by the size of the holes (3/4" for snow, 1.75" for petals) and speed. Fans are used for blizzard effects.
In our community theater I make snow drums made from 8" cardboard tubes used for concrete footings (Home Depot or Lowes) mounted on a light frame and powered by inexpensive 3 rpm mirror ball motors. They make no sound at all. I have used them with commercial plastic snow (recommended on CB) and for petals (Enchanted April). I April, the final monologue requires total quiet and it was fabulous. You can control flow by the size of the holes (3/4" for snow, 1.75" for petals) and speed. Fans are used for blizzard effects.
