The above Ad will no longer appear after you Sign Up for Free!

ultra pars, star pars Source four pars

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by legacy, Oct 15, 2006.

  1. legacy

    legacy Member

    Messages:
    68
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    south carolina
    I purchased 24 I think Ultra pars.. Knock offs of the ETC and parnels.. My problem is Gels do not last through a production and have to be changed out every night UGH............ have used a film that was suppose to hlep but didnt. I bought what BMI told me was high temp and it didn't work... Is it because its an off brand or does te ETC have the same problem.... Hope I get answers from those that are not ETC fanatics.. <g> lol

    Lee
     
  2. fosstech

    fosstech Active Member

    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Tacoma, WA USA
    I know our S4 Pars don't burn through gel at all. We even have a few up as worklights with long life HPL lamps in them, and they haven't burned through the gel that's on them once. I don't think they're even the MCM version.

    What wattage are you running them? What color(s) gel is it burning through?
     
  3. JSFox

    JSFox Active Member

    Messages:
    141
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    The Tundra
    I have a bunch of Starpars which are also semi knockoffs of the S4's. They do not have anywhere near the beam accuracy of the S4's (they are really a broad wash instrument regardless of lens) and do burn through gel a bit faster than the S4's, but we can usually get 2 - 3 shows out of them (Rosco or Lee) most times.

    I'm an S4 fanatic simply because their pars and leko's work better than anyone else's (except perhaps selecon).
     
  4. fosstech

    fosstech Active Member

    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Tacoma, WA USA
    ...at quite a premium over the S4. We have one Selecon in our inventory. It's a 90 degree fixture, and we use it as an infrared emitter so the SM's video camera can see in the dark. Just stick a red, green and blue gel on there all at the same time and you'll get no visible and all infrared. It's the only fixture that won't burn out that combo of gels ;)

    Anywaze, back to the topic...
     
  5. Pie4Weebl

    Pie4Weebl Well-Known Member Fight Leukemia

    Messages:
    2,440
    Likes Received:
    340
    Location:
    New York City
    Really? I thought the whole benifit of those fixtures was the infared mirror in it which filters out those frequencies?
     
  6. zac850

    zac850 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,299
    Likes Received:
    25
    Location:
    New York
    Yea, thats what I heard to. Has anyone checked to see if the SMs camera works even if the light is off?

    That being said, those cameras are usually fairly sensitive, so it may be that the selicon gives just enough IR light to work and still shunts most of the IR heat out the back....
     
  7. fosstech

    fosstech Active Member

    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Tacoma, WA USA
    Yeah, you have to remember though that something like 90% of the energy outputted from a halogen lamp is infrared. The remaining 10% is what you see. So what's left after the Selecon's mirror is enough for the camera, since it isn't 100% efficient. If it was, the light would have very little if any heat energy. Selecon's datasheets say the mirror is "over 80%" efficient. So when you do the math, 20% of the 90% of the total energy output is still more energy than what the unit puts out in visible light. So there's still a significant amount of infrared energy being emitted, just not nearly as much as something like a 360Q.

    And no, the camera doesn't work with it off in a blackout.
     
  8. Pie4Weebl

    Pie4Weebl Well-Known Member Fight Leukemia

    Messages:
    2,440
    Likes Received:
    340
    Location:
    New York City
    yeah I suppose that makes more sense now.

    Hmm that actually might be a usuful trick when video companies are filming and want front light brighter than I do...
     
  9. jonhirsh

    jonhirsh Active Member

    Messages:
    837
    Likes Received:
    15
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario and Valencia, California

    umm regular cameras do not use inferred. Only cameras that are designed to see in the dark do like security cameras. So your regular film or telivision camera still requires an large amount of light. But there still are ways to make allot of front light for camera look pretty in person. It just takes skill.


    JH
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2006
  10. Mayhem

    Mayhem Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

    Messages:
    1,790
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    Australia
    The camera issue aside, you may be a little confused as to the IR 'filter' in the reflector. My understanding is that this is to bleed away heat through the back of the reflector, which has obvious benefits. However, if you are trying to produce IR light via gels, how would the reflector prevent IR light from being produced?

    The reflector is designed to reduce the IR emission and reflect the visible light forward, through the optics of the unit. Therefore, whatever you place in front of the unit will not be affected by the reflectors ability to bleed off IR.
     
  11. Pie4Weebl

    Pie4Weebl Well-Known Member Fight Leukemia

    Messages:
    2,440
    Likes Received:
    340
    Location:
    New York City
    Wouldn't it effect it though, I mean if the IR mirror in the fixture cuts off everything (its not a 100% effective but for the sake of discussion) under a certain frequency and the gels cut out all the visible light, wouldn't no light get through IR or otherwise?
     
  12. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

    Messages:
    6,149
    Likes Received:
    424
    Location:
    Illinois
    Are your lenses in looking at them from the outside of the fixture pointing in a convex or concave direction? Is it possible that if convex - the heat absorbed by the lens is too close to the gel?

    Depends upon the saturation of the gel. Also possible that you have a bad lot number of gel. Perhaps some normal instead of high temp. gel (given it’s Lee gel - the only one I’m aware of as HT verses normal.)

    Check the bench focus of the fixture, perhaps the lamps are not fully seated or reflectors are also not properly in place.

    Is this a Ultra Par or a Uni-PAR?

    Uni-PAR is the plastic PAR fixture. If that's the one you have, this isn't a cheap clone, it's from what I read it's own design and should be decent quality. Thus a you get what you pay for or lesser quality lens and reflector/coating on it concept would not work.

    Craig off ProSound/light board play tested and bought some of these fixtures a few years back. If nothing else, if that's the fixture you have, you might drop him a PM or ask there on this instance given he and others have some.

    If Ultra-PAR, what brand of it is it and what type of lamp? ETC tends to sue any company attempting to use their HPL lamps in other than their own fixtures. If the Ultra-PAR uses a HPL lamp than it's design would be suspect due to using a lamp it should not be.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2006
  13. jonhirsh

    jonhirsh Active Member

    Messages:
    837
    Likes Received:
    15
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario and Valencia, California
    You can try using some Apollo heat sheild. Im sure Keith is around here some where and can explain this better. What you do is place the heat sheild before the regular gell putting them in two sperate gell slots. There needs to be air circulation between the sheild and the gel.

    If that fails use less saturated colours and try other brands. Apollo is great for standing up to the heat in my opinion. But try Lee, Gam, Rosco as well you might find a brand that works with your fixtures.

    JH
     
  14. soundlight

    soundlight Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,664
    Likes Received:
    329
    Location:
    PA & NJ
    Not to butt in, but I have a comment on the various types of pars. There are S4 Pars the theater venue and Star Pars in the music hall here. We have to leave the gel frames in the Star Pars because the lenses fall out sometimes. That's the main disadvantage to the Star Pars.
     
  15. Lightingguy32

    Lightingguy32 Active Member

    Messages:
    292
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    New York
    If you have that many of them, maybe Gel extenders with Heat shield may help. what kind of lamp are these Ultra PARS running on?
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice