Wall-box DMX dimmers?

Jay Ashworth

Jay Ashworth

Well-Known Member
My google-fu is failing me; the search space is too noisy...

I'm working on a project to redo lights and sound for small performance spaces in a historic restaurant building. The architectural dimming for these two rooms appears to entirely be a batch of 1K knob dimmers hanging out the front of separate 2-gang wallboxes, flush into what I'm going to speculate is a hard plaster wall.

Does anyone -- anyone at all -- manufacture a 600-1000w dimmer that will
  1. go in a 2-gang box
  2. not stick out too far (cause this is a working hallway, of course)
  3. have local control (though this I could live without), and
  4. have DMX in?
That last one's a particular bastard, cause I have 16 of these on one wall; full-size A5F's are going to be uncomfortable.

If I *had* to, I could put a NEMA1 box on the wall, and find a way to plate and fish all the wire, or box the whole thing, but that would be suboptimal.

At least all the lamping is still tungsten -- and if it goes to LED, we can get dimmables.

Suggestions? Pointers?
 
Not sure this helps but believe the ETC Echo line has single dimmers that can, for instance, be nippled off a junction box, say above a ACP ceiling or the box a fixture hangs from or atop a fixture enclosure; and then using echo or other DMX controls you'd have control. There is a lot I have not learned about the Echo line beyond it is extensive, has a lot of clever - UL listed - devices, and is pretty or very economical.

Try this: https://www.etcconnect.com/Products...ntrollers/Phase-Adaptive-Dimmer/Features.aspx
 
I understand - what I suggested would be remotely mounted, though extremely easily and economically. I'm sure there is a good reason why the dimmer has to be in the wall rather than at at the fixture.
 
BillConnerASTC said:
I understand - what I suggested would be remotely mounted, though extremely easily and economically. I'm sure there is a good reason why the dimmer has to be in the wall rather than at at the fixture.
Click to expand...

I'm replacing already-installed dimmers for architectural lighting in a historic building... and I'm trying not to trash it, nor drive the cost of this component up far enough to get it dropped from the proposal.

If I have to do lots of replaster work on a wall, or (worse) have an electrician fish a bunch of wire out of a wall of unknown construction, that might become the largest cost line in said proposal.
 
Well, you could look at Ketra. These are LED retrofit lamps that dim wirelessly. Just blank out or put a dmx controller in box and find a place to mount transmitter and connect to whatever the dmx controller is.

And look at X10 devices as well as maybe some competitors, like www.insteon.com. Pretty sure I've seen a dmx to x10 interface somewhere once upon a time. As best I can tell, these are not the most robust protocols, but they might work. Not sure if any zigbee products or other mesh network products could do it.

I think you have a basic issue in that you don't want to change wiring or boxes or conduit, yet you want dmx in same enclosure as the current power. Not sure how you overcome that basic concept of separating data from power without barriers and separate wire ways. But the wireless route might work.
 
Here is something else to consider when retrofitting an existing wall dimmer. Wall dimmers usually have 2 connections and are meant to be placed in locations where a switch would be installed. Usually there is no connection to neutral and the box may not have a neutral wire run through it. I would expect any dimmer with remote capability to require a neutral connection. I assume also you would be running the control wire along the exterior of the wall. This doesn't sound very attractive or durable.

I was wondering if there is any access to a space above the fixtures. If there is any room for a dimmer to be mounted in any kind of attic space then that might be a better solution. Otherwise, wireless could be a good option.
 
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I've been keeping my eye out for something like this for a long time, without ever finding it.

There are many remotely triggered dimmers in the Enocean, ZigBee, Insteon, X10 families that fit wallboxes. There are more remote dimmers (Echo and more) that can be paired with a DMX wallbox controller. I've used Interactive Technologies Scene Station for it's wireless DMX in a wallbox. You still have AC issues. One of those, depending on the actual issues, will likely be your best bet.

If you find something please post back here. This isn't the first time this has come up.
 
Rick and Mac are both referring to the idea of using a dimmer in a switch leg, and I'm not certain that that is actually approved by the NEC for commercial installations, which this is. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever seen a triac wall box dimmer installed on a switch leg, I thought they did require a neutral.

It's beginning to look a lot like I'm going to have to just back fish the wires out of those boxes and feed them into an email box with the dimmers mounted in it on that wall. What a shame. Maybe I'll gamble on the construction and get lucky. I will look into the zigbee and insteon stuff, though I don't think insteon has a dimmer that goes up that far in power.

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Someone's pointed out to me some Crestron 1-gang 750W's with built in buttons, but they appear to require me to get married to Crestron, and I have a fair idea how steep that hill is to climb. Still looking.

It's looking very much like it will entail lots of electricity and plaster work. Damn.
 
I got the Crestrons from a Home-Automation guy, who tells me there's a way to get from DMX to Crestron protocol, though it sounds overly complicated for what I want. If I gotta spend 2 or 3 grand anyway, I'll spend it on a damn electrician, not 2 layers of translation hardware. ;-)
 
The hqra-10D + hqra-10ND look like good candidates, but I don't seem to be able to find pricing on them.

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