Where to start to build a booth?

[MillburyAuditorium]

Hello everyone, let me begin with some personal stuff,

I am representing the Millbury Jr. Sr. HighSchool Auditorium, We just put on
two plays a year (looking to expand), about 12 concerts from our various bands, a few dance recitals and other places that want to use our facility's. We have a brand new lighting system, as fair as dimmers and wiring goes, not lights or controls. Because the maintenance people wired the switch to go from automatic houselights to DMX control, and it pretty much blue our system, so out light board had to be turned on 24/7 in order to be operable without doing a whole bunch of breaker stuff tog et it running. Our lightboard is pretty old, at least 14 years, we are looking for a new one. We rented one this year, forgot the name of it, had two monitors, was really nice. As far as our sound system goes, its prety poor, we only have two Bose outdoor/indoor speakers, orignally bought for the stadium, but while the auditorium was being built, the contractor stole the amazing 360 degree sound system that was purchased and fled, so sadly, we only have these two speakers, they do the job though, its a fairly small room, seating 300 comfortably, although we would like a new speaker set. The soundboard is good, same age as the lightboard, but in better condition, the lightbaord is dying, it cant save any pre-sets and what not. But the soundboard is running fun, so is our mixer, EQ and 8-Set wireless mic system. Our mic system includes 8 wireless clip-on mics, 7 hanging mics, and 4 floor mics.
So, as far as our contorl area goes, its just the back of the house, on a table. It loks pretty poor and we would like something safer, and nicer.

So, We are looking into buying a booth. I was wodnering were I could find one, what to search. And I was also wondering how much one would cost. Just a fairly small one, with big windows and side windows aswell since we are on guest level, infront of the doors. Preferably sliding windows aswell so we can hear. Just enough room for some desk space and the lighting controller and the board and the sound controller with the sound board, and mixer. (The "mixer" as we call it is a about 2 feet deep, 8 space case with a 4 space EQ and 4 space CD mixer.) The microphone receivers rest ontop of the mixer. Below is a link to a picture of pretty much the exact booth we are looking for, and the same basic auditorium setup, in the middle, in back of the audiance.

So if I could get someone to help me figure out were to look for one and the cost, that would be excellant!

Thank you!

 

[avkid]

I would think that your local commercial window and door store would be the best place to start.
Take in the picture and some measurements, as I highly doubt anything stock exists.

 

[FatherMurphy]

Booths are usually built as a regular room, not as a modular sectional preassembled sort of thing. So, the place to start would be with the Buildings and Grounds department of the school system, draw up a plan, check with building codes, take bids, etc., etc., etc....

Or, since you seem to be more interested in merely making things more secure and better looking, without taking up a lot of seats, you might look into a roll top desk arrangement. The tops are lockable, so that your equipment won't be stolen or messed with, and they're a lot smaller, simpler, and cheaper to get into use. One for sound and one for lights is an option, to give both areas plenty of space. Since you were talking of having large open windows, the noise of the crew talking softly back and forth didn't seem like a concern for you, so walls wouldn't be needed to separate the crew from the audience.

 

[Van]

I think that space looks kind of nice...
That aside, being part of a School you are going to be locked into a few processes that you simply cannot avoid. You are going to have to go through an architect to get the thing designed. A contractor will then bid on the project. Then the Arch's will run everything through the Engineers, Code approval and Permitting process and Yadda, Yadda. While it would be great if the kids, or faculty of a school could just get together and build a booth, now days it simply can't happen too many liability concerns.
Structural collapse, Fire Code infringment, Emergency egress etc etc all must be taking into consideration.

 

[Footer]

You might also want to reconsider putting in a fishbowl type of situation. You might want to have a more open air thing built that is lockable.

 

[jkowtko]

Your SM and light board operator may want an enclosed booth, but your spot operator may not, and your sound op definitely will want to be out in the open.

So if you are going to build a booth, make sure there is enough space on one side of it to place a sound table out in the open area of the theater. An 8-10 foot wide space should work for this.

As far as booth structure, as mentioned above if it's a permanent structure it will require building codes, etc. So you might consider a prefab portable structure that can be carried in and set up for shows, then stored in a closet when not needed. you could probably do this with 4x8 foot panels made out of 2x3 wood frame and some luan panelling. And if you end up leaving it there for good and not moving it, it's still not a permanent structure and therefore not subject to building codes ...

-- John

 

[DaveySimps]

I agree with the though that you may want an open air situation for your sound op, while your lighting and stage management staff may be better served with an enclosed area. Be sure to also consider the acoustical aspects of the booth on your venue. Adding a partial or full wall of windows will alter how sound travels through your space.

I also noticed this was your first post. Feel free to stop by the New Member Board and introduce yourself.

~Dave

 

[Footer]

it's still not a permanent structure and therefore not subject to building codes ...

-- John

Not totally on that one. You can get away with that onstage, but not in an audience area. Usually, putting up walls involves a permanent structure. Added to that, if you build something you are going to put FOH with "theatrical" carpentry, the fire marshal is going to flip a lid. The temporary structure thing is meant to provide for something that is not going to be up long and is not going to endanger anyones life. Its not meant to be used as a loophole as you are saying. Making a room that houses a lot of power and heat needs special needs. Fire sprinklers smoke/heat detectors, HVAC, and proper wiring all must be taken into account. A luan room is a fire trap.

 

[MillburyAuditorium]

Hi everyone, let me clear A few things up.

The sound board op. will have two monitors to mirror the sound outside, so no windows will be open, I have rethought that, so now the windows will not open, or if they can, they wont be often. Also, this would be a permanent structure, basically just adding a room to the auditorium. And it will not house much power at all. The dimmers and all power units, even the amps are located backstage behind a sound proofed wall. It will only contain the mixer, sound board, light board, about two lights, and possibly a computer. I really just want to know where to go to, do I ask the maintenance department to build it? Do I go to a contracter? Or do they sell kind of, "kits"?

And yes, the front wall, if not the parts where the operators are sitting if we cant do the whole thing, will have acoustic paneling.

 

[cprted]

The sound board op. will have two monitors to mirror the sound outside,

Thats all good and dandy for a studio situation or if you want to play tunes while programming cues. But you can't really mix a live show with studio mons.

I really just want to know where to go to, do I ask the maintenance department to build it? Do I go to a contracter? Or do they sell kind of, "kits"?

In a school situation, you can't just go get a contractor. Plans and budgets have to be created, approval sought by 14 different committees, establish a bidding process on the work, etc etc etc. What you need to do is sit down and talk about a concept with the person responsible for the facility (which I assume is not you), and start there.

 

[MillburyAuditorium]

Well, I pretty much run the auditorium, but there is no designated group who is in charge of it, I make the decisions to buy new things and what not, but this is different of course. So I will have a meeting with the school board/principal about it.

Thanks.

 

[NickJones]

A few things: Make sure it's big enough, a small booth is hell. Audio guys normaly prefer to be in the auditorium so they can hear what the audience hears, it might sound nice in the little monitors, but this may not be so. Your current booth looks fine, so long as the audio mixer is taken outside, leaving more room for the lighting guys. Make sure you include the ability to close the door while running lead, it's annoying having doors propped open so all the lead can fit in. Little tubes to feed lead through is so useful. You need lots of desk space in a booth.
Nick

 

[fredthe]

Your current booth looks fine

Nick, and others...
He doesn't have a current booth! The picture he posted (if you actually read his initial post) is what he'd like to do....

The sound board op. will have two monitors to mirror the sound outside, so no windows will be open

Monitors do not equal what the audience is hearing. They will only tell the sound guy what is comming through the microphones... the audience is also hearing the performers directly. Please keep the mixer in the open. A roll-top desk works very well for keeping things safe and secure, and some even provide space for your rack-mounted equipment and wireless receivers.

Could you provide some pictures of your space? In smaller theaters, it can be quite common for the lighting board to be in the open. However, many times it's put in a back corner, rather than in the center by the sound board.

It might be good if you can more specifically state what you are trying to achieve. You mentioned safety... is it a concern over cables run on the floor, or is there something else. Are you concerned about talking during the performance over the intercom? If you can get more specific, perhaps we can recommend better alternatives than a full construction project.

Lastly, it's still unclear (to me, at least,) what your affiliation with the school is. The typos and mispellings in your original post may have led some to believe that you are a student; if you're a teacher, administrator, or other support staff, please let us know.

-Fred

 

[rwhealey]

I strongly recommend putting a sound mix position in the house.

However, I think this might be a bigger project than you think. Is the school willing to renovate the whole auditorium?

"They" do not sell "kits". You will probably have to work with a contractor. Think about hiring a theater consultant.

 

[MillburyAuditorium]

Thank you Fred for clearing that up,

My affiliation is as you suspected a student, I am Going into my Senior year, I have been running the lighting and sound in the auditorium since I was in 7th Grade, And now that I am graduating, I want something built as a gift from my class. Which my hope is building a booth, getting a intercom system and new light board.

Well, back to the topic,

I cant really get any pictures for a while ,it being summer, If I cannot get any while I am in programming the light board for the new year in two weeks, I will get some when school starts back up. Also, We have all the equipment locked up in the storage closest, so nothing is setup, for saftey, also, thats another reason we want a booth, so we dont need to lock up the lightboard when we leave, and pack everything up at the end of the year. And we simply just want one because it would be a great addition to the theatre.

As far as I can say in text for the room is that it holds about 450 people, and if you see the picture in my first post, that is actualy almsot exactly how our room is setup, big row in the middle, and two wings. Except now, there is a little cutout in the backrow of seats for a table, where we setup. What I want to do is take out the back row of seats, wont be a problem there since we dont allow people to sit in those seats anyways, and have the booth the whole back wall, (the middle of the back wall, in-between the doors that is), minusing about 5 feet on either side for standing room. And then have it go right up to the back of the first row of seat, if its enough, if not we will remove the second row, which also doesnt matter because noone can sit there either, have a platform to level it off (the room slopes down tot he stage because our seats are not teired) and make it a little higher than the ground. Then building an independant structure on said platform, not connected to the rest of the building. So no renovation to the room will need to be done, besides a few minor things, like removing two rows of seats, which they just screw into the floor, moving the fire alarm pull to the other side of the back wall because it would be blocked by the booth wall, and really thats all that needs to be done to the room itself, besides installing two outlets and installing two lights. Fire and Collapse codes I think are the only codes that would apply, collapse can be cleared by obviusly, building a sturdy structure, and fire code will be fire code, Which I dont see what could happen, if at all need be people can go through the boot to the other side, Because think about it, oyu need to be at the end of the row of seats to get to the doors on either side of the room, so even if there wasnt anything in the back, theres no reason for people to go to the other side in the event of a fire. Also electricle code with the lights and outlits, But if installed correctly that will be fine. So anyways, the booth would not be attached to the school at all, besides the floor. It will just be an enclosed space on a platform. It will even have its own ceiling as the one in the picture does, because the ceiling of the auditorium is pretty high.

Hope it cleared some things up.

 

[tjrobb]

Check out the Electric code, in the 400's. This may throw a wrench into things, as follows:
If you have an enclosed space, and have a need for power, you are going to need power taps (or surge suppressors). Problem is, if you need more outlets than you have, you're stuck. Article 400 says you can't run flexible cords under the following conditions: through a door, through a ceiling, or as a replacement for permanent wiring (with some exceptions that don't apply here). Also, running them across an aisleway is a MASSIVE trip hazard in a dark house. Lastly, there is a part of the code that says no to 'chaining' power taps one off the other (and let me tell you, finding a tap with a 15' cable can be tough).

What does this mean for you?
I hope you have a bunch of outlets on the back wall where you plan to build, otherwise the fire marshal is liable to get upset... and running new circuits is never cheap.

Also, the theatre I work at had to build a temporary space when our main one was flooded. Even then, the UNDERSIDE of ALL wooden platforms had to be rendered flame resistant / flame retardant. If this booth is 'permanent,' remember that the FR coating has to be re-applied periodically. Might mean you have to build with steel...
And no, collapse code is not "just that easy," ever had to design a moment-resisting frame on a sloping floor? Not to mention that all services (fire, water, elec.) have to be built to the code as well.

Lastly, DO NOT MOVE THE FIRE ALARM PULL WITHOUT CHECKING THE CODE. This is the fastest way to get a building shut down. Consult a pro.

Don't mean to rant, just giving you a warning from a guy that BUILT a temporary space (obviously not alone )
(Please note that I am assuming you are from the US)

 

[rwhealey]

Hmm. I still think you're looking in the wrong places.

Rather than thinking of "things", like a booth or, as in your other post, an intercom system, I think you should start thinking of the big picture: talking your school board into renovating your auditorium.

 

[MillburyAuditorium]

Hi rwhealey, I think a full renovation would be great, but not doable, We just had had to replace the the lighting system because it was blown, so that set us back $6000 dollars. We do need some renovations though. Well, not necessarily renovations, just new equipment. Like, our house is pretty nice if I do say so myself, thick cushion chairs and nice air conditioning and what not.

But we could use some new lights, and we are working on a surround sound system, but that is later in thee future.

 

[MillburyAuditorium]

Check out the Electric code, in the 400's. This may throw a wrench into things, as follows:
If you have an enclosed space, and have a need for power, you are going to need power taps (or surge suppressors). Problem is, if you need more outlets than you have, you're stuck. Article 400 says you can't run flexible cords under the following conditions: through a door, through a ceiling, or as a replacement for permanent wiring (with some exceptions that don't apply here). Also, running them across an aisle way is a MASSIVE trip hazard in a dark house. Lastly, there is a part of the code that says no to 'chaining' power taps one off the other (and let me tell you, finding a tap with a 15' cable can be tough).

What does this mean for you?
I hope you have a bunch of outlets on the back wall where you plan to build, otherwise the fire marshal is liable to get upset... and running new circuits is never cheap.

Also, the theater I work at had to build a temporary space when our main one was flooded. Even then, the UNDERSIDE of ALL wooden platforms had to be rendered flame resistant / flame retardant. If this booth is 'permanent,' remember that the FR coating has to be re-applied periodically. Might mean you have to build with steel...
And no, collapse code is not "just that easy," ever had to design a moment-resisting frame on a sloping floor? Not to mention that all services (fire, water, elec.) have to be built to the code as well.

Lastly, DO NOT MOVE THE FIRE ALARM PULL WITHOUT CHECKING THE CODE. This is the fastest way to get a building shut down. Consult a pro.

Don't mean to rant, just giving you a warning from a guy that BUILT a temporary space (obviously not alone )
(Please note that I am assuming you are from the US)

Yes we are in the US.

I was thinking moving the pull wouldn't go over good, but instead of moving it, putting it inside the booth, because usually, if there's a fire in there its more than likely one of the lights, so we might need one too. But now there isnt one for the audiance int he back, so maybe we would need to install two new pulls, I think those systems work like that, can have 1, or 100 kind of thing?

And for the power code,
We wouldnt need to run cables over guest places or walkways, and if we cant install an outlet in the booth, we can just get a extension cord running just outside the booth to an outlet on the backwall, theres about 4, and it will be taped straight down then udner the edge of the wall we have, its kind of odd, theres a kind of lip at the buttom of our wall in there, the wall is one long thing of wood, than black mesh stuff, then wood, then mesh, and so on. So it will be out of the wya and hardly noticable. But then the problem is, if that comes un-plugged, the whole booth gets shutdown. Would need to figure out a way keep the plug held in the socket. Probobly mount a sort of case around the outlet.

And thanks for about the platform. Suppose it iwll be worht it spending the money on a steel platform than.

 

[tjrobb]

You would need a pull beside the exit (I can only assume they had a reason to put it there), but fire alarm wiring normally needs the services of a pro with NICET certification. It it true, though, that having a second one in the booth shouldn't be an issue. Problem is, you can't store anything in front of it... or below it.
I feel you missed the part about "replacement for permanent wiring." If the cord is being used to supply power to a room so frequently that it needs to be kept from being unplugged then it falls into that category (the exception is for items like sump pumps that have to be unplugged & moved for maintenance). My suggestion is to look into having a spark come in to run some surface raceway along the wall. It's the cheapest way to add a few extra outlets, and might be able to be fed from your existing outlet.
I missed something earlier. If your theatre isn't too old, it likely has a sprinkler system. If you have a ceiling in the new booth, it's going to need to have sprinklers inside. This, again, needs a pro (for the water calculations, etc.)... and is a pain.
If you can work with it, an open "bar counter" style booth might be the best route at this point. It has the convenience of lockable storage (roll tops anyone?) while avoiding a few of the problems of an enclosed space. Plus, you can move the sound guru in there as well.