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Yoke Clutches

Discussion in 'Lighting and Electrics' started by Les, Jun 20, 2007.

  1. Les

    Les Well-Known Member

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    Is there an up-to-date clutch type yoke lock (wow, complicated part description) for the older version of 360Q leko with the interlocking teeth? I was going to switch out some bell housings with them already attached from fixtures missing lenses but danged if altman didn't change their design about 1/8" so they wouldn't fit. grrr.
     
  2. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Explain further about the change in dimension, never was aware of this before between the 360 and 360Q. Should be the exact same in all ways - I at least think I remember interchanging such things in the past. Could something be bent out of round?


    The old clutch's did break easily when not properly loosening the knobs first. This and the cast aluminum with square head set screw inside the aluminum casting on the knob was not all that unusual to break loose - those other than the 360 knobs at least. Kind of a frequent thing on Centuries. Not so unusual when working with Century and other fixtures to find out someone put a 5/16" square drive set screw into the yoke and called it a day. In reality, nope such people before you were not very confused, the aluminum casting about it in making a screw into a knob broke off and it's a case of simple people being too lazy to replace it.

    Can you change from tooth type clutch to clutch disc? Don't know, possibly but you would have to replace the yoke. Really hard to drill a steel yoke for a square hole to fit a carriage bolt. (Side note, Grade 5 carriage bolts / McMaster Carr are really useful over common Grade 2 versions.) After that, I'm sure as I call it the Pineapple frame could take mounting the clutch disc on it without a problem. Some study of a modern 360Q into how it's done would lead to easy solutions. Hate the pound type rivets but other than that it should be feasible once you replace the yoke.

    Than again, you can still get the tooth version of the yoke clutch - I know I at least have a whole box full of brand new ones. Teach and supervise the crew focusing the fixtures properly on how to use the fixtures and there should not be a problem. This at least I know I have never broken one and I'm sure you have not either. Just a question of finding the barbarians within the masses.

    Than again, Altman is notorous for screw holes lnot ining up by way difficulties in say swapping out lens barrels if not just sheet metal screw placement. Perhaps as a concept the casting of the fixture you have was also off a bit and unusual or a different lot. One would think an aluminum casting not off but it's feasible.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2007
  3. Les

    Les Well-Known Member

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    Hey Ship! Yeah, the lights I have are 4 6x9's which I picked up from a rental house that was liquidating their old stock. They're of the olive drab version. Some of the clutches are tight, then again some are not. I have some 6x12 housings around that are from a different era (black, with disc clutches, yet still with metal knobs). The first difference I noted was the hardware differences between fixtures. The older ones use a stud-type pin that is threaded on both ends with 2 of those rounded nuts (one on each side, also fitted with small washers sandwiched between the male pineapple part of the hinge and the shutter assembly female part). They fit fine within each other, except that the fixture cannot close this way. The only way the fixture will close is to undo the hinge and set the pineapple over the gate assembly. That is when the difference in dimensions is apparent - the hinge hole will not line up.
    By the way, these newer units use one rounded nut, with the hinge pin being an allen type bolt.
    I have only tried the swap on one unit and when this didn't work I gave up, but I might have another go at it using 2 other fixtures. I might try swapping out the hinge pins or eliminating the washers and seeing if that has effect. Maybe even make a bigger hole for the hinge pin... That very well may work!
    Heck I would just swap out the whole gate assembly except that I have 4 fixtures that need repair, 3 complete housings to scavenge from, and one pineapple without reflector or other hardware. If I had one other "age in question" 6x12 fixture to pull the parts from I would have it made, but I think that one was claimed by a school district long ago. I do know of a high school that has 6 others identical that are missing their lamp caps. I might see if they are willing to part with them as they received a Source Four upgrade recently.

    Wow... So many projects... And I still need to finish off those Kleigls from so long ago...

    Then its off to the powder coater.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2007
  4. ship

    ship Senior Team Emeritus Premium Member

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    Olive Drab would stand to reason it has the older tooth style clutch cam. In some clutches being tight and some not, believe that’s a rivet concept, should only take a hammer, drift pin and anvil to tighten them up, or re-riveting or bolting. Been a while since I tinkered with them but it’s possible to either pound something tight again or re-rivet. Do such things often with PAR cans.

    Sorry, memory in this assembly is not serving so well at the moment, I don’t have any Lekos in for upgrade to the theater in the garage at the moment and all manuals showing this parts assembly as with bone yard fixtures are at work and boxed up for a later day. Been a little while since I saw a loose tooth grip, my guess however given your description is that one side of the cast wings that is on the yoke and holds it to the yoke has broken off. Really common problem. Just need to replace that part - this the reason that 20 years after where I work stopped using that series of fixture, I still have that box of that part for replacement parts. Could very likely be that one or both of the wings on the yoke mounted part has in it’s ability to hold onto the yoke broken loose. This would explain the certain slippage and play in grabbing. That clutch cam grabs, it’s just that the yoke is no longer affixed to the clutch cam.

    Hinge holes, are you talking clutch cams or top and bottom of the pineapple hinges? Yep often fixture to fixture once one gets into swapping top and bottom sections of different lot numbers they don’t line up. Also if memory serves, that hinge is more an oval slot between a threaded rod and two acorn nuts. 6-32 by memory in size. If the nuts are too tight, it will pivot instead of do this and swivel while doing so. Makes for a hard fit as with in general the retaining thumb screw at times not lining up fixture to fixture.

    If you have to in this case remove the hinge pivot to align it in fitting, my first concept would be the hinge nuts too tight. After that, who knows, could be out of alignment by way of a warp or perhaps a lot number thing with the overall dia. not compensating for the pivot. Such a thing I would study for a while on my work table but after study by you or me would clearly show what’s going on with a little study. Should hopefully be a easy fix.

    Allen type bolts would be socket head round head or cap screws by definition in this area. That’s as far as I know a un-stock part and something the end user added. Should work fine as long as it is loose enough for the oval hole to function. Washers are also not standard, the stock acorn nut has a washer part to it’s top. Should the washer be too large, this could also prevent that play to the pivoting within the oval necessary to function. Possible that it’s the washers, try without as washers I have not seen before in this area.

    On so many projects, soo little time, welcome to my world. I’m on about at least a five year backlog at this point for many things but still intend to get to all. The above box of Altman’s is my carrot on a stick for the day I finally get caught up. Oh’ to just sit down an tinker with rusted solid and trashed 360Q’s... Not going to happen in the near future but it’s my goal and ain’t nobody going to touch my lights until I have a chance to tinker with making them right.

    Hopefully with time in taking out of service what is not factory spec. you will have time in keeping them as your carrot on the end of a stick, project to get to in working hard on often less interesting things. Until than, box them up and don’t let anyone touch them. A spraying of WD-40 all about them also helps while in save for a later day mode.

    On trip to the powder coater, not sure if I would do it beyond origional color concept. Often flaking and or surface rust develops under the heavy coat of paint. A trip to the sand blaster at least first might be necessary - this given a reproduction of the original paint color.

    Ah’ the joy in tinkering with fixtures and solving problems. Look at it this way, had our careers only been to do what we love, the world would be all easy - too easy thus boring. Instead, in addition to stuff we love, we get stupid stuff thrown in to mix it up. Thus the concept of my carrot on a stick. Gonna get to it... eventually, but until than it’s inspiration to get the day to day stuff done in some day realizing that concept.
     

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