MSR 700 vs MSR 700/2

Finally getting through a couple shelves of VL 2000s and wanting to buy some extra lamps.
I’ve never bought anything but the 700 which has the wire on the outside of the globe and there’s even a cutout on the reflector for that wire to fit in.

Does the 700/2 also work in this situation or are they designed differently?

Part of me assumes the 700/2 is a revision or improvement of the 700.

Adding some images for clarity.
The 700/2 is entirely encapusated in glass, the plain ol' 700 has the wire outside the glass.

Paging @DELO72, The CB Dalai Lama of Lamps.

Last known, all work fine though the list is out of date.
MSR 700 Philips #30267-9 (Disc.) HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G22/28x42 (CRI 95) 5,600°K 56,000 Lum 1,000
MSR 700 (3/03) Philips #928078005100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. (CRI 80) x0.325y0.32 5,900°K 55,000 Lum 1,000
HSR 700 Osram/Sylvania#54107 CL, SE. MH, SA HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 Any Burn Pos. (CRI >85) 5,600°K 10,000C / 58,000L 1,000
HSR 700/60 Osram
USR 700 Ushio #5000285 CL, SE, MH. 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 155mm G 22 5,600°K 56,000 Lum 1,000
USR-700-NHR Ushio
MSD 700 Philips #35364-9 CL, HP. SE. MH. HID., 700w/72v T-40mm 10 mm LCL 85.72mm G 22 75 CRI (Universal Burn Pos.) 207v Min. 5,900°K 55,000 Lum 2,000
MSD 700 (3/03) Philips #928170405100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-40mm 10mm LCL 85mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. Dimmible (CRI 75) x0.323y0.328 6,000°K 50,500 Lum 3,000
USD-700 Ushio #5002005 CL, SE. MH. HID (Philips Resale) 700w/72v T-40mm 10mm LCL 85.72mm G 22 75 CRI (Universal Burn Pos.) 207v Min. 6,000°K 55,000 Lum 3,000
ESR 700-SE-NHR Eiko
RSR 700w Radium #325 11090 (12/05) CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G-22 s180 Burn Pos. 5,600°K 58,000 Lum 1,000
BA 700 SE NHR Sylvania
MSR 700/2 Philips #28723-5 HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8 mm LCL 76.2mm G22/28x 42 80 CRI (380v Dim) Any Pos. 7,000°K 49,000 Lum 1,000
MSR 700/2 (3/03) Philips #928171505100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. (CRI 80) x0.302y0.32 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000
AMHK-700/2 AMGLO Kemlite Labs HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8 mm LCL 76.2mm G22/28x 42 80 CRI, Any Pos. (Sym to MSR700/2) 7,000°K 49,000 Lum 1,000
USR 700/2 Ushio #5002009 CL, SE. MH. HID 700w/72v T-28mm 8mm LCL 73mm G22/28x42 Any Burn Pos. 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000
CSR 700/2/SE GE #49491 (6/08) CL, SE. MH. HID 700w/70v T-9 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 Any Burn, x.302 y.320 (CRI +80) 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000

So was the 700/2 an actual improvement or just a variation designed for a different fixture?
There's no advantage for me to use one over the other?

Your fixture's spec sheet should list the approved lamps. Some ballasts may be unhappy with some models. Some lamps may operate at a different color temperature or luminance. Some may have a longer life. Some may operate at a temperature that stresses the fixture. Some may have interesting failure modes. @ship's list says there are many options for a VL 2000, so it comes down to what you already have in inventory or some other factor. FWIW, I usually use a Philips MSR 700/2 fast-fit variant but I don't have any VL 2000s or much choice in vendors.

Normally a /2 version will work fine with the fixture. Other brands match the spec when doing the lamp unless doing an improvement on color temperature or output. None the less, it's designed for the fixture or there more normally will have been a different description of the lamp.

I could only wish a XBO 3000w/HSLA.ofr from Martin Big-Lights, no longer in service, would work in Lycian 1293 XBO using a 3000w/HSXL.ofr. Xenon lamps are a little more picky than metal hallide lamps it would seem. Honestly the largest problem for me has been getting right lamp description, wrong lamp base in at one point Philips mis-listed the MSR 1200 FastFit verses the MSR 1200SA/SE - also a Fast Fit but PG-41 instead or PG-50 and I got stuck with a bunch of the wrong lamp.


For the 700w fast fit... it's spec's have changed over time/catalogues and am not aware or have not updated notes for other vendors of it.
MSR Gold 700 Fastfit Philips #15880-8 (2006) CL, HP. SE. MH. SA. HID Fast Fit 700w/207v ign T-25mm 4mm LCL 65mm PGJX-50 CRI >80, Any Burn, Dimmable, P-3 tech 7,500°K 50,000 Lum 750hr
MSR Gold 700 Fastfit Philips 928106005108 (6/08) CL, HP. SE. MH. SA. HID Fast Fit 700w/207v ign T-25mm 4mm LCL 65mm PGJX-50 Any Burn Pos. (CRI >80) 6,000°K 50,000 Lum 750hr
MSR Gold 700/2 Fastfit Philps 928106205108 (6/08) CL, HP. SE. MH. SA. HID Fast Fit 700w/207v ign T-25mm 4mm LCL 65mm PGJX-50 Any Burn Pos. (CRI >80) 7,500°K 50,000 Lum 750hr
MSR Gold 700/2 Fastfit (4/10) Philps #23748-7 CL, HP. SE. MH. SA. HID Fast Fit 700w T-25mm LCL 65mm PGJIX-50 Any Burn Pos. (CRI 75) 7,200°K 47,000 Lum 750hr

macsound said:

So was the 700/2 an actual improvement or just a variation designed for a different fixture?
There's no advantage for me to use one over the other?

Click to expand...

700/2 is a completely different lamp. USUALLY (and this changes) /2 means an "alternate color temperature." So if one lamp is a 1200W and the other is the same nomenclature but 1200W/2 it means that the first one might have been made at 6000 K, and the second one is a higher color temp of 7200 K for instance.

However- the two lamps you show are two completely different lamps, with completely different fixtures they were designed for and different uses. The MSR 700/2 is a 1000 hr., G22 base, 7200K, 80 CRI lamp. Likely for Club/disco lights. The outer jacket reduces the output a little, but helps the lamp to get a longer lifetime by preventing oxygen from attacking the welds points as quickly.


The single-envelope one is the MSR 700W/SA, which is a Short Arc (SA) lamp used in moving lights, and the lead wire fits into a cut-out in the reflector. It has higher output, a GY9.5 base, 750 hr. Avg. Lifetime, 5600K CCT, and 80 CRI. It was used in the PRG Best Boy, the VL2500, and many other popular moving lights.



TOTALLY different lamps built for Totally different fixtures. They are NOT interchangeable.

Please explain more. I get that the above first noting from the catalogue was wrong in color temp.- it changes in catalogues over specs. So color temp. is accurate in the second Euro version. 700 verses 700/2, and what info was complete to what catalogue presented in lacking lamp base info... Philips negleted to fill out the general specifications as to what lamp base it was taking?? Stuck with another type of useless Philips lamp.... Thanks Mark, what base is it taking in me also checking stock for the nine of each obsolete lamps in stock? Wow!

I do need to find time tomorrow to verify Mark's info on this lamp.

ship said:

I do need to find time tomorrow to verify Mark's info on this lamp.

Click to expand...

You're doubting Mark??? Say it isn't so!
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard

Sorry, forgot to open boxes. My impression, if similar wattage and voltage, similar lamp LCL (Lamp Center Length), other than fill pressure issues that's valid or not at times... One lamp will work with any similar lamp. Only in the past dozen years has say the MSR 1200 Fast fit for Varilite fixtures not played nice with other Osram options already stocked. Amongst a few other lamps where fill pressure is an issue.

Yes, Mark is wrong - but remember he works for Osram not Philips in attempting to help by way of info he knows about from the other brand and its arcane website. Also, the MSR 700 is a very old probably discontinued lamp - as similar to Osram HSR 700 which would not appear on any websites from either brand.... why because once a lamp type is discontinued, it's gone for info on them for some reason... Gone instead of a red translucent line thru it... "discontinued", but the info about the lamp still existing.

Mark on the other hand could explain the difference between the HSR 700 and BA 700 SE NHR from Sylvania without specs. for it I note existance of. They were the same company back than and might jog his mind about the MSR 700 which from what I can tell from notes was never a short arc lamp.

If you note a SA' as part of his Philips lamp code description code above.... that's not the MSR 700 asked about, and agreed a different lamp base and lamp.

Note slight specification differences in catalogue listings on this SA lamp. Every year I got a catalogue, I went thru it page by page, item by item and if there was a change, a new lamp or something not listed I added a new listing for it or a (disc.) to the former lamp no-longer listed. (Didn't think of adding a date until much later... in my catalogues go back to the 90's and much earlier for other types of lamp.) Also, some catalogues or websites offer more or different info than others , especially a Euro version of the catalogue. Euro catalogues have a longer part number in general especially from Philips.

MSR 700 SA Philips #28215-2 (Disc.) CL, HP. SE., Short Arc, HID, MH 700w 4mm LCL 39mm GY 9.5 (80 CRI) Any Pos. (Lead Down) 207v Min. Ign Volt 5,600°K 54,000 Lum 500hr
MSR 700 SA Philips #28718-5 CL, HP. SE, Short Arc, HID, MH 700w/72v 4mm LCL 38.89mm GY 9.5 (80 CRI) Any Pos. (Lead Down) 207v Min. Ign Volt 5,600°K 55,000 Lum 500hr
MSR 700SA (3/03) Philips #928170305100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID. SA 700w/207v 4mm LCL 39mm GY 9.5 (207v Ign) Any Pos. (CRI 80) x0.33y0.342 5,600°K 55,000 Lum 750hr
MSR 700SA (7/04) Philips #28718-5 CL, SE. HP. MH. HID. SA 700w/207v 4mm LCL 39mm GY 9.5 P-3 Technology, Any Burn (CRI 80) x.330 y3.42 5,600°K 55,000 Lum 750hr
MSR 700SA Philips 928170305100 (9/05) CL, SE. HP. MH. HID. SA 700w/207v 4mm LCL 39mm GY 9.5 (CRI 80) P-3 Gold, Any Pos., x.330/y.342 5,600°K 55,000 Lum 750hr
MSR 700 SA Philips #28718-5 (10/08) CL, HP. SE, Short Arc, HID, MH 700w/72v 4mm LCL 38.89mm GY 9.5 (80 CRI) Any Pos. (Lead Down) 207v Min. Ign Volt 5,600°K 55,000 Lum 500hr


The lamps in question:
MSR 700 Philips #30267-9 (Disc.) HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G22/28x42 (CRI 95) 5,600°K 56,000 Lum 1,000hr
MSR 700 (3/03) Philips #928078005100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. (CRI 80) x0.325y0.32 5,900°K 55,000 Lum 1,000hr
HSR 700 Osram/Sylvania#54107 CL, SE. MH, SA HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 Any Burn Pos. (CRI >85) 5,600°K 10,000C / 58,000L 1,000hr
HSR 700/60 Osram
USR 700 Ushio #5000285 CL, SE, MH. 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 155mm G 22 5,600°K 56,000 Lum 1,000hr
USR-700-NHR Ushio
MSD 700 Philips #35364-9 CL, HP. SE. MH. HID., 700w/72v T-40mm 10 mm LCL 85.72mm G 22 75 CRI (Universal Burn Pos.) 207v Min. 5,900°K 55,000 Lum 2,000hr
MSD 700 (3/03) Philips #928170405100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-40mm 10mm LCL 85mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. Dimmible (CRI 75) x0.323y0.328 6,000°K 50,500 Lum 3,000hr
USD-700 Ushio #5002005 CL, SE. MH. HID (Philips Resale) 700w/72v T-40mm 10mm LCL 85.72mm G 22 75 CRI (Universal Burn Pos.) 207v Min. 6,000°K 55,000 Lum 3,000hr
ESR 700-SE-NHR Eiko
RSR 700w Radium #325 11090 (12/05) CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G-22 s180 Burn Pos. 5,600°K 58,000 Lum 1,000hr
BA 700 SE NHR Sylvania
MSR 700/2 Philips #28723-5 HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8 mm LCL 76.2mm G22/28x 42 80 CRI (380v Dim) Any Pos. 7,000°K 49,000 Lum 1,000hr
MSR 700/2 (3/03) Philips #928171505100 CL. SE. HP. MH. HID 700w/207v T-30mm 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 (207v Ign) Any Pos. (CRI 80) x0.302y0.32 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000hr
AMHK-700/2 AMGLO Kemlite Labs HP. CL. SE., MH, C.R. HID 700w/72v T-30mm 8 mm LCL 76.2mm G22/28x 42 80 CRI, Any Pos. (Sym to MSR700/2) 7,000°K 49,000 Lum 1,000hr
USR 700/2 Ushio #5002009 CL, SE. MH. HID 700w/72v T-28mm 8mm LCL 73mm G22/28x42 Any Burn Pos. 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000hr
CSR 700/2/SE GE #49491 (6/08) CL, SE. MH. HID 700w/70v T-9 8mm LCL 75mm G 22 Any Burn, x.302 y.320 (CRI +80) 7,200°K 55,000 Lum 1,000hr

Still love and respect you Mark! One TD to another. And still wearing at times my try the HPR lamp trial swag shirt. Amongst other swag over the years. Osram was once the best for swag, harder to get swag from the other name brands years back when such swag was done, but I did acquire all main brands eventually at least for shirt. Amongst other things like hanging from my garage door.

I'm going to disagree with you Ship. I don't think I"m wrong.

macsound said:

Adding some images for clarity.
The 700/2 is entirely encapusated in glass, the plain ol' 700 has the wire outside the glass.
View attachment 22209View attachment 22210

Click to expand...

I'm going to have to disagree with you Ship. Based on the images above that the OP sent us, The lamp in question being asked about IS INDEED the MSR 700W/SA, and not the Old MSR 700W with the G22 base. That lamp on the right is the GY9.5 base lamp (700W/SA). Therefore I stand by my statement that they are absolutely NOT interchangeable. (Phew) For a minute there I thought this was going to be that dreaded first time where I would be wrong, but luckily I think I didn't let you down Ron!

ship said:

Still love and respect you Mark! One TD to another. And still wearing at times my try the HPR lamp trial swag shirt. Amongst other swag over the years. Osram was once the best for swag, harder to get swag from the other name brands years back when such swag was done, but I did acquire all main brands eventually at least for shirt. Amongst other things like hanging from my garage door.

Click to expand...

Back at you my friend! I wore my Upstaging sweatshirt this past winter frequently.