Manual Rigging - Operation

[smdoremus]

Hey all - this is my first post here. I just took over as my high school's theater director, which of course means I'm not just director, but technical director as well. I want to bring down our three electrics to do some maintenance and set them up to hang lights from-scratch in the fall. All three electrics are hung on winches, but the winches are A) very old (the manufacturer doesn't seem to exist anymore - it says "Stimmel" on the side of each) and B) are hand-operable, but the actual crank has gone missing over the course of the last decade. I've included a picture of the winches as they are now.



I've done some research, and it looks like I may be able to find the right handle, once I get the measurements of the shaft. However, I've hand-cranked manual winches before, and know they're an absolute pain to work with, especially when raising the electrics back up. Would it be possible to use a heavy-duty power drill with a socket attachment matching the dimensions of the crank shaft? If so, based on the picture you're looking at, and the knowledge that I'm raising and lowering electrics, sometimes fully loaded with lights, what size/kind of drill do you think I'd need? I definitely will be purchasing a plug-in drill, not a battery-operated one, as I'm sure lowering and raising 30' pipes with lights on them will drain batteries pretty quickly.

Any help/recommendations/instructions/ANYTHING is very much appreciated. I want to make a purchase on a drill (or a manual crank if the drill is a no-go). THANK YOU ALL!

 

[Footer]

Don't buy anything until you get the thing inspected by a theatrical rigging company. The shock loads put on the system by running it with a drill could cause a failure. You also need to know the weight limit of the system.

 

[smdoremus]

Any suggestions? I'm in the central NJ area - about 45-55 minutes south of NYC.

 

[JohnD]

There is always the ETCP certified riggers list:
http://etcp.plasa.org/cert_technicians/searchresults.php?state=NJ

 

[egilson1]

In that area I would recommend Sapsis rigging out of philly.

 

[Footer]

Sapsis, Iweiss, JR Clancy, BMI, the list goes on. All are in the area and probably close to you weekly.

 

[petercav17]

My theater's got 3 of these. A previous tech told me that one day, they walked into the theater and the first electric was on the floor. Needless to say, we don't use those cranks anymore...

 

[Robert]

I've used some like that before. Some manufacturers will specify they can be raised by a drill motor others will say no or not say anything. Mine were the type that could handle the drill motor, but we had to figure out the torque on the drill and amp load. We also had cable pullers to lock off the load. Lots of knowledge required to do this safely. You should get help.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

I was drill operating one very much like this and I must have moved enough that the socket pulled off the shaft and the electric kept coming in to the floor. I was told that wasn't possible but now know it is. So, first rule, be absolutely certain no one is under or can wander under.

Second, I never specify manual winches because there is no limit, i.e. no way to prevent going too far, breaking lines or damaging blocks going up or winding off drum going down.

Third, I'm just not comfortable with cast iron of uncertain origin, so recommend always safetying these off. Usually, and yours look like this, a single 3/8" wire rope winds on the drum and pulls a clew, with multiple lift lines through a head block to loft blocks. Usually pretty easy to attach a chain to the clew and have a separate anchor point for it, so when up, failure of the winch, its mounting, or the single 3/8" lead line, is protected.

Frankly, if you hired me to consult, I'd probably recommend replacing it all and motorizing with Prodigy or Powerlift or similar. These are probably beyond their life and time to upgrade. Especially the case since LED lighting weighs close to double what quartz weighs, which was probably all anyone envisioned when this was designed.

 

[smdoremus]

Hey folks. I'm just starting out as head of the theater dept. at the high school where I work, and I'm in the process of taking inventory and assessing the functionality of the space (high school auditorium).

My questions are concerning the manual winches that my electrics are operated by. They look to be made by a manufacturer that doesn't exist anymore (Stimmel?). I've searched the internet endlessly, and other than a few brief mentions on the Smithsonian website, there's no record of them. The winches are worm-gear with a removable crank that has mysteriously disappeared in the last decade or so (the school hasn't really had a fully-functioning theater program, and so the electrics haven't needed to be lowered for years). The drive-shafts are 4-pt with what look to be about 3/4"-1" diameters (I'm going to figure that out with my socket set this weekend).

Now, I can buy a replacement manual crank for cheap, and spend hours and manpower lowering and (especially) raising the electrics for each load-in/load-out. OR, my dad has an air compressor with an impact wrench and every socket size known to man.

I have two questions:
1) Because I can't find any record of this particular winch or its manufacturer on the internet, can anybody with more tech experience make an estimate on the specs of it, based on its size and the fact that they operate an electrical rigging system (the pipes are each ~30'-35')? The reason I want/need to know this is because I want to know...

2) Could I use my impact wrench on these winches to bring them down/up? My concern is with the torque of an impact wrench and if this winch can handle it. I believe the impact wrench in an Ingersoll, and in the kit it looked like there was a unit that looked like a power drill, and then one that looked more like a ratchet. My dad told me the ratchet-sized one had a lower torque/rpm, so if the larger drill/wrench is too much, could the smaller one be used?

Here are some pictures of the winch, including one with the "Stimmel" label on the side. Don't mind the dust, I've already taken some compressed air to that. I'm also in the process of clearing out all the random wires and other garbage that may otherwise interfere with the fixture's operation.

Anyone who can help - THANK YOU!

 

[egilson1]

Do NOT use any type of drill on these winches. Changing the speed of the winch by using a drill adversely effects the load rating of the winch. This is in addition to weather the hardware can handle the increased tork in the first place. Find a qualified rigger to come do the inspection as advised before and go from there.