Question about Hedge Hog 4

[soundguy99]

Hi guys,
If There is any Hog guys here I would appreciate the help, I posted this on High End's forums as well but I thought I would get your thoughts as well.
I am studying at a music industry college, and this year they just bought a new Hedge Hog 4 console.
As were trying to things figured out, I would like to get your thoughts or recommendations on something
Being an education facility we have multiple students using it for their shows each having their own cues.
Without having multiple show files, as they would each have to have their own patch, and plot, I would like everyone to use the same default showfile that would contain only the 1 default patch as well as plot, from there each student would be able to load in their own cuelist directory and there fore own playback config on the faders with their own banks. I don`t think in this enviroment its that great of an idea to have students with their own showfiles when really all they need is their own cuelust directory with their own order of their cues and playback setup including banks.
I tried this but when I did an import, each cue had Import listen under the name.
Can anyone offer any solutions, in a multiple user environment where we want to use the same showfile.but different Cue lists and playback config.
Any thoughts and recommendations are much appreciated,
Thanks,
soundguy

 

[Amiers]

Setup up the console how you want it.

Then export that file to distribute to the kids.

They build their stacks then load up their new show when ready to present.

They won’t need to mess with the fixtures if you already have it set. You won’t want to keep importing cue stacks over each other that will get hairy. Plus this will show what students were paying attention and those that just winged it. Loading a show properly is just as critical as programming and opping.

 

[RickR]

I don't see a downside to individual show files. I've done it with high school students, and know several others that also have.

What's your concern?

 

[soundguy99]

sorry maybe I am seeing things differently,
Looking at it, I guess my thought was to have the same showfile, so patch and plot stays the same, however also, things like color, position, and effects pallets, gets built up as each student adds to it, over time. Sorry if this sound weird but I am seeing the pallets of a communuty effort built by many students in which we can all use, however the cuelists and playback masters would be individually imported and exported like scenes on an audio console. During a show we each have our own cues we want to use and layout of those cues but the building blocks that make up those cues should be shared across multiple users.
Hope that makes sense, or I must be seeing things differently
Thanks,

 

[Amiers]

While I disagree with importing and exporting and sharing positions and palettes as each student will most likely make their own and conflicting issues galore you can import/export cue lists.

https://www.highend.com/pub/support/controllers/documents/HTML/en/sect-cuelist_import_export.htm

You will have to reload the show file each time with a blank cue list and the updates made from the students in the other sections.

So delete all cues after they are done. Save show.

Restart console

Import new cues.

 

[soundguy99]

thanks,
You may be right, I apreciate your experience on it, altthough we only have 12 led pars and 4 movers (2 spots, and 2 wash's), in a small space, so I didn`t think we would, have that many. A center spot is going to be a standard position, an orange color could be applied in many different cues, my thought is that once someone creates it, why do you need to create multiple times over on multiple different show files.
But your thoughts and experience is equally valuable to me.
Thanks

 

[Amiers]

The hog is a very user friendly console once you know the keystrokes.

Auto palettes generated by the console are only a few strokes.

And yes positions are nice to not have to remake. But if there are only 4. It seems like you are dumbing down the part of using a console which makes it the most fun. As well as their understanding of tracking from cue to cue. If they spin the movers one way and rely on a position someone else made that forces it to whip around it will not look good.

Just my perspective, programming can be done a million in a half ways. No one way is right. Personally I love programming and making something awesome out of nothing.

 

[soundguy99]

I agree with you.
For programing I think its great,
However we have both technical people who want to want to get their hands on it, and more musician type of people who have never touched a lighting console before much less a hog. The idea being that if there is already presets created by other students, the non technical people can still do some cool thing using things others have created until they get more comfortable to do stuff on their own.
Again thats also why I was trying to avoid the whole loading of showfiles, as i don`t want people to start messing around with patching, or accidentally deleting the show file even if there is a backup
Thanks

 

[Amiers]

Maybe have a buddy system. 1 lighting student paired with 1 audio student.

 

[cbrandt]

I strongly recommend having a base file that has a standard set of palettes and patch. This serves the purpose of having a consistent show for those students that are less proficient. Maybe have some very standard cue list layout there so there's less to do. However, I also strongly recommend that for those students programming their own shows, they should have their own show file for those. There are two big reasons for this. The first is that they can't mess up the showfile and cue lists for everyone else using the board. The second is that they get more experience doing the direct programming for anything beyond the simple showfile that is provided. This better equips them to deal with whatever they need to in the professional world after they leave the school.

 

[Ford]

I used to teach a similar class at Cornell.
While you think that shared palettes will make things easier, I agree with the others that have said that a single set of base palettes that your students can customize as a part of their programming will ultimately be the most useful.

So, build a setup as a class.
Choose 5 or 6 positions to include in the "basic" setup.
Have students add more positions to their own shows as required.

Have everyone start from the same place.

As to making it easy for the non-technical people... I think you may find that they have an easier time with programming on this type of console (as opposed to an Element, or Express, or whatever you're transitioning from) than the students who are trying to think of everything in terms of DMX values.

As an aside, I would make your students record all of their Pan and Tilt information as position presets. This is a habit that will serve them incredibly well in the future. One very, very important aspect of programming for any show that may move between venues is that all position information be programmed via Position Presets. Then, when the show changes venues, and the rig height is slightly taller, or wider, or whatever, you update your position presets, and all of your cues update automatically. It saves hours of "touch-up" programming time.