A thought-provoking, even if verbose and overly-long, article on the state of university theatre training programs and reality at Theatre Communications Group - American Theatre - January 2011 .
MFA designer training
- Thread starterderekleffew
- Start date
Interesting look and something I have thought about for awhile. I remember standing in a large room in the basement of a building at Illinois State waiting to go into a mass interview with 30 colleges. In that room sat about 250 other students waiting to do the same thing. I had no fears about getting into the college of my choice, but I did have fears about what would happen when I got out. Doing the rough math, each year Illinois alone was turning out about 100-150 tech/design people in just their undergrad programs. I roughly estimated that across the country, 1,500 people were leaving schools with undergrad degrees every year. Thats a lot of people. I also considered that within my area there was probably no more then 200 theatre jobs total: from regional theatre to neck-down work. The odds were not great. This is one of the reasons I believe that out of my graduating class of 7, only 4 of my classmates are working in the field. The same is true for grad schools. Unfortunately, there is even less work. Most people with an MFA right out of school expect to get the big design jobs where they don't have to do any physical work.
I have noticed more and more people in the last few years going straight from undergrad to grad school. Even the top tier schools such as Yale are accepting people straight out of undergrad, supporting what the article is talking about. Right now I am trying to make the choice of to go to grad school or not. I now know what I want out of a program instead of trying to find a program that wants me. I feel many people go to get their MFA right out of undergrad because it is a safe thing to do. They get some money, get to put off repaying loans 3 more years, and they believe they will get the golden ticket to design in theatre the rest of their life.
I have noticed more and more people in the last few years going straight from undergrad to grad school. Even the top tier schools such as Yale are accepting people straight out of undergrad, supporting what the article is talking about. Right now I am trying to make the choice of to go to grad school or not. I now know what I want out of a program instead of trying to find a program that wants me. I feel many people go to get their MFA right out of undergrad because it is a safe thing to do. They get some money, get to put off repaying loans 3 more years, and they believe they will get the golden ticket to design in theatre the rest of their life.
I feel that every student should read that blog post. This is exactly the kind of thing that has troubled me for quite some time. An unfortunate consequence of this system is that the business becomes less and less respected. While I may hold what may be considered a "dream job" of many aspiring technicians, when I talk to people from other professions, our jobs are still considered less than "real" jobs. I can't say how many times I've heard "Oh, I used to be a techie in HS/college". As if there's an understanding of what corporate theater is like. <I guess that could be one of my Annoying Theater Cliches>
To add to what Kyle was stating about the number of classmates versus graduates, I know off many in the field who have never taken a college course in theater ever, or like myself, didn't get more than an Associates Degree in theater. In my opinion, there are too many programs centered around design and too few centered around the positions that are more necessary. We need more programs to get good quality administrative staff, Master Electricians, Technical Directors, etc. If the graduates come out with marketable skills, then they have a better opportunity to get employment, potentially outside of theater. My degree in theater, coupled with my education in archaeology, gave me the skills necessary to work in an exhibit shop for a major natural history museum as well as another shop that built custom cabinetry and exhibits for trade shows. Had I been in another city, I probably would have taken those skills to building custom/themed cabinetry for retail.
As a side note, I have spoken with a few prominent lighting designers from New York shows who make less money than I do as a technician. I have been told by more than one of them who has said that they need to supplement their theater design work with architectural lighting design. Just something to think about.
To add to what Kyle was stating about the number of classmates versus graduates, I know off many in the field who have never taken a college course in theater ever, or like myself, didn't get more than an Associates Degree in theater. In my opinion, there are too many programs centered around design and too few centered around the positions that are more necessary. We need more programs to get good quality administrative staff, Master Electricians, Technical Directors, etc. If the graduates come out with marketable skills, then they have a better opportunity to get employment, potentially outside of theater. My degree in theater, coupled with my education in archaeology, gave me the skills necessary to work in an exhibit shop for a major natural history museum as well as another shop that built custom cabinetry and exhibits for trade shows. Had I been in another city, I probably would have taken those skills to building custom/themed cabinetry for retail.
As a side note, I have spoken with a few prominent lighting designers from New York shows who make less money than I do as a technician. I have been told by more than one of them who has said that they need to supplement their theater design work with architectural lighting design. Just something to think about.
I think you've missed the point. It's not about the difficulty of getting into a good school or the odds of getting a job later. None of that matters. Back to my age old rant... Unlike other careers paths, real world work is just as important, if not more important, than a degree. Who you have met and impressed with your hard work (or don't impress) will change your life. Having a degree just puts your resume in a stack with everyone else. Theater is a very small world. Meeting people, impressing people, making friendships, proving you are a skilled hard worker, can often add up to a better path to a career than any degree.
I have a bunch of friends here on CB who have these amazing "tech theater dream jobs" at places they aren't allowed to talk about. All of them will tell you (if they were allowed to discuss it) they got their job because of their hard work and a strange set of circumstances that just led them from one path to the next, eventually opening doors to a career. NONE OF THEM got the job because they got an MFA and applied for a job with their golden ticket degree. This isn't engineering or computer science. Your high school guidance counselor is wrong. Hard work and real world proving yourself are often considered more valuable than a framed piece of paper.
My advice is get the most education you can actually afford. A degree that gives you the widest base of training in lighting, sound, carpentry, and video if possible. If you can afford a fancy school great. If you can only afford a state school, pick a good one and don't worry about it. If you are skilled and work hard, 5 years from now, no one will care where you went to college.
DON'T go thousands of dollars into debt going to a fancy private school for an MFA. After you graduate, it'll be years until you actually make real money in this field. Unless your family has a lot of money to support you, the expensive loan route is pretty much the way to guarantee you'll never work in theater... because you'll have to go into another field to pay your bills long before you get real paying work.
Again I can't stress enough. 5 years after graduation no one will care if you got an MFA at Yale or a B.A. at University of Southern Nowhere. What will be important 5 years after graduation is who you impressed as part time resident lighting designer for the Eastern Nowhere Community Players.
Some interesting thoughts in the article and it's not exactly a new problem.
I had a very similar discussion with the head of the Theater program at SUNY Purchase, 32 years ago, when they ( presumably the faculty) were struggling as to whether to offer an MFA degree, or keep the program as BFA. Joe Stockwell was the dean at the time and he wanted to know why I was leaving after my freshman year. I told him that it was partly as they were cranking out clones of the design program faculty, the lighting professor being a prominent Broadway designer at the time (and a terrific design teacher to boot), and that's what every lighting student was getting trained to be - a Broadway designer. Note that a few went on to become Broadway designers, but I wasn't alone in wondering if there was that much work for all of us and they weren't teaching ANYBODY to be technicians, everybody had to be a designer.
This was 32 years ago and what hasn't changed is that tenured professors are not going to change what is a very lucrative and EASY way to make a living. We as an industry may have a need for qualified students from maybe 10 MFA programs, so what do we do with the 1000 other professors or so from those 290 other programs ?. They LIKE their jobs and lifestyle and they do not want to have to go out and actually work for a living. Mind that this is a very biased attitude developed from 29 years at a college.
And do we need MFA's ?. Pretty much every student I see in the MFA program where I work is only getting the stupid degree as a hedge that they might have to teach when the design work dries up. This is driven by the attitude of the college programs that if you don't have at least an MFA you are not qualified to teach at the college level. Thus it's a self replicating industry.
What's needed is more schools teaching folks to be good technicians. Forget design, we have enough designers. To get better technicians, we need experienced technicians teaching others the craft. But how many colleges want the workers at the faculty meetings, much less in the faculty dining room ?.
Not going to happen.
I had a very similar discussion with the head of the Theater program at SUNY Purchase, 32 years ago, when they ( presumably the faculty) were struggling as to whether to offer an MFA degree, or keep the program as BFA. Joe Stockwell was the dean at the time and he wanted to know why I was leaving after my freshman year. I told him that it was partly as they were cranking out clones of the design program faculty, the lighting professor being a prominent Broadway designer at the time (and a terrific design teacher to boot), and that's what every lighting student was getting trained to be - a Broadway designer. Note that a few went on to become Broadway designers, but I wasn't alone in wondering if there was that much work for all of us and they weren't teaching ANYBODY to be technicians, everybody had to be a designer.
This was 32 years ago and what hasn't changed is that tenured professors are not going to change what is a very lucrative and EASY way to make a living. We as an industry may have a need for qualified students from maybe 10 MFA programs, so what do we do with the 1000 other professors or so from those 290 other programs ?. They LIKE their jobs and lifestyle and they do not want to have to go out and actually work for a living. Mind that this is a very biased attitude developed from 29 years at a college.
And do we need MFA's ?. Pretty much every student I see in the MFA program where I work is only getting the stupid degree as a hedge that they might have to teach when the design work dries up. This is driven by the attitude of the college programs that if you don't have at least an MFA you are not qualified to teach at the college level. Thus it's a self replicating industry.
What's needed is more schools teaching folks to be good technicians. Forget design, we have enough designers. To get better technicians, we need experienced technicians teaching others the craft. But how many colleges want the workers at the faculty meetings, much less in the faculty dining room ?.
Not going to happen.
Last edited:
I said almost the same thing in the poll in the sticky area. My local college has a great theatre program for a small D3 school but everybody that graduates is either a director or a designer. I know many that have graduated with degrees that have no clue if a light doesn't work if it is anything more than a plug or lamp.
I'm busy right now, so I can't get into reading the other thread, but I'm so happy I'm not alone in this argument.
I'm currently a Senior in college, and luckily, I went to a school with a smaller program that allowed me to get a ton of hands on experience as an undergrad. Thus, I have been able to start building my skills as a technician. Long story short, I came in thinking "design" and will leave thinking "technician". While I certainly enjoy designing, I have no desire to piece together the life of a freelance designer. I get plenty of fulfillment from the technical side of things, and at the end of the day, its still fun.
I have long felt their is an obsession with design and design programs. Why are there no young technician awards? Why do schools allow their students to become so narrow and specialized? How is that serving the student? What is the world going to do with thousands of designs that graduate every year, especially the ones that can't even hang a light? As the incredible world of tech in live entertainment becomes more complex by the minute, why does it seem like no one is taking the initiative to teach the skills that will be needed.
On the other hand, I remember being at USITT last year, and some school was introducing their kids (I forget what event). Anyway, they started saying, "an this is so and so, she is a first year TD major". I remember thinking, what the hell? This kid is 18 - 19 years old, fresh out of high school. Do they have any idea what lies ahead of them? How does a school cram everything a TD needs into four years?
I'm 22 years old, and I feel like I'm one of the few in my age bracket concerned about this design obsession. I don't know, maybe I'm jaded already, but I actually want to do this as a profession, not just for fun when I'm done waiting tables.
While I have no immediate plans for grad school, if I ever do end up going, it'll be to increase my technical knowledge and abilities, and not for design.
I'm currently a Senior in college, and luckily, I went to a school with a smaller program that allowed me to get a ton of hands on experience as an undergrad. Thus, I have been able to start building my skills as a technician. Long story short, I came in thinking "design" and will leave thinking "technician". While I certainly enjoy designing, I have no desire to piece together the life of a freelance designer. I get plenty of fulfillment from the technical side of things, and at the end of the day, its still fun.
I have long felt their is an obsession with design and design programs. Why are there no young technician awards? Why do schools allow their students to become so narrow and specialized? How is that serving the student? What is the world going to do with thousands of designs that graduate every year, especially the ones that can't even hang a light? As the incredible world of tech in live entertainment becomes more complex by the minute, why does it seem like no one is taking the initiative to teach the skills that will be needed.
On the other hand, I remember being at USITT last year, and some school was introducing their kids (I forget what event). Anyway, they started saying, "an this is so and so, she is a first year TD major". I remember thinking, what the hell? This kid is 18 - 19 years old, fresh out of high school. Do they have any idea what lies ahead of them? How does a school cram everything a TD needs into four years?
I'm 22 years old, and I feel like I'm one of the few in my age bracket concerned about this design obsession. I don't know, maybe I'm jaded already, but I actually want to do this as a profession, not just for fun when I'm done waiting tables.
While I have no immediate plans for grad school, if I ever do end up going, it'll be to increase my technical knowledge and abilities, and not for design.
Similar threads
