Microphones and face shields

TimMc

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
The point many 'amateur virologists' miss is that a virus is NOT a germ. A virus has a fatty lipid shell protecting it. You need SOAP to break down that shell to kill a virus, NOT hand sanitizer. Use the right tool for the job! Surgeons don't scrub for a surgery with hand sanitizer -- they scrub with soap.
Yep, breaking down that outer lipid layer is a key to disabling the virus.
 

JimOC_1

Active Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Location
Maryland
The point many 'amateur virologists' miss is that a virus is NOT a germ. A virus has a fatty lipid shell protecting it. You need SOAP to break down that shell to kill a virus, NOT hand sanitizer. Use the right tool for the job! Surgeons don't scrub for a surgery with hand sanitizer -- they scrub with soap.
Hi teqniqal,
In case you did not see this on another thread.

This link lists agents that should kill the virus just by contact.

www.epa.gov

List N: Disinfectants for Use Against SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19) | US EPA
Search EPA’s list of registered disinfectants for use against SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes the novel coronavirus (COVID-19).
www.epa.gov
www.epa.gov

A more direct info is coming out slowly.

www.epa.gov

EPA approves first surface disinfectant products tested on the SARS-CoV-2 virus | US EPA
EPA News Release: EPA approves first surface disinfectant products tested on the SARS-CoV-2 virus
www.epa.gov
www.epa.gov
From an ARP news letter "Lysol cleaning products have proven effective in killing the novel coronavirus on hard surfaces, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) announced.
Lysol Disinfectant Spray and Lysol Disinfectant Max Cover Mist received approval Monday from the federal agency for their effectiveness against SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. They are the first surface disinfectant products to receive such approval; the EPA said it expects more will follow."

Fortunatly sanitizer does kill the virus. Your information seems to need an update.
 

Colin

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Joined
Jan 23, 2015
Location
Eastern Massachusetts
We should get this right.

I have no citations, though surely I could go get some. Maybe later. I almost majored in biology - does that count?🤔

Not all viruses have a "fatty lipid shell" or envelope, though the one in question does. The envelope has these important characteristics and impacts:

- It makes the virus more infectious, because the envelope is in part made from components of host cell membranes - a disguise.
- In enveloped viruses, the structures that allow the virus to attach to a cell and infect it are component to the envelope. Compromise the envelope and the virus is no longer infectious. Non-enveloped viruses, lacking this weakness, are actually tougher to "deactivate". SARS-CoV2 is delicate by comparison.
- Soap is not the only thing that compromises a virus envelope. Several other substances and environmental factors do it too, including alcohol. But any old soap does a good job, and washing correctly with soap and running water actually removes a lot of viruses down a drain rather than just spreading them around our hands while we rub some arbitrary amount of sanitizer around while maybe missing some spots.

Surgical scrub isn't plain old soap. It's antiseptic - iodine and so forth. Please don't do home surgery with your bar of Dove.

DO WHAT REAL SCIENTISTS SAY.
 

Joe Moore

Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2017
Location
Chesterfield, MO
I am not going down the rabbit hole of should you be doing a live production, enough opinions are out there. I would try rigging the mic in the costume aimed at the thoracic cavity. You will lose again but should get clear sound without the face shield issues. You can rig on undergarments that are not subject to costume change. I know it is not a lav mic but I have tried it in certain circumstances with success.
 

TimMc

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Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Nothing much to add to all the tech wizdom above...just wondering how one finds info on disinfecting/ cleaning mics between users?
There will likely be an Audio Engineering Society convention panel on "coping with Covid" and cleaning hardware is one of the topics. In fact the panel has a Zoom meeting in about 2 hours...

Shure just updated their guidance on cleaning (3 days ago). DPA has guidance. PointSource guidance will be forthcoming if it's not already available. AKG is kind of vague, as is Sennheiser (so far anyway, we're working with them).

The April 8, 2020 webinar at www.practicalshow.tech (use the Archive tab to find) has a presentation by Denise Woodward of IATSE Local 16, and she provided the info she had amassed at that time. I know Denise has edited and updated her findings but I'm not sure the downloadable assets have been updated by PST. The big take-away - DPA cleaning varies with the type of mic. Miniature mics should not have alcohol, solvents of any kind, or most chemicals used on the mic cable as they will strip the plasticizers from the outer jacket and cause the cable to become intermittent and fail. DPA recommends... wait for it.... olive oil. Yummy! Our actors will smell like pasta and salads which may be an improvement! The mic element itself can be cleaned with with isopropyl (they have guidance on this).

For most hard surface items the use of 70% isopropyl alcohol (the 'prep pads' the nurse uses before giving an injection are perfect). The manufacturers won't tell you how long to leave it wet (that's up to you figure out, but we'll have some guidance in the AES panel that can be traced back to health authorities), but what you don't want is to have liquids running into the device. Remember that the important parts are those touched and handled by other persons... Some of the guidance the panel has received is that consoles will not tolerate frequent cleaning and 'wet' cleaning is discouraged.

Finally, so far the biology is indicating that infectious levels of virus do not survive on surfaces for as long as previously thought. If an item is not used for several days and is otherwise clean and free of debris, gunk and soil, the item is likely safe to re-use. That may not sit will with some parents, teachers, students, or administrators so a certain amount of 'sanitation dog and pony show' may be necessary to assuage them.
 

TimMc

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Do you have the link to this, I see something they updated on 7/22 but not on the 26th or 27th.

Shure Cleaning 7/22
That's the updated guidance. The notice hit my in box 3 days ago....

DPA has similar guidance with a short video on cleaning their miniature mics. Countryman has no guidance on their website yet but I suspect it will be forthcoming as another member of the AES panel has received email guidance. Can't share it here as it's part of the "deliverables" package for the AES convention but I expect Countryman will have it posted. We're also soliciting guidance for IEM receivers and body pack transmitters (updated guidance from Shure, working on Sennheiser). Lectrosonics has guidance. Also we're working with console manufacturers, intercom manfacturers (Reidel and Clear-Com have guidance up now) and other high-touch, multi-user items.
 

egilson1

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Premium Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2009
Location
Boston, MA
If you check the CDC they state that it’s not the soap that is important but it’s the running water that washes away the virus. This is the reason many third world countries are having issues as they don’t have ample running water.

“Using soap to wash hands is more effective than using water alone because the surfactants in soap lift soil and microbes from skin, and people tend to scrub hands more thoroughly when using soap, which further removes germs.

To date, studies have shown that there is no added health benefit for consumers (this does not include professionals in the healthcare setting) using soaps containing antibacterial ingredients compared with using plain soap”

So running your microphone elements under the tap should do the trick. 😝
 

BCAP

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Joined
Jan 4, 2017
Location
Ohio
Forget cleaning the equipment, let's clean the actors!! Dunking them in whiskey before the performance might help.... ;);):dance::dance:🤣🤣🤣🍸🍸🍷🍷🍺🍺
 

jtweigandt

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2013
Location
Moline Il
The point many 'amateur virologists' miss is that a virus is NOT a germ. A virus has a fatty lipid shell protecting it. You need SOAP to break down that shell to kill a virus, NOT hand sanitizer. Use the right tool for the job! Surgeons don't scrub for a surgery with hand sanitizer -- they scrub with soap.
Actually.. surgeons scrub with whatever to remove the big chunks.. but after years and years of relying on iodine, it turns out the best final application is 70% alcohol for quick knockdown mixed with some chlorhexidine for sustained action of stuff coming up from the deep layers of skin.. Avigard by 3m is the product. And hand sanitizer is highly effective against a variety of viruses as well as bacteria. Turns out 70% is about the sweet spot. higher percentage doesn’t have enough water to disrupt the structure once the solvent action of the alcohol disrupts the outer “shell” So 90% alcohol is worse than 70%. I’m not an amateur virologist, just a practicing DVM trying to stay on top of this. And yes.. plain soap is both anti viral and somewhat anti bacterial in addition to it’s plain old mechanical cleaning properties.