Analog to SPDIF with word clock in for LS9

[SHARYNF]

As more and more folks are getting LS9 mixers I wondered if anyone had come up with a good solution for Analog "music" in Say from an Ipod or laptop (disregarding for a moment the usb playback ability in the ls9)

There is a Spdif IN and out which could be used for this but with a couple of issues I believe. One is that AFAIK the spdif in on the LS9 does not re sample or re clock, and infact it SEEMS that if you connect a Spdif signal this becomes the reference signal for the LS9 clock. I would be interested to see if anyone has a comment on this. It is for this issue that just getting a cheap and cheerful 50 dollar or so Analog to Spdif converter is probably not a good Idea

SO I wondered if anyone had found a simple A/d with SPdif that also had word clock IN so that the LS9 could be the master clock (or another stable source of clock) and then allow for these inputs to be used. Another possibility might be a simple two channel Analog to AES/EBU with external clock in, and then convert the AES to Spdif???
Sharyn

 

[bishopthomas]

I don't really have any answers for you (never used the SPDIF) but here's the manual: http://www2.yamaha.co.jp/manual/pdf/pa/english/mixers/ls9_en_om_d0.pdf Page 46 seems to have some good information. Let us know how you make out.

 

[museav]

Is this assuming that you have no analog inputs available on the LS9?

 

[epimetheus]

We had an LS9-16 at my former church. I used the SPDIF in for the output of my projection computer for video playback and such. Letting the LS9 clock off the SPDIF never seemed to cause me any problems. Computers and laptops alike often have SPDIF outputs on their sounds cards. If not, an aftermarket soundcard is relatively cheap.

 

[museav]

Computers and laptops alike often have SPDIF outputs on their sounds cards. If not, an aftermarket soundcard is relatively cheap.

However, S/PDIF outputs and soundcards are not applicable to iPods, iPads, smartphones, etc. or an option for many laptops, I believe including MacBooks. It seems to be that audio outputs from portable devices are now commonly either analog stereo or part of an integrated multimedia format such as DisplayPort or HDMI and since expansion card ports seem to be disappearing on laptops any other audio may have to be addressed via dedicated external USB or FireWire audio interfaces.

 

[SHARYNF]

Is this assuming that you have no analog inputs available on the LS9?

Exactly, the simple answer is of course to just use one of the xlr inputs, but in some cases being able to just use the Spdif in would be useful
Sharyn

 

[NickVon]

I've been using a M-Audio Firewire 410 connected to our LS9-32. We are using the Spdif as the PC's main stereo out into the Console. That said the M-audio box has been a little flaky with me this week. Something that i need to research is whether i can set the LS9 to a 44100 clock instead of a 44800 clock, because when the M-audio does get borked 441 is it's default.

in addition I use the 2TR out to go into the mbox for 2 more audio channels of capture in addition to the USB stick.

 

[SHARYNF]

I've been using a M-Audio Firewire 410 connected to our LS9-32. We are using the Spdif as the PC's main stereo out into the Console. That said the M-audio box has been a little flaky with me this week. Something that i need to research is whether i can set the LS9 to a 44100 clock instead of a 44800 clock, because when the M-audio does get borked 441 is it's default.

in addition I use the 2TR out to go into the mbox for 2 more audio channels of capture in addition to the USB stick.

You can set the internal clock on the LS9 (see page 46 in manual) you have 4 options, int48 int 44.1 wc in and 2tr in
Yamaha does confirm that IF the 2tr is used as input then the ls9 is using it for its clock source, and IF you try to run the 2tr in and do not use it as the source then you are going to get the usual pops and clicks. So far the only suggestion I have gotten is the RDK HD ac1
Amazon.com: RDL HR-ADC1 Analog to Digital Audio Converter - Power Supply Included: Electronics

Sharyn

 

[bishopthomas]

I've never used this particular unit but I have used (and enjoyed) other RME products in the past: RME ADI-2 | Sweetwater.com

 

[SHARYNF]

I've never used this particular unit but I have used (and enjoyed) other RME products in the past: RME ADI-2 | Sweetwater.com

the problem is even thought the RMAE adi-2 Is a quality unit, it does not have wordclock in
Sharyn

 

[bishopthomas]

I thought your were deriving the clock via SPDIF?

 

[SHARYNF]

I thought your were deriving the clock via SPDIF?

That is the crux of the problem, I want to have the LS9 as the master, but I would like to use the Digital 2 track in with an a/d converter. The problem is that in order to use the 2track in it MUST be the master, which means that you are then substituting the clock on the LS9 from some cheap probably unstable clock in the a/d UNLESS the a/d has word clock IN, which I am finding is pretty rare. Looks like the best approach is to just ignore the sigital 2 track in on the LS9 or get a 600 dollar A/D converter
Sharyn

 

[TimmyP1955]

You'd be a lot better off spending the converter money on an A-D card for the LS9. You'll get a lot more utility from a card with 4 or 8 line inputs.

 

[SHARYNF]

You'd be a lot better off spending the converter money on an A-D card for the LS9. You'll get a lot more utility from a card with 4 or 8 line inputs.

The LS9 in question already has a MY16at with 16 channels of conversion, one layer is used for FOH one layer used for Monitor mix, the interest in using the 2 track is just to allow for a simple repatch to allow for external analog input (ipod etc)
Sharyn

 

[SHARYNF]

I thought your were deriving the clock via SPDIF?

So here is a question

ON the LS9 IF you select internal clock, and have an external ad converter that uses Word clock, can you connect to the the Digital 2 track in and NOT set the word clock source to the two track in? or does Yamaha force you if the digital 2 track in is use to ONLY use the 2 track in as the clock source. Typically the assumption on gear is that if you use the digital in spdif that that becomes the clock source, BUT in the case of using an external ad with word clock there should not be a clock problem.. I am not near a LS9 so I would be curious if anyone has tried to select internal word clock AND digital 2 track in??

Thanks
Sharyn

 

[bishopthomas]

Those are good questions, Sharyn. I'm opposite of you, I have an LS9 handy but no clock source and/or SPDIF source to use as front end.

 

[SHARYNF]

Those are good questions, Sharyn. I'm opposite of you, I have an LS9 handy but no clock source and/or SPDIF source to use as front end.

I put the question to Yamaha tech support, and will let you know what they say
Sharyn

 

[NickVon]

I put the question to Yamaha tech support, and will let you know what they say
Sharyn

along similar lines...

I have an M-Audio Firewire 410. I selected it's Clock source to be be FROM THE spidif (ie the LS9) i only did this because i couldn't figuer out how to change that setting on the LS9 at that moment. So the M-audio is clocking off the ls9. does an A/D (the analogue) portion of that, can it even carry a TC signal? i thought that was a very digital thing, meaning you need something between the Ipod and the 2TR in. (Some little cheapo interface? M-AUDIO - Fast Track Pro - 4 x 4 Mobile USB Audio/MIDI Interface with Preamps
)

 

[SHARYNF]

along similar lines...

I have an M-Audio Firewire 410. I selected it's Clock source to be be FROM THE spidif (ie the LS9) i only did this because i couldn't figuer out how to change that setting on the LS9 at that moment. So the M-audio is clocking off the ls9. does an A/D (the analogue) portion of that, can it even carry a TC signal? i thought that was a very digital thing, meaning you need something between the Ipod and the 2TR in. (Some little cheapo interface? M-AUDIO - Fast Track Pro - 4 x 4 Mobile USB Audio/MIDI Interface with Preamps
)

So Yamaha tech support got back to me with some good news.

It is possible to have the Internal clock be the Word clock source and feed that to the external AD and then connect the AD via SPDIF and everything will work fine

The Other alternative IF the AD/DA will accept clock from its SPDIF is to just connect the 2 track digital OUTPUT to the input of the AD/DA Set word clock to internal and this will then provide proper clock. It important to make sure that the AD/DA not only takes clock from SPDIF IN but ALSO uses it for the AD output to the LS9. There are SOME AD/DA that will take any SPDIF in but use their OWN INTERNAL CLOCK. If this is the case there will be problems. S0 it is important to check this. One of the cheaper alternatives (beyond using a DAT) is the Behringer SRC2496 (I know Behringer ;-() this will take external clock in, and will allow you to convert the 2 track in and out to analog.

Sharyn

Sharyn