DMX Control

[kylall77]

So, as shown above, I know how to setup a simple DMX lighting arrangement, but if I wanted to use a console and software together, what would I do? Would I need a console that connects to my computer via USB? What program would I need? What would plug into what? Would I use a program and control the lights through a USB-DMX dongle, then get a USB controller for the software?

Also, would I be able to run the DMX software from the same computer that I'm using for ProVideoPlayer? For example, if I controlled DMX through my Mac, then outputted it through all the lights, could I loop it back to the Mac to control ProVideoPlayer? Where would the console come in then?

I'd really appreciate any response, and if you're confused about what I'm saying or trying to figure out I can rephrase it.

 

[icewolf08]

Well, there are a couple ways to do this. First off, is there a reason that you need both the console and the computer software? What console do you have? Having two DMX sources can be tricky. There are two ways to deal with it. One requires that either your software or console supports DMX input. The other is to get a DMX merge device (available from companies like Doug Fleenor). What you can't do is just hook up two DMX controllers to the same equipment and expect it all to work.

If your software or console support DMX input then you can run DMX from one through the other. Usually this requires patching the incoming information to another output so that it can be passed through. If your equipment doesn't support an input then you need a merger box. These take multiple DMX inputs and merge them into one data stream. They usually have some kind of configuration to determine how they do that. As long as you don't overlap addresses from your controllers, you should have no issues with a DMX Merger. So your setup would be: Console & Computer > Merger > Lights > Projections.

As far as running your lighting software and projections on the same computer. Can you? Probably. Should you? No. It will be easier and safer to run your lighting and projections on separate machines. It ensures that neither software conflicts, and if you have a problem with one, you don't lose the entire system.

 

[kylall77]

Well, there are a couple ways to do this. First off, is there a reason that you need both the console and the computer software? What console do you have? Having two DMX sources can be tricky. There are two ways to deal with it. One requires that either your software or console supports DMX input. The other is to get a DMX merge device (available from companies like Doug Fleenor). What you can't do is just hook up two DMX controllers to the same equipment and expect it all to work.

If your software or console support DMX input then you can run DMX from one through the other. Usually this requires patching the incoming information to another output so that it can be passed through. If your equipment doesn't support an input then you need a merger box. These take multiple DMX inputs and merge them into one data stream. They usually have some kind of configuration to determine how they do that. As long as you don't overlap addresses from your controllers, you should have no issues with a DMX Merger. So your setup would be: Console & Computer > Merger > Lights > Projections.

As far as running your lighting software and projections on the same computer. Can you? Probably. Should you? No. It will be easier and safer to run your lighting and projections on separate machines. It ensures that neither software conflicts, and if you have a problem with one, you don't lose the entire system.

Thanks for the reply!

I'm not looking to use two separate controllers. I'm looking to control the DMX lighting through a Mac based software solution, however, I want a physical controller to control the software, in turn controlling the lights. I'm guessing this would be done with MIDI or something like that? I'm not sure how that all works.

As for the ProVideoPlayer (PVP) part of the question, we are not projecting with PVP. PVP allows us to input DMX signal into the computer to sync the colors of projected backgrounds with the colors of our lighting. The background hue adjustment is then sent through an internet network to our presentation computer.

 

[icewolf08]

Thanks for the reply!

I'm not looking to use two separate controllers. I'm looking to control the DMX lighting through a Mac based software solution, however, I want a physical controller to control the software, in turn controlling the lights. I'm guessing this would be done with MIDI or something like that? I'm not sure how that all works.

As for the ProVideoPlayer (PVP) part of the question, we are not projecting with PVP. PVP allows us to input DMX signal into the computer to sync the colors of projected backgrounds with the colors of our lighting. The background hue adjustment is then sent through an internet network to our presentation computer.

Ok, so what you really want is a computer based lighting controller that has physical control surfaces. There are many options for that. Some of the more common are MagicQ and Hog3PC. The MagicQ software is free (and there is a Mac version), the control surfaces you would have to buy. There are many other software based lighting controllers that you could use a MIDI control surface with or some other physical controller.

Of course this again raises the question, if you want a real lighting control surface, why do you want a software lighting controller? If the goal is to have buttons and faders it seems like a real lighting desk would suit you just fine.

 

[kylall77]

Ok, so what you really want is a computer based lighting controller that has physical control surfaces. There are many options for that. Some of the more common are MagicQ and Hog3PC. The MagicQ software is free (and there is a Mac version), the control surfaces you would have to buy. There are many other software based lighting controllers that you could use a MIDI control surface with or some other physical controller.

Of course this again raises the question, if you want a real lighting control surface, why do you want a software lighting controller? If the goal is to have buttons and faders it seems like a real lighting desk would suit you just fine.

I could easily be wrong, but from what I understand, you can get a lot more functionality with software solutions. Depending on the software, aren't you able to select colors as you see them on screen? I also saw programs that allow you to place icons of your lights on a digital palette that represents your stage. From there you can select lights in a way that is coordinated with your actual setup instead of a straight line of faders.

I honestly don't have much of any idea what I'm doing so...

 

[CrazyTechie]

You can get a color picker on lighting consoles. Many of the newer consoles have this built in when the light you are programming is an intelligent light. You can even pick out a color of an actual gel based on manufacture and the specific number.

If I'm not mistaken on GrandMA 2 (maybe even GrandMA) you can set up a 3D view of your lighting rig and click on lights and select them that way. When I am designing I prefer to have a magic sheet that tells me where each light is pointed and what color it is as well. Many LD's that I've met have a magic sheet in one form or another that they can call out channel numbers from.

As far as functionality is concerned it really depends on what you are trying to do. Personally I would pick a console over a computer running a lighting control software any day. Even though a computer may work just fine it is running many more things in the background that a console isn't having to deal with which creates more points of interference while running the show.

 

[kylall77]

You can get a color picker on lighting consoles. Many of the newer consoles have this built in when the light you are programming is an intelligent light. You can even pick out a color of an actual gel based on manufacture and the specific number.

If I'm not mistaken on GrandMA 2 (maybe even GrandMA) you can set up a 3D view of your lighting rig and click on lights and select them that way. When I am designing I prefer to have a magic sheet that tells me where each light is pointed and what color it is as well. Many LD's that I've met have a magic sheet in one form or another that they can call out channel numbers from.

As far as functionality is concerned it really depends on what you are trying to do. Personally I would pick a console over a computer running a lighting control software any day. Even though a computer may work just fine it is running many more things in the background that a console isn't having to deal with which creates more points of interference while running the show.

Thanks! Do you have any recommendations? I won't be using any moving heads, just some American DJ Par 64s on a dimmer for front lighting, and a few LEDs in the back for up lighting.



So if I was to go through a software interface, does anyone know if I'd be able to do this?

 

[AhClem]

I'm not certain, but believe you'd need two separate EnTEC devices, one as the DMX controller and a second EnTEC used as the DMX-USB interface for the PVP "fixture".

I'm biased about the BlueLite X1 (I manufacture it) but from your description, it sounds like it was designed for your purposes. It can be used with any external DMX console while obtaining all the added capabilities of the software control system. While it's a Windows based program, many of our users run it on their Mac's using Parallels. Take a look at our demo video and you can see how it allows you control of the X1 submasters from any external console. We also have SMPTE timecode in/out for show syncronization.
Our BlueLite software could be used to control the EnTEC 'fixture' that you'd be using as the PVP's DMX device. We also have the DBOT device that can convert DMX signals to keystroke commands (typically used to send number and function-key values to Panolin Laser software), in addition, I'm certain our engineer could create a USB driver designed to work directly with the PVP software the same way the EnTEC unit does. We're able to control the ArKaos Media Master software and the Capture Polar visualization software on the same laptop as the BlueLite X1 software, but as has been mentioned, it's not a bad idea to have your critical systems separated if only so you don't have a single-point-of-failure concern if you can avoid it.
Feel free to contact me if you have any questions or you can check out our User Manual if you're interested.

I'm going to look over the PVP documentation to see if they have any information on an API to integrate it with our software.

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follow-up...
I just double checked the EntTEC User manual and on pg.16 is mentions it can't be used as aninput and an output simultaneously.