Control/Dimming Exterior, motion picture lighting with moving LED lights?

tinboat

Member
Hi, I'm a new member who's been working with lighting in the motion picture / television industry. I'm interested in using some moving LED lights for our night exterior, New York City, street scenes. Often, we rig lights during our daytime pre-lights which are very difficult to access during shooting. Having something like a MAC 101 in these spots would allow us to change the focus remotely as we move from shot to shot. These lamps would not be moving during the scene, we would pan, tilt and dim them between camera set ups. At 8 lbs, the Mac 101 would be easy to rig in some tough spots.

Here are some of my questions:

Is there a way to control these lights in a small portable package? A laptop with software and a MDX interface box could work but I think we would prefer a mini controller if one exists. Is the a small weatherproof controller? If we use a laptop, what software and hardware would you recommend?

Is there an established way to put breaks in the DMX cables so that the controller can be moved to various locations and out of the camera's view?

Is there a lightweight version of a LED moving light that is weatherproof? What do the Rock & Roll folks use for their exterior venues?

Thanks for your help,

John
 
Is there a way to control these lights in a small portable package? A laptop with software and a MDX interface box could work but I think we would prefer a mini controller if one exists. Is the a small weatherproof controller? If we use a laptop, what software and hardware would you recommend?

Is there an established way to put breaks in the DMX cables so that the controller can be moved to various locations and out of the camera's view?

Is there a lightweight version of a LED moving light that is weatherproof? What do the Rock & Roll folks use for their exterior venues?

For control I'd recommend the ChamSys MagicQ. It runs off a laptop using a USB to 5 pin DMX adaptor. Runs around $100. Since you'd be outside, grab a Pelican case that can fit your laptop and you're set.

You can get DMX cables in nearly any length. 5, 10, 25, 50 are all common lengths though.

As for waterproofing fixtures, I'd go ahead and talk to your rental house about that. They have accessories that depend on the type of fixture you use.
 
For non-laptop based system, you might look at the Elation Show Designer 3. It can control up to 48 individual 32 channel moving heads, and 128 conventionals.


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If you're looking to replace your BFL s on rooftops and such, I'm not sure the MAC 101 will give you the effect you're looking for. In certain applications the VLX could be equivalent to a 2K Fresnel, but that's as bright as LEDs currently get.

...Is there an established way to put breaks in the DMX cables so that the controller can be moved to various locations and out of the camera's view? ...
This sounds like a perfect application for wireless DMX. Here's some threads:
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting-electrics/15969-wireless-dmx-systems.html
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting-electrics/22555-wireless-dmx-options.html
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...22-reliable-but-inexpensive-wireless-dmx.html
 
If you're looking to replace your BFL s on rooftops and such, I'm not sure the MAC 101 will give you the effect you're looking for. In certain applications the VLX could be equivalent to a 2K Fresnel, but that's as bright as LEDs currently get.


This sounds like a perfect application for wireless DMX. Here's some threads:
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting-electrics/15969-wireless-dmx-systems.html
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting-electrics/22555-wireless-dmx-options.html
http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...22-reliable-but-inexpensive-wireless-dmx.html


Or mount an Ion or Element with a wifi router and use the ipod touch app.
 
Or mount an Ion or Element with a wifi router and use the ipod touch app.

That would work for the wireless part, but not as much for being able to move the fixtures easily between camera set-ups (what I assumed the OP wanted).
 
That would work for the wireless part, but not as much for being able to move the fixtures easily between camera set-ups (what I assumed the OP wanted).

I guess i figured 100' of DMX at the fixture would solve that... but wireless DMX would work too
 
Hi, I'm a new member who's been working with lighting in the motion picture / television industry. I'm interested in using some moving LED lights for our night exterior, New York City, street scenes. Often, we rig lights during our daytime pre-lights which are very difficult to access during shooting. Having something like a MAC 101 in these spots would allow us to change the focus remotely as we move from shot to shot. These lamps would not be moving during the scene, we would pan, tilt and dim them between camera set ups. At 8 lbs, the Mac 101 would be easy to rig in some tough spots.

Here are some of my questions:

Is there a way to control these lights in a small portable package? A laptop with software and a MDX interface box could work but I think we would prefer a mini controller if one exists. Is the a small weatherproof controller? If we use a laptop, what software and hardware would you recommend?

Is there an established way to put breaks in the DMX cables so that the controller can be moved to various locations and out of the camera's view?

Is there a lightweight version of a LED moving light that is weatherproof? What do the Rock & Roll folks use for their exterior venues?

Thanks for your help,

John

As a NY based Studio Mechanic and moving light programmer I can reply to your inquery on a number of levels.

#1 Fixture Choice: The 101 is a small moving LED head, very spotty and fast but doesn't have very much punch at all. The 301 would be a better choice though its a tad heavier. It certainly has more pop. If your going for VLXs you might as well get regular moving fixtures. The VL2500 might be a great choice. 700watt lamp and all the bells and whistles. For night work on movies I've mounted multiple LED battens (8 Colorforce 72") on Condors (aerial boom lifts) and Scissor lifts. They produced a ton of f/stop. We recreated the dynamic lighting of Times Square using these setups.

#2 Weather: They all hate weather. Techniques for weather proofing include buiding boxes with clear plastic stretched across them to protect from the rain. I've seen plastic bins inverted over moving fixtures. Drill holes for the mounting hardware and mount the bin so it covers the ML brain. There was a picture posted in a thread on here or over at the lightnetwork. Seemed like it might work for some types of weather. The hard driving horizontal rain might defeat that. On a recent movie we used VL5a and VL6a fixtures from PRG. It poured during the entire load in (filled the bags covering the lights with water!) We just let them air out and fired them up. The remote ballasts of these lights helped keep them operational. They are old though and the racks are large. There are a number of weather proof LED fixtures coming out. The Colorado is IP65 as are a number of newer colorblast like fixtures. Call your rental house and talk to a salesman. They often know of gear like this. Interestingly the original colorblast was IP65.

#3 Control Interface: the cheapest is probably Magic Cue with a Ennetec dongle. You get 1 universe of control and can run off a laptop. Downside is you have to learn the programming language. But that is very doable. Light Factory is another option. Hog PC and GMa on Pc are also usable from laptops however you will need dedicated widgets/Digital Processors to get DMX out of it.

There are no weather proof control systems, but there are tents to put it in. The smallest is either the Magic Q or a Ma Pico. They are, however, dedicated moving light consoles. In terms of moving them around the best is wireless DMX. WDMX or Show DMX. However usually we just have an umbilical that has to be re-run. Put opti splitters at your break point and the DMX in can be run in two different directions and replugged.

Which leads to -

#4 Programmers: The use of moving lights on a movie set really requires a dedicated programmer. Setting up and networking the gear and programming the console for use during shooting is time consuming and requires a unique skill set. You have to know movies and moving lights. Many motion pictures are using the newer technology but it requires putting personel on the job that can do the work. Hanging 4 ML out there in the world off of street lights or balconys isn't that much of a big deal...until it doesn't work when you are in the middle of a setup. Trouble shooting the gear, networking the system, working the console during shooting are, generally, the providence of the Lighting Console Programmer on a movies set. Dropping this gear onto an a standard electrician crew of a movie may very well prove problematic. Adding the vagaries of weather and temperamental equipment and you are setting yourself up for a frustrating night.

E.I. Teddy Read
Read Bros Entrance
 
Thanks for all of the great info. I've got a lot to learn before we bring these lights to the street.

Regards, John
 
IF I had the budget, the moving head LED I'd use would be the Robe 600 LEDWash. Not cheap, but man, it has the output. I haven't seen the Robe 1200 LEDWash in action, but I can only imagine it's even more impressive, and expensive.

What is the height at which these lights will be? Too high and it will rule out all LED's.

Another option worth considering is the Apollo Right Arm. I'm not sure how big the lights are that you are currently using, but perhaps they'll fit. Apollo Design | Right Arm® 2 Granted, you can't remotely control zoom, but pan n tilt ain't bad.

For control, while also not a cheap option, the BEST BOY Pocket Console lives in its own Pelican case. NEW! The BEST BOY™ Pocket Console® DMX with Playback-8™ - $549.99 : Baxter Controls, The Pocket Console DMX(tm) Of course, figures they are currently listed as Sold Out, but something to bookmark for later perhaps.
 

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